Copag vs Kem vs Modiano Da Vinci (2 Viewers)

[Coyote]

I am no expert, so I can only write my personal impression of those few brands I have handled for what it's worth (talking about fully plastic cards, of course).

Best in feel and endurance were the old KEMs, a beautiful Seville set of 2 decks which started collapsing (literally) only after 20 years, and otherwise looking as new!
I have no opinion about current KEMs, i.e, whether they justify their price or not. The old ones did!

On the European continent, Modianos seem to be the cheapest if not the safest bet, at just $3 for a fully plastic deck (I 've read horror stories in this forum about the company, but I never faced a serious problem personally). They are Ok at this price, not having to cross the Atlantic and have duties etc imposed on them.

Dal Negros are better and my preference in that price range.

Fourniers are excellent, but the last Titanium-series single deck I found here was priced $17 - maybe not the producing company's fault - I don't know.

Copags are somewhat pricey in Europe (around 8-10) , for a product which may not be top, but otherwise they feel fine to me - I can't understand the hatred against them.
I forgot to mention that once I went 4-index I never looked back, and I 'm afraid this is going to happen again now, with going 4-color.
Coincidentally, Copags were the only 4-index 4-color ones that I found available locally, so my last purchase were these. I am not a fan of their colors, especially the 'blue", but, on the other hand, I didn't pay a KEM or Fournier price.

 

[AceFour]

Copaq dropped down on my list because they were easy to crease in the last year batch I got. I had to switch Davinci's during a game when a player flipped a card and accidently folded it. Week later the Davinci card came back to shape and there was no noticeable difference with any other cards. Copaq's did not heal and went to the trash can.

 

[Old State]

I have a card buying problem. I own a sample of almost every brand always searching perfection. Since I HEAVILY prefer bridge size and regular index, I am sometimes limited.

My favorites:

1) Kem - the undisputed heavyweight champs and gold standard in the “feel” department. Almost luxurious in feel. Second best in looks. Old vs new is a myth.
2) Desjgn - the undisputed heavyweight champs in the “looks” department. Second best in feel
3) Prestige/Fournier. Used to be best over all value. Good feel and ok looks. Can’t find them easily in the US
3) Cartamundi Acetates Casino - tied for 3rd. Need to care for them like Kems
4) Copag - durability issues and ugly artwork
5) Modiano/DaVinci - they are the same in my samples. A bit too thick and plastic feeling for me.
6) Gemaco - too thick and extremely ugly

I have others but they don’t seem common enough here to warrant listing. Waiting to buy some Faded Spade though that artwork isn’t my taste

Beauty and the Beast...see pics...beauty on the bottom of course

 

[DMack]

@Old State knows his cards. His preferences are very in line with mine. Definitely the top two.

 

[upNdown]

Yeah I'd have to answer none of the above as well. If forced to pick one, it would have to be davinci because they're cheap and they feel halfway decent. Kems feel great but they're stupid expensive and they warp. Copag's are playable in my mind, but way too expensive for their quality.

I'd recommend the following:
desJgn is easily my favorite, but since they're not always produced by the same manufacturer, I think I'd prefer to evaluate them on a release by release basis, rather than proclaim them the greatest card company now and forever.
Piatnik is my second favorite, but they're mucho hard to find and often stupid expensive when you do find them.
Bicycle prestige and fournier are 3A and 3B for me, and that is the end of the list of plastic cards I'd recommend.

 

[Old State]

I'd recommend the following:
desJgn is easily my favorite, but since they're not always produced by the same manufacturer, I think I'd prefer to evaluate them on a release by release basis, rather than proclaim them the greatest card company now and forever..

I should have pointed out that Desjgns are of different manufacturers, but I would still rank them second in feel considering all the card stocks they used. I have samples of the Modiano stock and it is thinner and more flexible than the Modiano and DaVinci branded cards I have. So I assume Desjgn had a pick of several stocks. The culture stock was great too. Had a slicker feel. Close to Cartamundi.

As for Kem costs, I just don’t get how they are SO expensive. You can easily find them for ~ $23 shipped from Amazon. That’s very close to what I paid for Desjgn (shipped), Guilds (which I suspect are Modianos), and Fourniers in the US. To me “stupid expensive” would mean $30-40. $2-3 difference for two deck setup doesn’t seem that crazy.

I paid more for Gemaco Superflex than I ever paid for Kems and Superflex suck in comparison. Mine even bowed a bit

https://www.amazon.com/Arrow-Standard-Index-Playing-Cards/dp/B000T61ZY0?th=1&psc=1

Now this is stupid expensive. I don’t know where people are finding Fournier cards cheap in the US...especially bridge sized

https://www.amazon.com/Fournier-Bri...tcorr&keywords=fournier+playing+cards+plastic

 

[wgicon]

Cards were my first love before chips, and like so many things people have their own preferences. That being said, you would think thickness would be less up for debate; I have to disagree that Gemaco's are too thick. Gemaco Superflex and Fournier are my top two. I don't see the big deal about Desjgn unless you're really into a unique design; I put them the middle of the pack along with Cartamundi, Del Negro, and Copag (I don't think Copag's are that bad). Modiano's are bottom of the barrel in my opinion. Too think and I just don't like the feel. KEMs aren't bad but I don't get the hype with them.

 

[Steppenwolf]

Wow, you guys are all over this one! I think will have to take a closer look at some other brands that I'm not familiar with. Thanks.

 

[IaHawk]

I've had a set of Copags for over 10 years, they have been great but I'm open to try some others out. It's been so long since I've looked at cards, the only ones I was aware of were Copag and KEM.

 

[stafil]

I don't care for Copag, Kems are nice but overpriced, Modiano should not be considered on principle

I am out of the loop, what’s the story with Modiano?

 

[CdnBeerLover]

I am out of the loop, what’s the story with Modiano?

They manufactured cards for Desjgn. When issues with the card backs were discovered, they refused to acknowledge the problem. Desjgn corrected the issue for their customers, but the lack of support provided by Modiano is a problem.

More information can be found at https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/bridge-jumbo-index-issue.24936/.

 

[stafil]

Just my anecdotal story, but I bought some KEM together with some cheap Royal about 10 years ago and forgot about them in my parents house.

Last year I found them again and all KEM where wrapped, but the Royal were as good as new.

 

[graystown]

In my experience KEM and Designs. Although every deck I have played with, regardless of manufacture, do show their wear.

 

[Old State]

If you want to try Kems and like jumbo index bridge sized, this is the cheapest I’ve ever seen. Actually I think this is a mistake.
https://www.amazon.com/Springbok-Pa...9MGV6Y1WH3G7&refRID=PGAWXTSA9MGV6Y1WH3G7&th=1

 

[RocAFella1]

If you want to try Kems and like jumbo index bridge sized, this us the cheapest I’ve ever seen. Actually I think this is a mistake.
https://www.amazon.com/Springbok-Pa...9MGV6Y1WH3G7&refRID=PGAWXTSA9MGV6Y1WH3G7&th=1

Wow great deal, I just bought 2 setups even though it isn't my favorite back design and I'm not particularly fond of the KEM jumbo index. Thanks!

 

[Old State]

I just bought one...and I really don’t like their jumbo index. I also just posted a thread for these. I think this may be a pricing mistake so people should jump on it. Amazon does that once in a while. Ten years ago I got a $400 radar detector for $239.42. When it came there was a note saying the price was listed wrong but they honored it.

Hopefully they aren’t fake or something. Says they are coming from Amazon so they should back it.

 

[Potsie1]

If you want to try Kems and like jumbo index bridge sized, this is the cheapest I’ve ever seen. Actually I think this is a mistake.
https://www.amazon.com/Springbok-Pa...9MGV6Y1WH3G7&refRID=PGAWXTSA9MGV6Y1WH3G7&th=1

Ummm wow. Ordered!

 

[stafil]

Ummm wow. Ordered!

Same here! They must be wondering why the spike in orders!

 

[RocAFella1]

Looks like the price just jumped up a little to $14.87

 

[stafil]

Looks like the price just jumped up a little to $14.87

Algorithmic pricing I guess..?

 

[Old State]

Looks like the price just jumped up a little to $14.87

That’s crazy.

 

[smsguy927]

@Old State I just ordered two setups. Thanks!

 

[DerberAlter]

Very disapointed with my last modiano, after 15-20 games cards started to be deformed.

same here. started to bend in one direction after 4-5 games

 

[Potsie1]

Now it's at 16.32. Lol.

 

[RocAFella1]

 

[Balanar]

Ordered a setup even though I dislike jumbo index

 

[Coyote]

Update, one year later:
The 4-color Copags didn't stick on the long run with my crew, who claimed the blue diamonds can be confusingly seen as black when peeped (low lighting). They (the cards) also are the most slippery of all brands I 've tried.

No problem with Modianos personally. They 're the only brand to regularly offer poker size, 4 or 2 jumbo index fully plastic decks at ridiculously low prices here.
I tried the Platinum Acetate, their top product. Excellent feel, but somewhat pricey at 25E per setup - and available only with 2 indexes, jumbo or normal (which I know isn't an issue at all in the Americas).

Biggest revelation feel-wise have been the Piatniks. Best feel over any other brand, IMO. I have used the "full plastic - economy" type 1362 (poker size, 4 normal index).
Very hard to find any type of their range regularly at reasonable prices on the 'net or anywhere. The arrival of new Austrian members and an Austrian vendor member should fix that.

 

[longflop]

$17.06, still a great price. I have had my current KEM setup for a year and following @Old State's storage tips, still straight as an arrow. IN MY OPINION, you just can't beat the KEM feel and shuffle.

 

[clapton77]

Thanks for the heads up @Old State ! 2 setups ordered.

 

[Poker4ever]

I've had a set of Copags for over 10 years, they have been great but I'm open to try some others out. It's been so long since I've looked at cards, the only ones I was aware of were Copag and KEM.

Same here bro. Only played with these two. Love copag and their 4 color decks. Don't see kem being worth twice copag. I will try the desjgn since everybody's raving about it.