Who is into Magic the Gathering (1 Viewer)

[detroitdad]

I'm looking to get me son something fun. He is into this. I don't know shit about it.

As for Commander decks he has Swell the host and Draconic domination. I'm looking for a few others to add to his collection.

WOW, there is a lot of shit out there.

Are these any good?

2017 Vampiric Bloodlust (sounds up my alley)

https://www.amazon.com/Magic-Gather...pID=51uA6q7IVSL&preST=_SY300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch

2017 Feline Ferocity

https://www.amazon.com/Magic-Gather...pID=51sES2DFVUL&preST=_SY300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch

2013 Nature of the Beast

https://www.amazon.com/Magic-Gather...id=1511202626&sr=8-8&keywords=Commander+Decks

It might not even be this simple. If you can help, great. I'm open to suggestions.

 

[mipevi]

IIRC there are some folks around who play the game... I haven't played in a while now and don't know any of the newer cards, but I do think it generally makes sense to buy 2017 decks over older ones (more bang for the buck with maybe new mechanics). Without knowing anything about his style of play or playgroup, I'd just get decks with themes he would enjoy.

Many people build their own Commander decks instead of using the preconstructed ones, I had the main guy custom painted.

 

[FDLmold]

I could have helped you with this in 1995. I am out of the loop anymore. But I do know MTG is as popular as ever.

 

[Mr. Cheese]

Paging @inca911

Speaking of which, next time we have a game we should play some MTG

Here's a Commander deck I built a few years back. Was a ton of fun against my buddies. Cost was around 300-800 (depending on card condition) to build.

The commander would be Sliver Overlord for his tutoring ability. One goal would be Tunnel vision naming living death. Once you play living death hopefully the 20+ slivers you had to put in your graveyard when you played Tunnel Vision will now all be coming back in to make one massive swing at all of your opponents!

//Artifact (5)
1 Chromatic Lantern
1 Crystal Ball
1 Darksteel Ingot
1 Manalith
1 Vessel of Endless Rest

//Creature (37)
1 Amoeboid Changeling
1 Bonescythe Sliver
1 Brood Sliver
1 Crypt Sliver
1 Crystalline Sliver
1 Darkheart Sliver
1 Diffusion Sliver
1 Essence Sliver
1 Frenzy Sliver
1 Fungus Sliver
1 Galerider Sliver
1 Gemhide Sliver
1 Harmonic Sliver
1 Heart Sliver
1 Hibernation Sliver
1 Homing Sliver
1 Horned Sliver
1 Manaweft Sliver
1 Megantic Sliver
1 Might Sliver
1 Muscle Sliver
1 Opaline Sliver
1 Quick Sliver
1 Root Sliver
1 Sentinel Sliver
1 Shifting Sliver
1 Sinew Sliver
1 Sliver Hivelord
1 Sliver Legion
1 Sliver Overlord
1 Sliver Queen
1 Spinneret Sliver
1 Syphon Sliver
1 Telekinetic Sliver
1 Two-Headed Sliver
1 Victual Sliver
1 Ward Sliver

//Enchantment (7)
1 Abundant Growth
1 Dawn's Reflection
1 Exploration
1 Mana Echoes
1 Market Festival
1 Omniscience
1 Unnatural Selection

//Instant (5)
1 Mortify
1 Putrefy
1 Render Silent
1 Rewind
1 Voidslime

//Sorcery (10)
1 Cruel Ultimatum
1 Cultivate
1 Diabolic Tutor
1 Distant Melody
1 Living Death
1 Shard Convergence
1 Spoils of Victory
1 Sylvan Scrying
1 Titanic Ultimatum
1 Tunnel Vision

//Land (36)
1 Ancient Ziggurat
1 Arcane Sanctum
1 Cavern of Souls
1 Command Tower
1 Crumbling Necropolis
3 Forest
1 Grasslands
3 Island
1 Jungle Shrine
2 Mountain
2 Plains
1 Reflecting Pool
1 Rupture Spire
1 Savage Lands
1 Seaside Citadel
1 Sliver Hive
3 Swamp
1 Temple of Abandon
1 Temple of Deceit
1 Temple of Enlightenment
1 Temple of Epiphany
1 Temple of Malady
1 Temple of Malice
1 Temple of Mystery
1 Temple of Plenty
1 Temple of Silence
1 Temple of Triumph
1 Unknown Shores

SB: 1 Fauna Shaman
SB: 1 Sol Ring
SB: 2 Tunnel Vision
SB: 1 Violent Ultimatum

 

[Rhodeman77]

I was huge into MtG for many years but got out of once I discovered poker. I was a Type 1 mostly player so I wouldn’t be of much help with all the new cards. It is a great game. It can be as casual or competitive as he and his friends want it to be.

The problem I had with it was the constant money sink. 4 new sets every year, and after a few years those cards rotate out of the tournament block and their value drops 70% because most of them aren’t as good as the older cards they have to compete with for deck space in type 1 or Limited format.

 

[FDLmold]

Type 1 decks are crazy. They call it Vintage now.

 

[Pokerdweebz]

Vampiric Bloodlust is stronger than Feline Ferocity (and more fun in my opinion). I can't answer about the 2013 precons, but I know the 2016 precons are all pretty cool.

 

[Pokerdweebz]

I was huge into MtG for many years but got out of once I discovered poker. I was a Type 1 mostly player so I wouldn’t be of much help with all the new cards. It is a great game. It can be as casual or competitive as he and his friends want it to be.

The problem I had with it was the constant money sink. 4 new sets every year, and after a few years those cards rotate out of the tournament block and their value drops 70% because most of them aren’t as good as the older cards they have to compete with for deck space in type 1 or Limited format.

It's definitely still a money sink, but Modern and Legacy are as popular as ever. Seeing as most of the cards in the newer sets are way low on the power level once you have a Modern/Legacy/Vintage deck you typically don't need to buy cards often and they hold their value fairly well (Wizards has been printing more "Masters" sets that have lowered the card price of many staples but the value is still mostly there).

 

[Rhodeman77]

For the old time MtG players on here. I found my DCI number when I was packing to move last year.

My number is only 6 digest, I think they are 9 now lol.

 

[WedgeRock]

It can be as casual or competitive as he and his friends want it to be.

No one has ever used "casual" and "Jake" in the same sentence when describing his gameplay.

 

[Psypher1000]

Get him a gift card at tcgplayer.com (direct link: https://shop.tcgplayer.com/giftcard )

This will allow him to get the cards he wants to either build or customize a commander deck - or any deck, really.

If you're looking for a pre-packaged product to buy him, the 2017 Commander decks are fine. You could also get him some packs of Iconic Masters (MSRP: $10/pack - yeouch!) or some packs of the upcoming semi-joke set, Unstable (packs available around Dec. 9th). The biggest draw to the Unstable decks is the full-bleed land cards so if those are all he would want then it's probably better to just get them as singles through TCGPlayer.

 

[Nex]

I used to play various TCGs as a kid, predominantly Yu-Gi-Oh but I also had some MtG cards.

Can absolutely not recommend this kind of hobby, especially not for children. MtG might be the tamest of the pack as they tend to give the "most bang for your buck" in regards to the number of cards you get, but all the companies behind those TCGs have one thing in common: They always create an artificial need for you to buy new cards, and the intransparent randomized nature of booster packs is essentially legalized and unregulated gambling for children. It's very easy to end up spending incredible amounts on those cards, no matter if you buy boosters or the individual cards directly from other collectors.

When I realized that fact in my later teens, I gave up on it. I've held on to my cards for years and started selling them just a few years ago. They do fetch nice amounts of money now, but that's specific to the kind of cards you have.

Gotta get 'em when they're young.

 

[Pokerdweebz]

I used to play various TCGs in the past, predominantly Yu-Gi-Oh but I also had some MtG cards.

Can absolutely not recommend this kind of hobby, especially not for children. MtG might be the tamest of the pack as they tend to give the "most bang for your buck" in regards to the number of cards you get, but all the companies behind those TCGs have one thing in common: They always create an artificial need for you to buy new cards, and the intransparent randomized nature of booster packs is essentially legalized and unregulated gambling for children.

When I realized that fact in my teens, I gave up on it. I've held on to my cards for years and started selling them just a few years ago. They do fetch nice amounts of money now, but that's specific to the kind of cards you have.

I can absolutely recommend this hobby, especially for children who are interested in such games. Any cards that are necessary are available for purchase as single cards and people can build whatever deck they want without opening packs. Teaching your children how to be responsible with such a hobby is a very important life lesson. On top of that any of the permanent formats will not require you to buy any cards at all once you have the deck you want to play. Magic teaches children responsibility and is a fantastic way to give their brains exercise.

 

[Nex]

Any cards that are necessary are available for purchase as single cards and people can build whatever deck they want without opening packs.

...which still tend to cost hefty amounts of money if you're after the good/rare ones. If you want a really strong deck and you're making it all from individually purchased cards, you're still going to shell out sick amounts of money - sick as in very high for a teenager's usual income.

On top of that any of the permanent formats will not require you to buy any cards at all once you have the deck you want to play.

Even when the game you're playing is offering such a permanent format in the first place (some even don't), it still doesn't change a thing.

The TCG companies introduce new mechanics, new cards with better effects, even cards specifically designed to counter specific good cards from older editions. Maybe you don't have to change your deck to keep playing there, but in order to competitively play you will have to - as the others who want to gain an edge against you will buy those new cards and make decks with them.

So through the back door, you are indeed forced to continuously buy new cards if you are serious about it.

MtG is a great brain exercise, I agree, but it comes in tricky packaging.
I would not disallow my children to have this kind of hobby, but I would not finance it.

 

[DrStrange]

Maybe the responses so far are too advanced. Let's start from the beginning.

Players buy cards to play the game. They can be bought like baseball cards - in semi-random packs at the toy store, in premade decks (toy store sometimes, eBay, or a specialty game store), or bought/traded as singles. Take note the best cards tend to be rare cards, they are not evenly distributed. You'll need to buy a LOT of random decks to get the exact cards you want.

A player takes their best or preferred cards and build them into a deck of at least 60 cards. The nature of the game is a bit like a game of rock / paper / scissors Each "color" deck has powers that allow it to defeat a deck of weaker color and have a color that it fears. That means players often build a multi-color deck and also have other decks available to keep foes from coming with decks tuned to beat an expected deck.

Cards "expire" every year. This would not matter for casual players, but it matters a lot to tournament or serious players. It means that a new set of cards have to be acquired every time your old ones become obsolete. If this seems expensive, you would be right. Serious Magic players are going to spend a thousand bucks a year to play. (Maybe less, maybe more, but it isn't ever going to end).

Here is how I played for cheap when I was Scoutmaster. Everyone brought their junk cards, old, damaged whatever. They didn't get the same cards back, though I tried to get the counts right. Each day, everyone playing got a random pile of cards and built a deck or two. It wasn't going to be a killer premade deck, it was going to be filled with basic cards. Kids with no cards still got to play because I brought extras. It is a reasonable test of skills without having to spend a fortune.

The key is to figure what kind of player you kid(s) want to be. It is a great game, fun hobby and potentially quite expensive to play with the big boys. But you don't have to spend the big money to start.

DrStrange

PS My first cards were Alpha and Beta cards from the original production runs. Those got put into protective binders. The rest of my cards ended up in the kids decks or left to the boy scouts.

 

[Pokerdweebz]

...which still tend to cost hefty amounts of money if you're after the good/rare ones. If you want a really strong deck and you're making it all from individually purchased cards, you're still going to shell out sick amounts of money - sick as in very high for a teenager's usual income.


Even when the game you're playing is offering such a permanent format in the first place (some even don't), it still doesn't change a thing.

The TCG companies introduce new mechanics, new cards with better effects, even cards specifically designed to counter specific good cards from older editions. Maybe you don't have to change your deck to keep playing there, but in order to competitively play you will have to - as the others who want to gain an edge against you will buy those new cards and make decks with them.

So through the back door, you are indeed forced to continuously buy new cards if you are serious about it.

MtG is a great brain exercise, I agree, but it comes in tricky packaging.
I would not disallow my children to have this kind of hobby, but I would not finance it.

Most of this is not true. You can build decks that win at FNM (Friday Night Magic, the equivalent of bar poker) for $100 or less(way less in some cases). This would hold over even a semi serious player with budget constraints for years.

Every store I've played Magic in has had to option to play eternal formats. Again this is not true.

This is laughable if you follow Magic at all. Cards have gotten significantly worse for years and very few cards see competitive play in eternal formats. You need to buy less than 1-2 cards a year depending on your deck. Many need none.

 

[WedgeRock]

I think you guys are missing the point.

@detroitdad's so is already in to this game and has a few decks of his own. DD is just looking for information/insight/advice on what decks to pick up for his son, not banter about the pros and cons of the game as a hobby and/or way of life.

 

[Esection]

The Commander preconstructed decks are great fun. I’d start with the 2017 versions since they are based around tribes (creatures that share a type and do things that make other creatures of that type stronger — like Vampires or Merfolk or Wizards or Zombies).

Then, you can look up other lists of people who have the same Commander as you and see the stronger cards they’ve swapped into their decks. Magic is awesome because it’s so customizeable.

This can become a really fun way for you to stay involved in the gift you’ve given, and to be able to give subsequent gifts that build on this present.

It’s sort of like buying a poker table off Craigslist and putting in a new felt...

 

[Pokerdweebz]

I think you guys are missing the point.

@detroitdad's so is already in to this game and has a few decks of his own. DD is just looking for information/insight/advice on what decks to pick up for his son, not banter about the pros and cons of the game as a hobby and/or way of life.

I answered his question and replied to the misinformation that is being spread. Not going to sit here and let falsities be claimed when others might be interested in the game.

 

[Esection]

Oh I’d also strongly recommend you learning what cards he has already and what colors he likes to play. There are different characteristics to each color which lead to different play styles.

 

[Rhodeman77]

Draft and sealed deck are a great way to get into the tournament versions of MtG. For about $20 you get a night of play. Players are forced to use all of the cards in the deck, not just the elite power cards.

 

[Rhodeman77]

Most of this is not true. You can build decks that win at FNM (Friday Night Magic, the equivalent of bar poker) for $100 or less(way less in some cases). This would hold over even a semi serious player with budget constraints for years.

Every store I've played Magic in has had to option to play eternal formats. Again this is not true.

This is laughable if you follow Magic at all. Cards have gotten significantly worse for years and very few cards see competitive play in eternal formats. You need to be less than 1-2 cards a year depending on your deck. Many need none.

This is pretty accurate. I hadn’t played in years when a friend that is still into asked me to come play at his store’s tournament. I didn’t know any of the new mechanics or cards so I decided a straight red sleigh/rush deck would be simple to play and a challenge to any slow to develop decks. I went .500 for the tournament not knowing any of the current metta of decks/cards at the time. I’ll take it.

 

[Esection]

This is pretty accurate. I hadn’t played in years when a friend that is still into asked me to come play at his store’s tournament. I didn’t know any of the new mechanics or cards so I decided a straight red sleigh/rush deck would be simple to play and a challenge to any slow to develop decks. I went .500 for the tournament not knowing any of the current metta of decks/cards at the time. I’ll take it.

Agree with both of these comments. As someone who has played at the competitive level for a few years (was introduced to it after online poker was banned), there is a very big difference in the decks and cards players are interested in depending on the format.

I find that the likelihood of a person getting into the competitive versions of MTG is directly related to 1) how competitive the person is and 2) the groups of ‘MTG friends’ the person hangs out with.

If your son might be interested in the competitive formats, I highly recommend building towards some of the non-rotating formats (Modern, Legacy). These decks tend to be very expensive but the cards tend to hold their value.

I’m starting to think we should have a MTG thread in Other topics...

 

[Esection]

The TCG companies introduce new mechanics, new cards with better effects, even cards specifically designed to counter specific good cards from older editions. Maybe you don't have to change your deck to keep playing there, but in order to competitively play you will have to - as the others who want to gain an edge against you will buy those new cards and make decks with them.

So through the back door, you are indeed forced to continuously buy new cards if you are serious about it.

This commentary is true about other TCG games to a large degree (like Yu-Gi-Oh, Pokémon, And even new digital games like Hearthstone, Eternal etc).

But for MTG only a small degree.

Now I’m not saying MTG is light on the wallet - in fact the opposite. But rather that if you choose to play Eternal formats (where the legality of the cards don’t rotate and the only way for a card to stop being playable is if it is ‘banned’ — but this happens only rarely), then you don’t really ever buy new cards...

 

[inca911]

I used to play MTG back in c1993 when the game started. As different formats were created and evolved, I moved into collecting extreme Magic rarities, such as: Summer Magic (e.g., Blue Hurricane), Foil Textless Lightning Bolt, Albino playtest decks, Wizards of the Coast alternate design test prints, Harry Potter backed Magic cards, etc. I was well connected, and held or bought most every big card in the game (e.g., Splendid Genesis, Fraternal Exaltation, Proposal). I've sat at Richard Garfield's desk, and visited "the mana pool" at the WotC headquarters in Renton. Things had become much too commercialized by the card redesign c2003, so I shifted my focus elsewhere. I still like the game, but don't know much about the current environment to help Jake. Old school rarities is my wheelhouse.

I still have a bunch of pre-constructed World Championship decks, my original c1993 Swords to Plowshares (played to hell), an Amy Weber personalized artist proof card, a couple Moxes, Black Lotus original art, and some scary good proxies that convinced me to offload the bulk of my collection based on counterfeit risk. Cards that were $5 in my day are $500+ today (or more). Today, there are many more cards out there than were ever printed, but that's a dark little secret that few people want to voice based on the huge $ they have invested. It's much harder to fake a TRK or Paulson chip than it is to fake a Beta Black Lotus!

 

[detroitdad]

No one has ever used "casual" and "Jake" in the same sentence when describing his gameplay.

That is very true. He is about as serious as it gets.

Get him a gift card at tcgplayer.com

This is probably the "smart" move. However, I find gift cards impersonal. For my wife/kids I'd rather do my research and put some thought into a gift. I'll definitely consider it.

Can absolutely not recommend this kind of hobby, especially not for children.

He is 21. Honestly, he has been an adult since he was probably 14. FWIW, he finances his own hobby.

I think you guys are missing the point.

@detroitdad's so is already in to this game and has a few decks of his own. DD is just looking for information/insight/advice on what decks to pick up for his son, not banter about the pros and cons of the game as a hobby and/or way of life.

Thanks, but I don't mind the side discussions. I've derailed more than one thread in my time. Its all good.

I pretty sure he has four different color decks that he has built, or is building. I'll work on figuring that out.


Thanks for all the replies so far. I appreciate it.

B

 

[WedgeRock]

I've derailed more than one thread in my time.

Understatement of the year #2 in this thread.

 

[detroitdad]

Primary format is Commander. How I understand it, he uses a deck with all five colors (scion the ur dragon, blue/black/whie (oloro, ageless ascetic) and a green/red/white deck (samut voice of dissent). So, all the colors.

I have no idea what I just typed lol.

 

[Ben]

Wow. I was once a "professional" player (using the term VERY loosely here - I was in the black by a few hundred dollars a year, which is pretty damn difficult to do in itself) and it was a huge thing for me in high school/college. Haven't played seriously since 2001 and I haven't played a single game since 2008. And the OP might as well have been in Klingon for all I understood of it - that's how much it changes.

 

[inca911]

...the OP might as well have been in Klingon for all I understood of it

pagh be' !

(means "no woman" in Klingon)