Tourney How to create a tournament structure? (1 Viewer)

[Coyote]

Nobody would ever opt for the following weird T25K starting stack if ordering -let alone designing- a new set, but the question is if it would be playable at all, when you try to put together a set from bits and pieces and still want to spread two full tables if needed (so 20x):
6xT50
7xT100
6xT500
6xT1000
3xT5000 plus 2 for color-up everything
xT25000s for rebuys / add-ons (whole stack in one chip)

 

[BGinGA]

^^ Certainly useable, but I wouldn't define it as playable, or enjoyable.

 

[Coyote]

Definition of playable vs useable? (not really enjoyable, for sure)

 

[BGinGA]

Definition of playable vs useable? (not really enjoyable, for sure)

Well, you can use all chips of a single denomination to run a tournament, so it's certainly useable, but I wouldn't call it playable.

Imo, useable would be a breakdown that is far from optimum -- it could be used, but wouldn't be very playable.. A playable set would be one with an optimum or close to optimum breakdown of denominations needed for a given event (or events) to run smoothly and efficiently.

 

[andy699669]

Is something like this acceptable?
25/50
25/75
50/100
75/150
25 Chips OFF
100/200
100/300
200/400
...
and so on.
The stage-to-stage transition rate would be still 40% average.

 

[SixSpeedFury]

100/300? Or did you mean 150/300?

 

[andy699669]

100/300? Or did you mean 150/300?

Also usable for 100-base tournaments. Just ignore the first four stages.

 

[JustinInMN]

Is something like this acceptable?
25/50
25/75
50/100
75/150
25 Chips OFF
100/200
100/300
200/400
...
and so on.
The stage-to-stage transition rate would be still 40% average.

100/300? Or did you mean 150/300?

Personally I would do a 150-300 level and hold off on removing the 25s until 200-400.

 

[BGinGA]

Is something like this acceptable?
25/50
25/75
50/100
75/150
25 Chips OFF
100/200
100/300
200/400
...
and so on.
The stage-to-stage transition rate would be still 40% average.

Personally I would do a 150-300 level and hold off on removing the 25s until 200-400.

^^ Same here. A 50% and 33% increase is better than 25% and 50% imo. No need to alter the normal 33%/50% progression unless absolutely necessary, especially when you already have the needed chips in play.

 

[Old State]

Whatever structure you choose make sure you are able to remove chips every 3-4 levels. Having small denominations hanging around to satisfy odd blinds is very distracting.

The structure we used for many years started with $5 and the starting stacks had $5s 25s 100s and a 500. The 5s were removed after round three and the 25s after round six. If the tourney lasted long enough to get to 1000/2000 $100 were removed and $1000 were colored in.

I play in a lot of badly run home tourneys where no chips are every removed until deep into the tournament. It’s brutal. I actually played in one where $50 chips (you should never have those) were kept late into the tourney because they had blind levels of 1250/2500

 

[Coyote]

Can someone give us an authoritative short color-up guide, at least for the classic break-up (T25-100-500-1000-5000)?
Which chips to use to race-off which, and how exactly (I 've seen a couple of methods and read about more ones). Thx.

 

[JustinInMN]

My preferred method.

1) Have one or two players buy up all the lowest chips in play in quantity of the next lowest chips. (Buy all 25s in quantities of 100.)

2) Odd chips should be set forward. Deal one card for each odd chip.

3) Exchange the odd chips with one of the players that was collecting for a quantity of the next lowest chip in play. (8 twenty-fives become two hundreds, etc...) If the quantity isn't exact, round to the nearest increment of the next chip. (Round 225 to 200, 250 or 275 to 300.)

4) Award up to one chip per player according to the cards dealt in step 2.

5) have the players holding the chips to be remove add enough other small chips to make a large denomination (1000 when coloring 25s or 100s.) And exchange with the bank.

This method minimizes rounding error and prevents adding chips of denominations that will just be colored up in the future anyway. (Which I know @BGinGA appreciates .)

Bottom line:
*Centralize the chips to be removed.
*Make change and award race winners with chips already on the table.
*Only exchange chips with the bank with one or two players per table.

Hope that helps, best I could do typing on my phone.

 

[JustinInMN]

someone give us an authoritative short color-up guide, at least for the classic break-up (T25-100-500-1000-5000)?

Using the centralization method above I would suggest using T1000 to color up T25 and T100, use T5000 to do T500 and T1000.

 

[BGinGA]

Using the centralization method above I would suggest using T1000 to color up T25 and T100, use T5000 to do T500 and T1000.

^^ That's how I do it, although in the rare case of T1000 removal, I generally use T25000 chips to replace them, only adding T5000s if there aren't enough already in play.

 

[BGinGA]

Can someone give us an authoritative short color-up guide, at least for the classic break-up (T25-100-500-1000-5000)?
Which chips to use to race-off which, and how exactly (I 've seen a couple of methods and read about more ones). Thx.

The method posted by @JustinInMN works well, although I prefer to round-up vs race-off when coloring up denominations no longer needed. It's slightly faster, and arguably fairer (since nobody ever gets shorted due to chance).

 

[JustinInMN]

I do think round-up is common for simplicity. (I have even seen it used in my local casino on the T500 to T1000 color up on occasion if the TD wants to keep it moving.)

The round up method does open a small avenue of exploitation where players are essentially freerolling on any "odd chips" more than one so they risk nothing my going for small increases in bet sizing when a color up approaches.

But I can concede that's so minor the simplicity of the round-up method is still appealing.

 

[SendThatStack]

What would be the ideal start stack in a t25 starting with 5k stack? Does it make much of a difference if it’s rebuy and/or two tables?

 

[SendThatStack]

My preferred method.

1) Have one or two players buy up all the lowest chips in play in quantity of the next lowest chips. (Buy all 25s in quantities of 100.)

2) Odd chips should be set forward. Deal one card for each odd chip.

3) Exchange the odd chips with one of the players that was collecting for a quantity of the next lowest chip in play. (8 twenty-fives become two hundreds, etc...) If the quantity isn't exact, round to the nearest increment of the next chip. (Round 225 to 200, 250 or 275 to 300.)

For step 3 where do the 100s come from that your are exchanging the odd 25s for?

 

[JustinInMN]

@SendThatStack

From one of the players that was buying up the 25s.

For example, say in step one the big stack could buys 52 greens (13 chips), and then there are 12 chips on the race, which the same player will buy up for 3 more chips. Then that player has collect 64 greens, and add 4 blacks to make an even 2000.

 

[JustinInMN]

What would be the ideal start stack in a t25 starting with 5k stack? Does it make much of a difference if it’s rebuy and/or two tables?

The two most common answers you will find here are

Minimum stack:
8*T25, 8*T100, 4*T500, X*T1000 (however many to make the starting stack, 2 to make 5K in this case)

Deeper stack:
12*T25, 12*T200, 5*T500, X*T1000 ( in this case 1 to make 5000.)

 

[SendThatStack]

Thanks, thats what I was thinking after mulling it over for a while. How would it work to do the round up method? Everyone sells off everything and then their remainder goes up to the next chip size?

The two most common answers you will find here are

Deeper stack:
12*T25, 12*T200, 5*T500, X*T1000 ( in this case 1 to make 5000.)

Thats what I was going to go with.

 

[JustinInMN]

How would it work to do the round up method? Everyone sells off everything and then their remainder goes up to the next chip size?

Yup 300 gets 300. 325, 350, 375, and 400 get 400, etc...