Apex/Black Aurora Poker Chip Cases (2 Viewers)

[Trihonda]

Maybe even have a "blank" rack tray with pick n pluck foam (or something classier) so people could customize it to their own deck/button size..

Ooooh, excellent idea. I often use an upside down rack on the top of the top rack to store cards and extra cut cards etc... I might have to come up with some foam insert for the bottom of an inverted rack...

 

[Lovejoyz]

Judging from that photo, a padlock may be able to wrap the handle, thus allowing the "sheath" to only be lifted a few inches.
If the few inches only exposes the thick base where the cards/button hides, the chips would remain secure to all but a determined thief... and I have not yet met the master lock that would prevent a determined thief.

I’m thinking more at home simple storage. If you really want to protect them from a their, they should be in a full safe/vault. That plastic isn’t keeponf anybody from smashing it and taking them also

 

[markleteenie]

Ooooh, excellent idea. I often use an upside down rack on the top of the top rack to store cards and extra cut cards etc... I might have to come up with some foam insert for the bottom of an inverted rack...

I'll take 0.05 for my cut of the intellectual property.

 

[WedgeRock]

I think the cost difference is in what you're NOT getting.

Real casino bird cages have a full width center divider, use at least 3 screws to attach the bottom piece, and have much thicker plastic all around. See the photo from the Unique Ent catalog below for comparison...

View attachment 229388

These are designed as a much beefier product and sell for to $150. They are designed to handle the day to day rigors of casino use. They can be used and abused and won't collapse, shatter, fall apart, or break. Our $65 Brybelly units probably wouldn't make it through a day in a casino, and I always carry them with 2 hands because of how flimsy they feel.

If we're getting a casino grade product at $65, I'd say were in for substantial savings.

Just my $0.02.

Well, that difference wasn't crystal clear, but now I see why there is some hype over this project. I've never felt my Brybellys were insufficient, but I agree I treat them with care when moving them fully loaded, and they'd never last in a casino environment.

Carry on.

 

[markleteenie]

You only need a hole

@WedgeRock - when I saw you quote this, I was certain it was going to be an out of context comment....but I think it was by accident.

Almost had to contact HR. Carry on.

 

[WedgeRock]

Cut/pasted into out-of-context, but accidentally got double-posted here.

Fixed.

 

[justsomedude]

Well, that difference wasn't crystal clear,

I agree... he just seems to be more of an "idea guy" than a "sales guy". He may need some help pushing the "why this is a better mousetrap" bit. But once he does, I have a feeling his product could have some legs.

 

[markleteenie]

Cut/pasted into out-of-context, but accidentally got double-posted here.

Fixed.

Makes sense. (y) :thumbsup:

 

[ADS Aviator]

Simplest things first. Flat base/handle, box with 1000-chip capacity. Everything else can flow from there. For those that are waiting on 600s and 800s, just buy the 1000s first. Sell them later on the secondary market when the other sizes become available, because the late adopters will want to see the first production ones in action before they jump in.

I 100% agree with this.

 

[Mario Garza]

Just made another thread in the Aurora Poker Gear forum about the Perfect Chip Rack idea I explained poorly above:

https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/the-perfect-chip-rack-pcr.36216/

Thoughts?

And thank you guys for all of the feedback! Keep it coming! Don't mistake my slow responses for apathy. I'm hard at work on this Apex project!

 

[FDLmold]

If you had both sizes of typical chip racks, 39mm and 43mm, I don't think it would be hard to design a carrier that accommodates both. Some kind of recess in the bottom for 39s where 43s sit on the ledge around the recess, or something like that. The difference between them is total 15-20mm, or a bit over half an inch.

 

[PKF655]

Very interested in 600, 800, 1000 carriers. Would like to get more specifics, but will wait for that

 

[Mario Garza]

Hope linking is ok. Here's how the poker chip rack stabilizers work!

More videos and pics to follow. Thanks for being patient, guys. Still working on getting the Official Apex FAQ up!

 

[WedgeRock]

...aaaaand you are officially not welcome anywhere near my chips....

 

[brikas]

Any predictions about the cost of shopping these to Europe (Poland, specifically)? Say, 2x1000 carriers with racks?

 

[Mario Garza]

Any predictions about the cost of shopping these to Europe (Poland, specifically)? Say, 2x1000 carriers with racks?

The answer to this and many other questions is coming soon in the Official Apex Poker Chip Case Thread. Stay tuned!

 

[Poker Zombie]

The answer to this and many other questions is coming soon in the Official Apex Poker Chip Case Thread. Stay tuned!

Keep in mind that new threads are easily overlooked. This one has legs. If you open a new thread on the topic, it should be a new topic.

 

[RichMahogany]

Definitely in for at least one 800 chip cage. That’s my ideal size for both cash and tournament sets.

 

[Mario Garza]

You only need a hole in the exposed handle for a lock. ... I think to be successful the first run needs to accommodate 43mm racks.

I could care less about the 43 mm racks...

...with a couple 43mm GB projects on the forum right now, this birdcage project is very timely.

Looking at his future business prospects ... how much long term demand is there really going to be for 43mm birdcages? And how many people want chip storage for 39mm sets with all kinds of weird extra space?...

...a standard 39mm could also help him get into casino suppliers before a 43mm would...

Sounds like a good poll candidate.

...I think the factor that will be the biggest draw is a viable birdcage of super solid quality construction at a reasonable price. I think if you make it solid and simple, and the price is low, then it will sell like hot cakes...

Again, this should be settled by a poll as to which model/tooling we order first. Looking more and more to me like everyone's preference is a simple base and a 1000-chip handle.

...I prefer a 800 chip...but I’d order at least two 1000 ct carriers...a 1200 ct unit is meh

Love it! We're well above 70 cases now. Also agree about the 1200-chip cases, but apparently some people need some, so hopefully we can get enough Apex 1000's ordered to move on to the other bases, as well as handles--which determines capacity.

There isn’t a lot of material in the exposed handle. It appears maybe adding just a tad bit of material in the bottom might help with that. (Where my finger is)

It's a good idea and, as long as the community doesn't hate the little hole, we'll include that in the design.

...Put them on amazon so that every person who buys standard 39mm chips can see it, that it holds cards, dealers buttons, comes with racks, and a lock...boom.

I hope you're right, @Lovejoyz I sincerely do. Supplant all junk birdcages everywhere, then, world domination.

If you had both sizes of typical chip racks, 39mm and 43mm, I don't think it would be hard to design a carrier that accommodates both. Some kind of recess in the bottom for 39s where 43s sit on the ledge around the recess, or something like that. The difference between them is total 15-20mm, or a bit over half an inch.

Finally made it through all the posts! First of all, well done with the design and initiative, I like where this is going!

39mm is my primary concern, even though I also have 43 mm chips. But those are currently in Matsui racks, which don't look like they work with the base plate rack stabilizer (nubs). Also, I would never run a pure 43 mm set, so a way to include both would be benefitial - but that seems more of a rack stacking issue. Unless you had like a dividing plate to go over and create a new "base" for stacking a different size rack?

I agree with most that the cards and button need to be at the top and not in the base as a cutout. You would have to unload the whole birdcage to start playing - not as practical. Though the tray/door/storage in the bottom seems neat, for the extra weight, cost and potential weakness (or any moving piece), I say put it on the back burner. If there was a rack for cards/buttons (@justsomedude), that would be ideal, and the most versatile. Maybe even have a "blank" rack tray with pick n pluck foam (or something classier) so people could customize it to their own deck/button size. It would also prevent rattling or scratching...

My initial interest is either in 800 or 1000 ct. With a 1000 ct, I could still have an extra bit of space at the top (for the future card/button setup).

A lot of good ideas, here. Thanks for the feedback, @markleteenie! Thanks for the kid words, as well. They're very encouraging. Finally feels like we can contribute something useful to the poker community, which is all I've ever really wanted to do with APG.

39mm vote. Copied. Maybe the extra little dividing platform thing would work best for Matsui racks and other non-"standard" types. Maybe a plate that covers the Rack Stabilizers (pegs)?

I did consider in one of the early designs, a ridge that the chip racks would sit inside of in the base. They I designed them to accommodate 39mm and 43mm racks at the time--at least, in theory--and I didn't care for the overall look. I also misjudged the popularity of 43mm chips in the US market. Thought I could always design another case for 43-mil chips later. I'm sure the Rack Stabilizer spacing can be modified to fit both sizes though.

Judging from that photo, a padlock may be able to wrap the handle, thus allowing the "sheath" to only be lifted a few inches.
If the few inches only exposes the thick base where the cards/button hides, the chips would remain secure to all but a determined thief... and I have not yet met the master lock that would prevent a determined thief.

I’m thinking more at home simple storage. If you really want to protect them from a their, they should be in a full safe/vault. That plastic isn’t keeponf anybody from smashing it and taking them also

I do understand the application you intended them for, @Lovejoyz. My wife runs a home daycare, so I do understand the importance of locking your chips up. We just put ours high enough for the kids not to get them, but it is a pain to lift heavy birdcages. You practically have to warm up first or risk injury.

If there is a count being taken, I would almost certainly be in for two 1000 count 43mm cases.

There's, sort of, an unofficial count going, so far. But I gotcha, @ThinkingFold. Thanks!

Ooooh, excellent idea. I often use an upside down rack on the top of the top rack to store cards and extra cut cards etc... I might have to come up with some foam insert for the bottom of an inverted rack...

I'm thinking various rack types is becoming a must. Why do chips get all the love? Card racks, DB racks, maybe even plaque racks? Sounds good to me.

Well, that difference wasn't crystal clear, but now I see why there is some hype over this project. I've never felt my Brybellys were insufficient, but I agree I treat them with care when moving them fully loaded, and they'd never last in a casino environment.

Carry on.

I agree... he just seems to be more of an "idea guy" than a "sales guy". He may need some help pushing the "why this is a better mousetrap" bit. But once he does, I have a feeling his product could have some legs.

@justsomedude @WedgeRock You're right about the vagueness of the initial post. If I had known it would become the first thread in the Aurora Poker Gear Forum--and gain such momentum!--I would have included another set of pictures, which explains every feature in detail. I think I'll just add them here before this thread runs away much further.

I 100% agree with this.

1000% agree with this. I believe it's the formula for success, but we'll definitely consider every option and everyone's ideas.

Very interested in 600, 800, 1000 carriers. Would like to get more specifics, but will wait for that

Specifics are on the way.

...aaaaand you are officially not welcome anywhere near my chips....

But I'm suuuuuch a huge fish!

Keep in mind that new threads are easily overlooked. This one has legs. If you open a new thread on the topic, it should be a new topic.

Good advice. Anything new will be added here. As for the polls, what do you suggest? I think we need a vote on each of the following:

Which capacity first?
1) 1200
2) 1000
3) 800

Which base first?
1) Flat with rack stabilizers + card/button racks that go on top of the chips
2) Card and DB Compartments

Design Apex for 39mm and 43mm chips/racks?
1) Yea
2) Nay

And maybe...

Color?
1) Black
2) White
3) Hard Candy Magenta
@SixSpeedFury (y) :thumbsup:

Hole for lock?
1) Yea
2) Nay

 

[Mario Garza]

Definitely in for at least one 800 chip cage. That’s my ideal size for both cash and tournament sets.

I won't forget it!

 

[Mario Garza]

Others have alluded to this and I want everyone to know that it's absolutely correct: including card/db compartments in the base will increase the cost of tooling, which will affect the final price of each pre-order, which may affect how many pre-orders we can get overall.

The vertical clearance needed to fit those compartments makes the base thicker, which means a bigger block of aircraft-grade aluminum (or steel) will be needed, and CNC machining out those compartments will require more time, effort, and equipment wear for the manufacturer, which all results in higher cost, naturally.

 

[Darson]

Card and DB buttons shouldn't be in the first iteration. What size cards - poker or bridge? What size DB - 44mm, 49mm, 53mm, 66mm?? There are too many variables... And if it increases the cost then even more reason not to do it now. Great as future add-on.

As for the 43mm, there is a gap in the market but you will seriously be limiting your potential sales if you cater to a 43mm when 99% of buyers will be using 39mm chips. Again, 43mm is a nice thing for the future but not what I'd be betting on for my first product.

 

[Poker Zombie]

Separate threads for polls and orders are fine, but be aware that we are like 50 sugar buzzed children in a candy store with only 1 adult to supervise. You let loose another thread, and discussions will take place here and in the new thread, making suggestions and conversations disjointed and confusing - especially to those that log in once a month, and don't read every post in a thread.

Make sure you have things narrowed down to a pollable number, and then make some cases. You won't satisfy everyone's needs or wants. That's why group buys usually take place with limited input - just enough to figure out a market.

 

[bsdunbar1]

I am in for a 43mm 1000 count case. No need for 39mm today since I already have several but have yet to find a 43mm.
For the minimal size difference I don't know why you would not make one case fit both sizes.
Personally I have no use for any of the fancy card/button holders/drawers, the novelty is not worth the extra cost IMO.

 

[bsdunbar1]

especially to those that log in once a month, and don't read every post in a thread.

Is this a real thing?

 

[ReallyGoodUsername]

Very excited for this! I'd rather have an 800 ct first but seems like 1000 ct is the safest way to make sure this idea gets on its feet. I feel like 800ct would be more in demand the 1200ct... 95% of the people using the cages here will be using them for in-home transport only so to me making two trips with 600 ct holders (for now) isn't that big of an issue plus 1200ct cages are going to be too heavy for some of the users here to carry or want to carry. Last point, there's already multiple threads members have created looking for 800 chip cages before this thread so there's already known demand.

Interested to see where this leads and will likely be interested in buying 800-1000 ct cages pending how this progresses. Good luck!

 

[Mario Garza]

This is what should have been in the first post. Please understand that there will be logistical changes. (Rounding of corners/edges, filleting, texture change, possibly recessing the feet, etc., etc.--not to mention the changes brought about after polling.) These images are for reference only. Black and white chosen to illustrate that it's comprised of two members.

Features:

#caseporn

 

[Highli99]

If you make them. Folks will buy them. If.

 

[Mario Garza]

If you make them. Folks will buy them. If.

If you preorder them. I will make them. (Sorry. Couldn’t resist. )

If we can get enough preorders, there’s nothing stopping us. I have an injection molding company, a backup company, and a tertiary company that is more expensive, but still there, if worse comes to worst. There are many more out there. I have 3 acrylic sheet vendors lined up and, again, two that I would prefer to work with. There are many more logistics that have already been worked out, among which are FOB quotes for various amounts of 4x8 sheets—depending on the MOQ—to either Port of Los Angeles or Port of Long Beach. I have the necessary tools to get the first run done and more, if necessary, including a table saw with 100-tooth plastic blades, a router and router table, MAPP gas torch for flame polishing edges, pallet truck, digital measuring tools that will get every measurement and cut accurate to a fraction of a hundredth of millimeter, etc.. I’ve perfected the acrylic welding skills, having worked with the material extensively during the Black Aurora campaign. (Practiced extensively on small cuts prior to assembling the lids. Made some mistakes, corrected them, rinsed and repeated until I found the perfect solution/technique, which I will keep a trade secret.)

I’m sure there’s more I could mention, but the horse is dead, I think. The project is in good hands.(y) :thumbsup:

 

[Mario Garza]

How does this look for a rough draft of the flat-base Apex 1000? Still need to add in the lock holes, but I wanted to do some research about the diameter and width of most lock shackles first.