Low Stakes PLO Hand Discussion (2 Viewers)

Kain8 said:
While the check-raise from another player is unlikely, are you really wanting to go to war with top set when you can't get a majority of your stack in beforehand? If you check then re-pot, Hero still has $100 in his stack with around a $40 - $45 pot if called by the cutoff. If a black deuce rolls off on the turn, you can't even get the rest of your stack in.

If you just flat and go heads up, the pot is only $15. Much easier to play as you don't have much invested and you can check/call on any turn.
Click to expand...

And just to add to your reasoning: deception.
 
Kain8 said:
While the check-raise from another player is unlikely, are you really wanting to go to war with top set when you can't get a majority of your stack in beforehand? If you check then re-pot, Hero still has $100 in his stack with around a $40 - $45 pot if called by the cutoff. If a black deuce rolls off on the turn, you can't even get the rest of your stack in.

If you just flat and go heads up, the pot is only $15. Much easier to play as you don't have much invested and you can check/call on any turn.
Click to expand...

That's why raising pre flop would have be advantageous
 
I'd call here as it gives the weaker hands an opportunity to put more dead money into the pot. Lets also plan on betting if the turn somehow misses our 26 scary cards
 
Pot. I don't want the turn to be multiway if possible, and almost guaranteed it will be if just flatting the raise.

I figured the pro wouldn't be able to turn down a steal opportunity when checked around to him. :D
 
ChaosRock said:
$4 not $3, but yeah, the difference of a $1 wouldn't change the calling decision. And as you write it I can see said player saying exactly that: fuck it, I'd pay more to see monkeys fuk, LOL!!!
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I don’t know who you guys are talking about?!? Fortunately for me I only invested 50 cents on a hand with no possibilities so if I remember correctly I folded to whatever Bill did. Also I apologize for my diarrhea of the keypad in my post above I said too much but I still think discussing is very relevant!
 
I was at a quandary here. I was hoping for an early position bet, a re raise, then a pot bet from me. That obviously didn't happen. It checked to Paulo who then threw a four dollar bet out there. I've played really tight for about three hours as stated in the OP due to a few reasons. I was afraid if I threw a pot size bet out there it would fold around. Including Paulo. I'm figuring he bet because it checked around to him. I don't want to win a small pot.

Kain8 said:
Seriously? FIVE other players check this flop to the cutoff? What the hell are they playing? With a late position bet only, you're not trapping any dead money in between you and the initial bettor. Cold call and you can see what the turn brings. You may even get one of the initial checking players to put in your checkraise FOR you. Then you're able to really lower the boom on them.
Click to expand...

I decide to take this line. I'm going to call the four bucks and hope someone does the re raise for me. I figure its unlikely, but I'm willing to gamble that it will happen. If that doesn't happen I'm hoping 4 or 5 other players will call the four bucks. This way if the turn isn't one of the scare cards there will be enough in the pot to make a nice bet on the turn.

I call @ChaosRock bet. It fucking folds all the way to Jim O who I believe is immediately to Paulo's right. Without hesitation Jim makes it 19 bucks, YES!!! Action is on Paulo. He tanks for a few seconds. Looks around, checks me out........Well, I'm guessing he is looking at my stack. Honestly, I thought I was looking pretty damper that night :) Of course I'm hoping for a re raise by Paulo. Then he'll be committed to my pot size bet and we can play for stacks.

When Jim bet. If Paulo folded. I was considering just calling and trying to get a few extra chips from him. Jim is a good player. I don't think he is better than me. Jim is inconsistent in his style of poker, and it isn't by intention lol.

After Paulo tanks for a few minutes, he calls. For some reason I didn't see this happening. I'm not a next level player. I'm sure he has his reasoning's. I expected a raise or a fold.

Action is on me. What do I do?
 
detroitdad said:
I was hoping for an early position bet, a re raise, then a pot bet from me.
Click to expand...

You sorta got that, but not how you expected, so go ahead and pot it.

Candidly, I prefer the pot bet from Jim O. over @ChaosRock. And remember, top set is ahead of both Jim and Paulo here, with a bigger re-draw. Jim's line (and my history with him) tells me he's on a draw, possible a two-way draw, rather than some silly two pair or middle set. You should be driving the action here, even without position.
 
WedgeRock said:
You sorta got that, but not how you expected, so go ahead and pot it.

Candidly, I prefer the pot bet from Jim O. over @ChaosRock. And remember, top set is ahead of both Jim and Paulo here, with a bigger re-draw. Jim's line (and my history with him) tells me he's on a draw, possible a two-way draw, rather than some silly two pair or middle set. You should be driving the action here, even without position.
Click to expand...

I agree with your assessment of Jim. I have seen him do this middle, or even bottom set in PLO. I figured him for a set with a ten'ish high type flush draw.
 
WedgeRock said:
Jim's line (and my history with him) tells me he's on a draw, possible a two-way draw, rather than some silly two pair or middle set. You should be driving the action here, even without position.
Click to expand...

My read of Jim's is a little different than yours Eric. I don't want to give away too much but I think if he has a good draw he bets the flop way, way more often that check/raise the flop. I think he has way more values there than draws. Now, that's doesn't mean I agree with his value range for check/pot on that spot.
 
detroitdad said:
I agree with your assessment of Jim. I have seen him do this middle, or even bottom set in PLO. I figured him for a set with a ten'ish high type flush draw.
Click to expand...

Eric is saying the opposite! He is saying Jim is check/potting with draws often.
 
detroitdad said:
I agree with your assessment of Jim. I have seen him do this middle, or even bottom set in PLO. I figured him for a set with a ten'ish high type flush draw.
Click to expand...
Agreed. I think you and Jim were correct to assume Paulo's bet had alot to do with position. Everyone else just called, so Jim probably figures his vulnerable hand with potential might be good enough to take it down. Hard to put him on much else with a check-pot while you're holding top set.
 
Complete the plan and get it all in!!!

You can’t flat because you are pot committed if you continue with the hand, you’ll be getting too good of a price to fold now.

Plus if other people have flush/straight draws you want them to put their money in now, if you flat and the all flat and you fill up on the turn they are all shutting down.

Get it now and hope they come along too. Embrace the variance. You will have the most equity with a lot of trapped money hopefully.
 
ChaosRock said:
My read of Jim's is a little different than yours Eric. I don't want to give away too much but I think if he has a good draw he bets the flop way, way more often that check/raise the flop. I think he has way more values there than draws. Now, that's doesn't mean I agree with his value range for check/pot on that spot.
Click to expand...

I don't think Jim had a "good draw". His line makes me think he hit the flop, but not super hard, and he didn't want to play multiway for a small pot, thus the check.

I think Jim was hoping for two folds to his $19 bet and would have been happy to take it down there.
 
WedgeRock said:
I don't think Jim had a "good draw". His line makes me think he hit the flop, but not super hard, and he didn't want to play multiway for a small pot.
Click to expand...

See below:

WedgeRock said:
Jim's line (and my history with him) tells me he's on a draw, possible a two-way draw, rather than some silly two pair or middle set.
Click to expand...
 
I love it when a convoluted betting line plan comes together! Now you can rip it in and get your stack in and ride the train to variance / value town.
 
BGinGA said:
Hey, don't confuse the guy by thowing his own quotes at him.... :wow:
Click to expand...

I think Jim connected with the flop. My thought was a draw (straight, flush or both) but not a naked two pair or middle/bottom set. I'd agree with Bill that it could've been middle set with a ten-high flush draw.

I think Jim was vulnerable and wanted to end the hand right there. That's easier to conclude knowing Bill held top set.

So let's get to it:

bet-pot.jpg
 
Last edited:
Hero starts the hand with $120. I am too lazy to work out the exact pot size but Hero can get most of his stack in the middle by repotting - let's say ~$80 of his $120 stack. This will pot commit Hero's last $40. Not just for hero but it also means everyone left in the hand will call the last $40. It all goes in on the turn.

Hero is going to need to dodge a pile of outs. (I expect the villains can fold middle or bottom set to Hero's long delayed raise, if not then Hero has that villain drawing to one out.) Not a sure thing but clearly +ev. Lots of action to get a mountain of chips in the pot as maybe a 60/40 favorite.

Normal hand for PLO -=- DrStrange
 
WedgeRock said:
I think Jim connected with the flop. My thought was a draw (straight, flush or both) but not a naked two pair or middle/bottom set. I'd agree with Bill that it could've been middle set with a ten-high flush draw.

I think Jim was vulnerable and wanted to end the hand right there. That's easier to conclude knowing Bill held top set.

So let's get to it:

bet-pot.jpg
Click to expand...
Yes! Saucepan!
 
Lets get on with it. Its pretty clear what I'm going to do. This is the situation I've been waiting for. Due to my decisions pre flop I've had to wait a little longer for it to possibly happen.

I rarely say the words "pot". I don't know why. I say "bet", and I move my stack in front of my cards, towards the middle of the pot. One of the math guys, maybe Paulo, maybe Kris spits out how much it actually is. I ignore them.

Action is on Jim. He mutters something about how he doesn't know if he can fold this or not. This usually means he is folding. Not always, but usually. After a short delay he folds.

Action is on @ChaosRock He goes into the tank. I can't hear exactly what he is saying. I think he mumbles something about a set of aces. I'm not really sure.

Instead of sharing what Paulo did. If he wants. I will let him take over from here? If not, I'll post his action.

B
 

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