Poker Zombie
Royal Flush
...soooooo, slightly less than what you will eventually spend on chips because of this site.
When did this community become so ??? (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter stocky
- Start date
...soooooo, slightly less than what you will eventually spend on chips because of this site.
MaxB
Full House
the more I stare at those $10's, the more I really like them. However those black $20's are really nice (y) :thumbsup:
Shaggy
Full House
Mmmmm... yummy leaded goodness.
superchromix
Full House
I’m working on an addition to this set...
Shaggy
Full House
Very cool, those are like the prim and polished cousins to my roundy, dirty, Cali Bells.
Mr Tree
Straight Flush
The $5 is volcanic. The theme is spot on for the set as well.
I need to take some better pics of the whole family
Previous sets I miss:
Previous sets I miss:
gopherblue
Straight Flush
Nothing to see here.
I'm doing a little reorganization, and decided to snap a quickie in the spirit of this thread.
Meddler2
Full House
A shout out to both the Faux Clay and Boat Chip nations. Chip nerds on the opppsite ends of the spectrum.
p.s. pleasant surprise finding 1000 mint paulsons...long forgotten
p.s. pleasant surprise finding 1000 mint paulsons...long forgotten
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What are those 3 racks of purples above the brown solids?
crussader
Flush
great relabels on the twenties !
Mike mac
4 of a Kind
Those 25$ are prob the prettiest chips I ever winked @
superchromix
Full House
With this post, I'm going to wrap up some thoughts on this topic. Please excuse the interruption of all the great pr0n.
My first post in this thread was in response to @Poker Zombie, who had written this:
My response, in hindsight, was too strong. This is what I posted, wanting to counterbalance the message from @Poker Zombie, providing a sense of the picture from the other side:
OK, this captures some of the anger felt in the immediate aftermath of the GB. It's not completely fair, however. I am going to break down this statement below.
1. "New members were lied to": New members weren't necessarily lied to, but anyone reading this forum in 2016 and 2017 would certainly have understood that new Paulson chips could not be purchased from GPI, and that any attempt at a group buy would be impossible. These ideas were supported by senior members who were actually part of the GB, and in the process of purchasing new Paulson chips. That particular point sticks in the craw, so to say.
In an earlier post I mentioned to @BGinGA that I personally hold his words in high regard since I have learned so much in this hobby directly from him. Based on the information I had read, I did in fact purchase large numbers of chips that I would not have, had I known what was going on behind the scenes. It's not just about the money, however, but the sense that a group of trusted members pulled the wool over the eyes of the rest of the group, so to speak.
2. "People who spent fortunes on used chips lost money": Several people have asked for "proof" of this statement (@gopherblue). Asking for that is unnecessary, because it's clearly not possible to prove or disprove possible future gains or losses in a market that fluctuates unpredictably. Basic economics does stipulate that adding to supply pushes prices lower, but this is a general rule rather than something which can be applied to specific cases.
The reason I wrote this is because it is, in general, true that had the GB not happened, the market for Paulson chips would be different than it is today. Members who were informed about the GB had a chance to try to anticipate the effects of the GB, while members who were in the dark did not. Thus, the GB put a certain amount of financial risk on non-GB members.
3. "some people inside the group buy made fortunes reselling chips": This is true, and no-one argues with it. It's an unfortunate side effect of the GB that some members who were included were able to make dramatic profits. This accentuated the discontent felt by members, also in relation to point #2 above.
4. "It wasn't a matter of jealousy. It was a matter of broken trust.": Sure, some people were jealous, but I think the majority of the members who were unhappy felt let down by the group buy, due to broken trust. A common refrain was "I can't believe you didn't tell me / include me", especially from long-time, old-school members who had given so much to the community over many years.
5. "Group buy members are often blind to that point.": The final point has to do with the way some GB members reacted. In general the reaction from the GBers was defensive. It seemed that despite the obvious strife that the GB led to, many GBers simply couldn't see what the problem was. Admittedly, the reaction of some non-GB members was also not great.
OK, so I hope this explains the intention behind my original post. I admit it was too strongly worded, and it could be seen as inflammatory. The underlying points, however, are there, and I wanted to make them. In a response in the thread, @BGinGA wrote the following:
I'm glad to see you agree there's an aspect of the GB that could have been done better. It's good to hear that GB members do realize that the GB caused some problems for the community, despite all of the chips that were produced.
@BGinGA also wrote this:
I don't really think it's necessary to go through all of the old posts to produce evidence of points #1, 2, and 3. On point #1 I had previously sent you a link to an example via PM. On point #2 as we said this is impossible to prove or disprove for specific cases. On point #3 it's not necessary because there are so many examples as for it to be obvious.
In conclusion, for some the group buy might have been a cause for celebration as @Poker Zombie said in his post. If everyone on PCF had benefited from it in the same way, is certainly would have been. In my own opinion, however, the cost was too high. For various reasons, as a result of the GB we lost trust between friends, and we lost great members who left the community and did not return. Hundreds of thousands of mint Paulson and Bud Jones chips are not worth that cost, in my opinion.
I didn't intend this thread to turn into a debate on the GB - I simply wanted to make a counterpoint to @Poker Zombie. Nevertheless it's all in the past, and it's time to move on from the topic. Let's have some more pr0n.
My first post in this thread was in response to @Poker Zombie, who had written this:
My response, in hindsight, was too strong. This is what I posted, wanting to counterbalance the message from @Poker Zombie, providing a sense of the picture from the other side:
OK, this captures some of the anger felt in the immediate aftermath of the GB. It's not completely fair, however. I am going to break down this statement below.
1. "New members were lied to": New members weren't necessarily lied to, but anyone reading this forum in 2016 and 2017 would certainly have understood that new Paulson chips could not be purchased from GPI, and that any attempt at a group buy would be impossible. These ideas were supported by senior members who were actually part of the GB, and in the process of purchasing new Paulson chips. That particular point sticks in the craw, so to say.
In an earlier post I mentioned to @BGinGA that I personally hold his words in high regard since I have learned so much in this hobby directly from him. Based on the information I had read, I did in fact purchase large numbers of chips that I would not have, had I known what was going on behind the scenes. It's not just about the money, however, but the sense that a group of trusted members pulled the wool over the eyes of the rest of the group, so to speak.
2. "People who spent fortunes on used chips lost money": Several people have asked for "proof" of this statement (@gopherblue). Asking for that is unnecessary, because it's clearly not possible to prove or disprove possible future gains or losses in a market that fluctuates unpredictably. Basic economics does stipulate that adding to supply pushes prices lower, but this is a general rule rather than something which can be applied to specific cases.
The reason I wrote this is because it is, in general, true that had the GB not happened, the market for Paulson chips would be different than it is today. Members who were informed about the GB had a chance to try to anticipate the effects of the GB, while members who were in the dark did not. Thus, the GB put a certain amount of financial risk on non-GB members.
3. "some people inside the group buy made fortunes reselling chips": This is true, and no-one argues with it. It's an unfortunate side effect of the GB that some members who were included were able to make dramatic profits. This accentuated the discontent felt by members, also in relation to point #2 above.
4. "It wasn't a matter of jealousy. It was a matter of broken trust.": Sure, some people were jealous, but I think the majority of the members who were unhappy felt let down by the group buy, due to broken trust. A common refrain was "I can't believe you didn't tell me / include me", especially from long-time, old-school members who had given so much to the community over many years.
5. "Group buy members are often blind to that point.": The final point has to do with the way some GB members reacted. In general the reaction from the GBers was defensive. It seemed that despite the obvious strife that the GB led to, many GBers simply couldn't see what the problem was. Admittedly, the reaction of some non-GB members was also not great.
OK, so I hope this explains the intention behind my original post. I admit it was too strongly worded, and it could be seen as inflammatory. The underlying points, however, are there, and I wanted to make them. In a response in the thread, @BGinGA wrote the following:
I'm glad to see you agree there's an aspect of the GB that could have been done better. It's good to hear that GB members do realize that the GB caused some problems for the community, despite all of the chips that were produced.
@BGinGA also wrote this:
I don't really think it's necessary to go through all of the old posts to produce evidence of points #1, 2, and 3. On point #1 I had previously sent you a link to an example via PM. On point #2 as we said this is impossible to prove or disprove for specific cases. On point #3 it's not necessary because there are so many examples as for it to be obvious.
In conclusion, for some the group buy might have been a cause for celebration as @Poker Zombie said in his post. If everyone on PCF had benefited from it in the same way, is certainly would have been. In my own opinion, however, the cost was too high. For various reasons, as a result of the GB we lost trust between friends, and we lost great members who left the community and did not return. Hundreds of thousands of mint Paulson and Bud Jones chips are not worth that cost, in my opinion.
I didn't intend this thread to turn into a debate on the GB - I simply wanted to make a counterpoint to @Poker Zombie. Nevertheless it's all in the past, and it's time to move on from the topic. Let's have some more pr0n.
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don't worry about it
I regret not buying those King's $1's when I had the chance yesterday - beautiful chips
Poker Zombie
Royal Flush
There were nearly 50 members involved with the private venture. How many of them lied to you? Were there 50 posts? 10 posts? Maybe 1? If there is a very small percent of "bad apples", why blame the members of the Star Cruises, when you can just hate on one guy. And that one guy is right - you can't get custom chips from GPI. Most of the members of the buy did not get input on what the chips looked like. However, if you want to form a small corporation you can get an order from GPI.
There was far more risk on the members of the private venture than you think. When someone from Africa contacts you asking you to please send $100,000 and then some people in Mexico will send you chips, does that send up a red flag? When the money has been sent, and someone tells you they are contacting GPI to claim the chips are being made to commit fraud, do you worry? When threats of legal action are being brought up do you have concerns?
There was a ton of risk being taken. Some PCFers were invited in, and chose to stay out because of the risk. Fluctuations in market prices were temporary. Influx of Star chips have no more effect on prices than 2018 baseball cards have on 2017 baseball cards.
I may be naive, but I never expected these chips to sell for what they did. I bought mostly sample sets. If it was so obvious that I could make a fortune, I dare think I would have bought more. I really thought the price for Star chips would have gone for about the same as Towanka chips... of course, there was considerable risk.
Meanwhile, TCR was selling Towanka chips. For a profit. Yet we (rightfully) love him for bringing new chips to the market. Sadly, Jim was viciously attacked by people that wanted chips but couldn't because they sold out. So then he started going to eBay, where people are just happy to get chips.
If someone says "you must keep this secret", what do you do? Post the secret publicly or maintain your word? My word is my most valuable resource. If I give my word, I will not break it. How serious? The first time I got the Star chips in action, was heads-up vs Mrs Zombie.
I did not lie.
I did not sell chips, nor did I change my buying habits in any way.
I was brow-beaten, and told to stay off the Chip Donkey forum. And why? Because I divulged as much information as I could about what happened. I thought I was the good-guy, but I was villainized. For that reason, a fair number of the participants in the private venture never came forward. No pics, no stories, nothing.
There's a lot of great information and some epic pr0n out there, but until the attacks stop it will never go public.
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n0m1n4l
Pair
I had no part in the GB, Corp, or whatever it was, although anyone, and I really mean anyone, that feels slighted by another member needs a serious lesson in economics and general reality check. Do these people wake up daily and complain that Ferrari's are over priced and even if they had the means to afford one, Ferrari Corp would review "status", prior car history, and if no history of used performance/exotics or used a Ferarri, good luck ordering a new one unless your an up and coming teenage pop music star.
Being somewhat new to the forum, the boat chips are cool, look awesome, specifically the cash AS chips, although the price point made me decide that I would collect other chips instead, at some point I may put out a feeler for a small cash set of AS chips.
The PCF site is great, the owner and moderators seem to do a (most likely) thankless job for the efforts they invest. I enjoy looking at other peoples chips, conversing, and provides great insight to custom chips I may make some day. You will only get from the site what you desire, be that heartache or pleasure.
Being somewhat new to the forum, the boat chips are cool, look awesome, specifically the cash AS chips, although the price point made me decide that I would collect other chips instead, at some point I may put out a feeler for a small cash set of AS chips.
The PCF site is great, the owner and moderators seem to do a (most likely) thankless job for the efforts they invest. I enjoy looking at other peoples chips, conversing, and provides great insight to custom chips I may make some day. You will only get from the site what you desire, be that heartache or pleasure.
Mike mac
4 of a Kind
I really love these chips - just wish they were brighter colors and labeled for cash game !!
I have nothing to add to this thread except this
n0m1n4l
Pair
That polymer case is sweet, what brand? where did you get it?
It is coming....
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n0m1n4l
Pair
A pistol case ... figures ... perfection ;-)
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