Play A Hand From The S@P III Main Event - QQ (1 Viewer)

[bergs]

Well, you've already come this far. Flat it and get the likely bad news.

 

[Chippy McChiperson]

Well, you've already come this far. Flat it and get the likely bad news.

I disagree, why throw good money after bad? Think it's an easy fold.

 

[bergs]

I disagree, why throw good money after bad? Think it's an easy fold.

Yeah, you're right, I just don't know why we called turn for 1K if we're not also calling a 1/3 pot bet on the absolute brick river. If we thought we were good on the turn, we're certainly good here. If we called to try to spike a draw on the river (and I'm not sure what draw we think will beat villain) than it's an easy fold. If we called because we had 9 crown and gingers before the tourney started and Guinness is screaming at us to get to the cash game table, then this is an easy re-raise jam.

 

[Mr Tree]

I've got .02 to add after the resolution of this one is revealed. Villain is the best player among my locals and is someone I have sparred with a ton over the last decade. I watched this hand with great interest because I had a very good feel for exactly what he was doing and why he was doing it. And part of it preflop involved a player not named Anthony Martino.

 

[JoseRijo]

Yeah, you're right, I just don't know why we called turn for 1K if we're not also calling a 1/3 pot bet on the absolute brick river.

Um... because we had a straight draw?

 

[bergs]

Um... because we had a straight draw?

Really likely that a straight isn't good here when the board pairs.

 

[Anthony Martino]

Alright, here is some additional information regarding my thought process on each street:



PRE-FLOP ACTION: Blinds are 300/600 and Hero is sitting on roughly 32 bigs with a stack of 19,000 from his starting 25K. Folds to Hero sitting UTG+2. Blinds are 300/600 and Hero looks down at Hero recently lost with his Ace-high flush against the gutshot rivered straight flush and the BB just made a joke at Hero's expense.

Action is on Hero and he looks at DNeyer (who made the joke) and remarks "oh, it's your blind? raise" and makes it 1,500 (2.5x the BB)

Next player to act, Jamie, barely min re-raises to 2,500 total. Folds to Hero

Pot: 4,900
Hero's remaining stack: 17,500
Villians stack: 33K

Hero calls 1K


THOUGHT PROCESS: Hero feels that with a starting stack of 32 bigs he's too deep to commit everything pre with this holding, although initially it did cross Hero's mind. Considering that Hero had recently taken a pretty sick beat and just verbalized that he was raising after he noticed the guy who made the joke was in the BB, it was possible that Villain was reraising to isolate with position, figuring Hero to be weaker than QQ here.



FLOP:


Hero is first to act, Hero checks. Villian checks.

THOUGHT PROCESS: Hero is OOP against a board that could've hit Villains range and doesn't have the betting lead, check just felt like the best play all around.



TURN:

(pot 5,900)
Hero's stack: 16,500
Villains stack: 33k

Hero checks. Villain bets 1,000. Hero calls 1K

THOUGHT PROCESS: Villain checked the flop and is now betting 1K into a roughly 6K pot??? Seems super weak, like Villain might be on a hand like 99 and isn't really sure what to do, and feels like he has to bet something to win. I figured I couldn't raise because if he is doing this with 99 he's folding, and if he's got a monster I'm getting looked up.



RIVER:

Pot: 7,900
Hero's Stack: 15,500
Villains Stack: 32K

Hero checks, Villain bets 4K, Hero calls 4K

THOUGHT PROCESS: Hero was torn here, figuring Villain could either be holding AK and comfortable with betting it given the way the hand had played out, or might be betting a pair like 9's figuring it's the only way to win. Hero wasn't confident he would win at showdown, but thought there was a chance his hand was good at showdown, and figured the information on Villains odd min re-raise pre and super small turn bet would be worth the price.



Any guesses on what Villains hand was?

 

[jbutler]

Folding turn, folding river.

 

[Anthony Martino]

Folding turn

You fold getting 6.9 to 1 on a call? We need to win like 12.6% of that time for the call to be profitable........ and folding to a 1K bet into a 5900 pot seems like it invites us to be exploited later

 

[jbutler]

You fold getting 6.9 to 1 on a call? We need to win like 12.6% of that time for the call to be profitable........ and folding to a 1K bet into a 5900 pot seems like it invites us to be exploited later

I don't worry about being exploited when the situation in which the exploiting might happen is unlikely to ever occur. There's no need to balance your turn-calling-after-being-3-bet-preflop-and-seeing-a-nightmare-flop range versus an out of town player you're never likely to see again.

 

[JoseRijo]

Villain is checking flop and min-betting turn with KK or JJ? That's beyond horrible.

I think you played it fine, Anthony (at least post-flop). The river seems like a close decision.

 

[bergs]

The 1K bet on the turn felt like a fishhook bet (let's dangle this tasty worm in front of you and get you to bite). Sort of a polarized bet sizing. I still think he has JJ-AA here (with QQ obviously an incredibly low probability because you hold two of them but still possible). At best you're chopping. If he wanted to turn his hand into a bluff he did it in a fairly horrible way.

 

[jbutler]

Villain is checking flop and min-betting turn with KK or JJ? That's beyond horrible.

I think you played it fine, Anthony (at least post-flop). The river seems like a close decision.

I don't mean to come down on the turn call. Obviously it's no giant error (if it's an error at all) given the size of the bet.

 

[ssanel54]

The 1K bet on the turn felt like a fishhook bet (let's dangle this tasty worm in front of you and get you to bite). Sort of a polarized bet sizing. I still think he has JJ-AA here (with QQ obviously an incredibly low probability because you hold two of them but still possible). At best you're chopping. If he wanted to turn his hand into a bluff he did it in a fairly horrible way.

The weird min raise Pre flop makes me think JJ and rule out QQ-AA, and I agree with the 1000 turn bet looking like a big fish hook.

I don't think Hero does anything wrong calling turn. I probably call the river too just to see his cards and muck if I'm beat.

 

[Anthony Martino]

So, guesses on Villains specific hand at showdown?

 

[ssanel54]

22

 

[jbutler]

23

 

[stocky]

24

 

[Ronoh]

25

 

[stocky]

Oops thought we were counting.

 

[bergs]

JJ-AA, you are crushed.

 

[Anthony Martino]

RIVER:

Pot: 7,900
Hero's Stack: 15,500
Villains Stack: 32K

Hero checks, Villain bets 4K, Hero calls 4K

Villain flips over AQ for broadway and remarks he wasn't sure he was going to call if I had shoved the turn or river.

 

[stocky]

RIVER:

Pot: 7,900
Hero's Stack: 15,500
Villains Stack: 32K

Hero checks, Villain bets 4K, Hero calls 4K

Villain flips over AQ for broadway and remarks he wasn't sure he was going to call if I had shoved the turn or river.

Shove pre probably gets him off his hand after he raises, but otherwise personally I can't fault your play to much. I'm sure I would've played it pretty much the same.

 

[bergs]

I didn't put AQ in his range, but the stuff I did have in his range had you just as crushed. I think your only mistake was calling the river. For 1K I probably call the turn just to see if I can spike a Q on the river and put myself in a nearly impossible spot

 

[Chippy McChiperson]

Yeah, turn bet is so small I don't blame you, but I think the river fold would have been the right play. Also, I don't think 32bbs is too deep to shove over a three bet with queens. There are many hands you have beat that could call you, even by a solid player. JJ, TT, maybe nines, maybe eights, AK, maybe AQ.

 

[Anthony Martino]

Yeah, turn bet is so small I don't blame you, but I think the river fold would have been the right play. Also, I don't think 32bbs is too deep to shove over a three bet with queens. There are many hands you have beat that could call you, even by a solid player. JJ, TT, maybe nines, maybe eights, AK, maybe AQ.

It was just such a goofy spot because he hadn't really done anything like that previously. So I wasn't sure if his barely min-re-raise meant he had a monster he was trying to induce action from (like Steven had done with me when I bet the Ace-high flush on the river and he barely min-raised that with the gutshot straight flush) or if he had ATC and just figured I was up to no good since I had lost that big hand recently and verbalized that I was punishing Dneyer for the joke since it was his BB.

 

[Chippy McChiperson]

The table talk probably didn't matter. I always say I'm on tilt when I pick up a big hand and raise after just losing one. It's just that you're risking a fourth of your stack in a spot you are most likely crushed. In a cash game, different story, but in a non rebuy tourney I think making the nitty fold is the right play.