Seller missing in action (4 Viewers)

[WedgeRock]

if you can post on X.com you likely could be posting here too.

Communication is always the key in situations like this.

 

[TripleRangeMerger]

Scamming is poor form too lmao

It is beyond poor form to scam. That is not in dispute.

I am saying that I think this is not a good direction to escalate. Does posting this information publicly (rather than as a DM with involved parties) improve the likelihood of a positive resolution? Does it have a plausible advantage over private messaging other than increasing the likelihood of a pile-on/harassment/doxxing by uninvolved parties either now or in the future?

 

[justsomedude]

Too much, IMO

 

[doublebooyah85]

1. Email him at any email you can find
2. Find his address, send him a letter
3. Find a phone number leave him a voicemail and text, even at work imho.

I was in the collection business so I see no reasons why you can’t be reached out to collect what is rightfully owed to you. Would I go knocking at his home or place of work? No. But simple forms of communication totally acceptable.

 

[ChippinUp]

It is beyond poor form to scam. That is not in dispute.

I am saying that I think this is not a good direction to escalate. Does posting this information publicly (rather than as a DM with involved parties) improve the likelihood of a positive resolution? Does it have a plausible advantage over private messaging other than increasing the likelihood of a pile-on/harassment/doxxing by uninvolved parties either now or in the future?

I’m sorry but protecting the interests of someone who willingly took money from another member then goes MIA doesn’t seem like a good direction either.

He has had plenty of time to make this right. It’s clear some members have had good interactions with him but that doesn’t excuse his behaviour in this case. It only takes one misstep to be labelled a scammer.

I think private messages have already been exhausted.

 

[chippitydoodah]

I'm going to repeat that I've had more than one sales interaction and at no point was he working a scam. I've also had basic pm's with Duffy about chips & poker. I wish I had his number to reach out and see if he's OK but I'm in the dark like everyone else.

 

[smashed_potato]

I have also made a purchase from @DuffCal which went smoothly, as expected and months later we also had general chit chat about a particular chip unrelated to the sale.

Thought I’d add this to the conversation as he never came across as a scammer in any way.

 

[ChippinUp]

I don’t think scammer is the right choice of words but the ethics of this member are questionable if he can hold funds without any communication.

Just refund the sale and hope to reconnect with the buyer when life permits. It’s not complicated

 

[doublebooyah85]

I don’t think scammer is the right choice of words but the ethics of this member are questionable if he can hold funds without any communication.

Just refund the sale and hope to reconnect with the buyer when life permits. It’s not complicated

This^ life probably got in the way and avoidance/procrastination is his way of dealing it. Understandable mistake but not ethical.

 

[Rieguy]

Few things can ruin chipping for someone more than being cheated or scammed. Call this situation what you want, but no matter how upstanding the seller/trader is, it sucks and puts a damper on the hobby. Doxxing is meh when it turns out to be a major personal issue (and you should only reach out directly - not through work) but honestly that has turned out to be the case in less than 2% of these instances, typically being "I was overwhelmed" etc. I'd bet on this being fixed, but that's not the part that actually matters.

Dropping an update or message takes twenty damn seconds, yet people (or some vendors) can't be respectful enough to do so to ease a situation. Being a respectful/ethical chipper is not hard, especially when you have been around a very long time.

 

[doublebooyah85]

Few things can ruin chipping for someone more than being cheated or scammed. Call this situation what you want, but no matter how upstanding the seller/trader is, it sucks and puts a damper on the hobby. Doxxing is meh when it turns out to be a major personal issue (and you should only reach out directly - not through work) but honestly that has turned out to be the case in less than 2% of these instances, typically being "I was overwhelmed" etc. I'd bet on this being fixed, but that's not the part that actually matters.

Dropping an update or message takes twenty damn seconds, yet people (or some vendors) can't be respectful enough to do so to ease a situation. Being a respectful/ethical chipper is not hard, especially when you have been around a very long time.

Just out of curiosity why is at work not somewhere you think they should allowed to be communicated to when you owe someone money/product? If they have a phone/email?

Plenty of employees get payroll deduct for bankrupties/child support/etc. Employee can’t hide with other debt obligations etc. To me it’s no safe space lol

 

[BuckMason]

Did everyone who won his auctions back in December / January actually get their chips?

 

[BarrieJ3]

Trying to keep track…so we’re back to scamming or delays being bad, but doxxing being okay.

 

[doublebooyah85]

Trying to keep track…so we’re back to scamming or delays being bad, but doxxing being okay.

View attachment 1657395

I don’t think doxing publicly is okay. Any information about his whereabouts and his contact information should be honestly sent via PM.

 

[Taghkanic]

But in my opinion, if you can post on X.com you likely could be posting here too.

The X posts screenshotted above seem to be from 2009. Has he actually posted recently?

 

[dizzyChipper]

It is beyond poor form to scam. That is not in dispute.

I am saying that I think this is not a good direction to escalate. Does posting this information publicly (rather than as a DM with involved parties) improve the likelihood of a positive resolution? Does it have a plausible advantage over private messaging other than increasing the likelihood of a pile-on/harassment/doxxing by uninvolved parties either now or in the future?

@funaffair isn't escalating. He's asked the community he still trusts for advice on what to do next. Furthermore his call for help/action serves to warn others when the "feedback" system we rely on failed him and it would appear fail others.

One last bump, before I move on from this $500 bad beat
Anyone who has contact details of this person, kindly ping or email, Thank you

I also sent a Venmo request for refund a week ago, no response
One other individual has also confirmed (through DM) they are waiting for a refund

I really hope he is doing alright and based on others comments and history, it's possible he might come back, eventually

Thanks for those who replied.. appreciate it

@funaffair seems patient and mature.

--

We're using the term "doxxing" here but really nobody is mobilizing a massive force of people or machines to harass @DuffCal into submission.
A few reminders from a few people along a few means of communication make it more likely @DuffCal understands the gravity of the situation and it brings chips or money owed to the forefront of his mind.

@BarrieJ3 Please update the scorecard:

Bad:
[X] scamming
[X] delays with no communication or cause
[X} doxxing
[ ] some additional measured communication to resurrect a distracted but not evil member

 

[Taghkanic]

1. Email him at any email you can find
2. Find his address, send him a letter
3. Find a phone number leave him a voicemail and text, even at work imho.

I was in the collection business so I see no reasons why you can’t be reached out to collect what is rightfully owed to you. Would I go knocking at his home or place of work? No. But simple forms of communication totally acceptable.

If someone has taken money for goods or services which were not delivered, and is not responding via DM, I agree that emailing and calling the seller is 100% the buyer’s right.

I mean... Would this even be a question if someone bought a lawn mower or a toaster oven from Facebook Marketplace or wherever? Just because it’s poker chips doesn’t make the seller’s obligations and privacy more or less sacred.

People leave negative feedback without batting an eye for other stuff. I don’t see the OP or others as “doxxing” here, but rather trying to investigate how to be made whole by someone who pocketed their money.

 

[BarrieJ3]

Reaching out to work or others in their life is simply pressure.

It’s up to people to figure out what lines they want to cross and which they don’t. In these events, the person obviously knows, especially once you contact through secondary locations to PCF like twitter, email, etc.

It’s crazy how folks will say this never happens with long term chippers when it is literally happening every other month - and that’s just the ones publicly posted. They’re not only becoming more often - they are for increasingly larger amounts, more people involved, and lasting longer.

It’s crazy that we don’t have useful feedback tool, a forum section specific to these, etc.

You’re telling me a 7 year pcfer vet, and no one has their number? (Btw we could pull it from records in 30 seconds).

It’s not that hard to put 2-3 pcfers together to determine a standard procedure since admins/mods aren’t going to assist. Who knows, they may come up with something as simple as:

Unresolved exchange with no communication at 6 weeks:
1. Post in this thread/area with username. Members with personal contact info encouraged to share with OP privately.
2. Update post with when/how outreach.
3. Update post at 8 weeks and leave negative feedback. No additional posts unless it’s to update with resolution.

Use standardized post titles following template “missing seller/buyer PCFname” so people can use search function to easily see history when double checking before buying/selling to a user since feedback is rarely utilized.

 

[JMC9389]

Reaching out to work or others in their life is simply pressure.

It’s up to people to figure out what lines they want to cross and which they don’t. In these events, the person obviously knows, especially once you contact through secondary locations to PCF like twitter, email, etc.

It’s crazy how folks will say this never happens with long term chippers when it is literally happening every other month - and that’s just the ones publicly posted. They’re not only becoming more often - they are for increasingly larger amounts, more people involved, and lasting longer.

It’s crazy that we don’t have useful feedback tool, a forum section specific to these, etc.

You’re telling me a 7 year pcfer vet, and no one has their number? (Btw we could pull it from records in 30 seconds).

It’s not that hard to put 2-3 pcfers together to determine a standard procedure since admins/mods aren’t going to ever assist. Who knows, they may come up with something as simple as:

Unresolved exchange with no communication at 6 weeks:
1. Post in this thread/area with username. Members with personal contact info encouraged to share with OP.
2. Update post with when/how outreach.
3. Update post at 8 weeks and leave negative feedback. No additional posts unless it’s to update with resolution.

Use standardized post titles following template “missing seller/buyer PCFname” so people can use search function to easily see history when double checking before buying/selling to a user since feedback is rarely utilized.

I'm just so happy I'm mostly done buying. USPS is more of a shit show every day to compound all of this.

 

[ekricket]

Reaching out to work or others in their life is simply pressure.

It’s up to people to figure out what lines they want to cross and which they don’t. In these events, the person obviously knows, especially once you contact through secondary locations to PCF like twitter, email, etc.

It’s crazy how folks will say this never happens with long term chippers when it is literally happening every other month - and that’s just the ones publicly posted. They’re not only becoming more often - they are for increasingly larger amounts, more people involved, and lasting longer.

It’s crazy that we don’t have useful feedback tool, a forum section specific to these, etc.

You’re telling me a 7 year pcfer vet, and no one has their number? (Btw we could pull it from records in 30 seconds).

It’s not that hard to put 2-3 pcfers together to determine a standard procedure since admins/mods aren’t going to assist. Who knows, they may come up with something as simple as:

Unresolved exchange with no communication at 6 weeks:
1. Post in this thread/area with username. Members with personal contact info encouraged to share with OP privately.
2. Update post with when/how outreach.
3. Update post at 8 weeks and leave negative feedback. No additional posts unless it’s to update with resolution.

Use standardized post titles following template “missing seller/buyer PCFname” so people can use search function to easily see history when double checking before buying/selling to a user since feedback is rarely utilized.

 

[BarrieJ3]

 

[ekricket]

 

[Highli99]

Ok - I did something I haven’t done before and left feedback. That is the only recourse I am planning to take. I don’t think @DuffCal is a scammer, but he hasn’t shipped chips me and other people paid for. that could and should be fixed as soon as he is able.

 

[CdnBeerLover]

Looks like his employer’s corporate email format is first initial last name. Could also drop an email to his work inbox in hopes it motivates a response…

View attachment 1657268

I worked in an large organization that did something similar, but had to add additional characters to the name when duplicate names occurred...happened more often that I expected, to be honest. I would be hesitant to contact a work email unless absolutely 100% certain that it is the address for the correct person.

 

[TripleRangeMerger]

@funaffair isn't escalating. He's asked the community he still trusts for advice on what to do next. Furthermore his call for help/action serves to warn others when the "feedback" system we rely on failed him and it would appear fail others.

To be clear, I think @funaffair is has done everything perfectly correctly from what I can see. I am actually very sorry to hear that he is out this money, which is not a trivial sum and an unpleasant experience besides. This thread and all his posts seem more than reasonable, and even patient and mature as you say. Email or DM (ping? unsure) is a perfectly reasonable way to get this contact info as he requested:

One last bump, before I move on from this $500 bad beat
Anyone who has contact details of this person, kindly ping or email, Thank you

If I am raising a question of escalation, it is the unsolicited posting of Duffy's private contact information by other parties in the thread.

I am much newer to the forum than most people posting here and (as you can tell) not very active as a poster or buyer/seller. I think more than anything it was just a bit surprising to me that this could be a punitive forum norm, but maybe I should just update accordingly. I think this situation (and many like it) are also a bit of an artifact of the payment method that leaves you no official recourse.

Hoping everyone in the thread resolves their transactions amicably.

 

[Rieguy]

and leave negative feedback

Ok - I did something I haven’t done before and left feedback. That is the only recourse I am planning to take. I don’t think @DuffCal is a scammer, but he hasn’t shipped chips me and other people paid for. that could and should be fixed as soon as he is able.

Good on you. There are way too many members here with numerous transactions that have 100% Positive Feedback, despite screwing people over for months, not transacting in good faith, and/or not able to successfully complete their end of a deal in a reasonable manner. If only newbies were protected from such people instead of having to know their "poor" reputation despite having flawless feedback.

 

[caballo993]

The X posts screenshotted above seem to be from 2009. Has he actually posted recently?

His last repost would correlate with the time that he last messaged OP.

But looking at the replies, this was posted 2 days ago…

 

[Taghkanic]

I think more than anything it was just a bit surprising to me that this could be a punitive forum norm, but maybe I should just update accordingly.

It’s not a “forum norm.” But neither is leaving buyers hanging and not communicating... but still pocketing their money.

If anything, the norm is to make prompt shipments, provide tracking, and respond to any issues which occasionally crop up, in good faith.

 

[FestiveKnight]

Reaching out to work or others in their life is simply pressure.

It’s up to people to figure out what lines they want to cross and which they don’t. In these events, the person obviously knows, especially once you contact through secondary locations to PCF like twitter, email, etc.

It’s crazy how folks will say this never happens with long term chippers when it is literally happening every other month - and that’s just the ones publicly posted. They’re not only becoming more often - they are for increasingly larger amounts, more people involved, and lasting longer.

It’s crazy that we don’t have useful feedback tool, a forum section specific to these, etc.

You’re telling me a 7 year pcfer vet, and no one has their number? (Btw we could pull it from records in 30 seconds).

It’s not that hard to put 2-3 pcfers together to determine a standard procedure since admins/mods aren’t going to assist. Who knows, they may come up with something as simple as:

Unresolved exchange with no communication at 6 weeks:
1. Post in this thread/area with username. Members with personal contact info encouraged to share with OP privately.
2. Update post with when/how outreach.
3. Update post at 8 weeks and leave negative feedback. No additional posts unless it’s to update with resolution.

Use standardized post titles following template “missing seller/buyer PCFname” so people can use search function to easily see history when double checking before buying/selling to a user since feedback is rarely utilized.

There’s something unique about the speed this community likes to deal at (myself included) which makes the exchanges happen with a lot less process than other forums I’ve seen.

For instance, on speak-easy.club a cigar forum I used to be active on a little. Every member gets a “+” next to their name when they complete a “verification” trade. They have to find an existing vetted member to make a trade with. Newbie has to ship first. Everything gets posted publicly. It’s an opportunity to prove they know the base line of shipping cigars and are timely etc. Totally still scammable but adds a barrier to entry and a precedent of posting public proof of exchanges.

R/pen_swap has by far the best system I’ve seen but this community likes private deals far too much for it. Everyone’s flair keeps track of number of trades and every trade needs to be posted in a monthly confirmation thread. Here are some screenshots.

This type of system eases so many of these concerns. It provides a natural flow for confirming people are transacting as expected and does a lot to set precedents for expectations.

 

[mws2019]

Maybe the forum should require all members should be required to add a contact number, email be available to admins and address to join.