ClubWPT Gold: Open Bigger or Wider? (1 Viewer)

[PokerDogDoc]

I occasionally play online on ClubWPT Gold. Solely 8-player max, microstakes 0.05/0.10, and a 200bb buy in. Pretty loose and fishy games.

I typically play a varied exploitative style tailored to my opponents, but lean towards a tighter GTO-ish starting range as my foundation—as compared to the usual super high VPIP / low PFR many have at these stakes.

But the ClubWPT Gold antes are incredibly high at 0.5bb per player, so a full table has a preflop pot of 5.5bb (0.5bb x 8, +SB, +BB).

With all that preflop dead money I know I could (should?) be opening wider, but have also thought about opening bigger to disincentivize calls due to the good pot odds they get against smaller opens.

FYI, my usual open is 4bb, but I’ll sometimes have a sliding scale opening bet because of loose calls of any amount by numerous players behind me bloating the pot (3bb from EP, 3.5bb from MP, and 4bb from LP)

So, if you were in my shoes at these stakes on this platform, and you’re first to open, would you open wider or bigger (or both, or neither)? Please justify your answer.

 

[Booshme]

Just experiment with higher and higher raises until the desired amount of people fold. Once you’re familiar with the player pool more then look at modifying your range

 

[PokerDogDoc]

I might consider this, but you’re risking more and bloating the pot preflop.
If I open for 10 or 12 bb, and I get 1 or 2 callers, based on SPR we’re pretty much playing for stacks with only a 200bb max starting stack. If I try this, it would make sense that I’d need to tighten up my range, which may then make me exploitable!

Any one out there agree or disagree?
Other opinions?

 

[Booshme]

I might consider this, but you’re risking more and bloating the pot preflop.
If I open for 10 or 12 bb, and I get 1 or 2 callers, based on SPR we’re pretty much playing for stacks with only a 200bb max starting stack. If I try this, it would make sense that I’d need to tighten up my range, which may then make me exploitable!

Any one out there agree or disagree?
Other opinions?

I think experimenting is the way to go. Curious to hear other thoughts. Also, players at that site at that buy-in probably aren’t too aware of how to exploit a tight range. Might not even know what that means…. Could be wrong though, I got used to softer player pools playing PLO

 

[DrStrange]

The ante effectively makes everyone's stacks "smaller". 5.5bb before the first action seems like stacks are about three times smaller than they would be without the ante. The 200bb buy-in looks more like 65bb to me.

What should hero do? Deploy an aggressive, short, stacked strategy.

1. I'd lean away from speculative hands and lean towards top pair hands. If opening raises are properly large, say 15bb-30bb, Hero almost never has odds to play speculative hands. Set mining is dubious proposition. Perhaps we might look at opening hand ranges for limit hold'em as an acceptable first guess. Hero can't play "any two cards" profitably unless the villains are astonishingly bad. (hero can play speculative hands if villains are making normal sized raises, effectivity ignoring the ante.)

2a. Much bigger preflop raises. Pot commitment earlier when making top pair / good kicker or better.
2b. Limp/3bet or limp/jam a wider range vs loose aggressive villains.
Either way, Hero is looking for low SPRs

3 GTO: Are there solvers that handle this type of ante situation? And why would I want to use a GTO approach when the field is likely making serious mistakes dealing with the ante? This seems like a circumstance tailor made to fleece the field. NL Hold'em cash played with an ante seems pretty unique. A thinking player should do well making adjustments few other players make.

DrStrange

 

[PokerDogDoc]

The ante effectively makes everyone's stacks "smaller".

The 200bb buy-in looks more like 65bb to me.

Nice point. I actually didn’t think of it in terms of effective starting stacks. This is comparable to what happens with straddles on (which I despise).

What should hero do? Deploy an aggressive, short, stacked strategy.

I’m doing this now, and basically doing what you suggest in plans 1 & 2, but probably could tighten up even more, shifting up and left on the preflop chart. Basically, tighter and bigger preflop.

For now I still limp call low-to-mid pocket pairs to see if I can bink the flop, but if I get 3-bet, I’m gone.

But I’ve totally given up on non-Broadway suited connectors at these stakes and antes… as you said, I don’t have the stack depth to pursue these.

As far as option 3, I wouldn’t even think of going with GTO strategies with this field… they certainly don’t follow it, making the better play one of exploitation. And as you suggested, as far as I know, GTO can’t even do regular multi-way hands yet, much less wack-a-doodle multiway.

Thanks for the input and insight.