When did this community become so ??? (1 Viewer)

@stocky

to answer your question. This site became ??? right after you left. I don't really participate much anymore, so can't really judge what is good/bad about the site or community these days, but I will say when I read this thread, or any of the number of similar threads, it all boils down to money. People just seem way more concerned with the value of their chips more than the enjoyment. Seems like once we crossed the $2 per chip threshold, it became more of a business than a hobby. Flipping for profit became rampant. Classifieds became overrun with Raffles and Auctions to ensure maximum "Market" value, and friendly gestures like harvesting became for profit services. As a result we have a much higher number of controversial deals and scams.

We also had a bunch of people become chip elitist overnight. The community used to celebrate all kinds of chips - plastic, ceramic, custom, home market, casino etc...whereas nowadays if you don't own TRK or Leaded Paulson THCs, or Star Chips your likely to see comments all over the place about how all other chips suck.

CPC doesn't seem to get the love it once had from the community, and that leads to less design threads and customs being built. Flippers drove TCR to eBay. And the term "Group Buy" has become a four letter word. I struggle to find threads that will keep my interest, and many of the posters that I enjoyed are no longer here, or just no longer post. Its good to see guys like you popping back, and hopefully you can help right the Ship!
 
glom said:
I think a better range for a new paulson chip is .95 - 1.60.
Click to expand...
I've not seen a recent price quote for any THC Paulson chip under $1.13 base price, but I haven't seen one for hot-stamped solids (although I'd suspect that even those would be priced out at over $1 each). RHC mold chips were also quoted at over $1.

The base prices for Paulson Star chips ranged from $1.13 to $1.57 each, depending on mold, size, and spot pattern, but did NOT include charges for manufacturing hot-stamp molds, artwork fees, packing charges (a considerable amount), or shipping costs. Prices for Bud Jones chips were significantly higher.

A more accurate to-your-door price for Paulson spotted THC chips -- if you could get them made -- would be in the $1.25 - $1.75 range, plus the cost of any extra security features (UV, microdot, RFID, etc.).
 
BGinGA said:
I've not seen a recent price quote for any THC Paulson chip under $1.13 base price, but I haven't seen one for hot-stamped solids (although I'd suspect that even those would be priced out at over $1 each). RHC mold chips were also quoted at over $1.

The base prices for Paulson Star chips ranged from $1.13 to $1.57 each, depending on mold, size, and spot pattern, but did NOT include charges for manufacturing hot-stamp molds, artwork fees, packing charges (a considerable amount), or shipping costs. Prices for Bud Jones chips were significantly higher.

A more accurate to-your-door price for Paulson spotted THC chips -- if you could get them made -- would be in the $1.25 - $1.75 range, plus the cost of any extra security features (UV, microdot, RFID, etc.).
Click to expand...

Strongly disagree. 39mm thc inlay chips are .95 for 1000 of a single denom. At 5000 chips the art fees and shipping average less than .03 per chip. Even lower at 10k per denom.
 
glom said:
Strongly disagree. 39mm thc inlay chips are .95 for 1000 of a single denom. At 5000 chips the art fees and shipping average less than .03 per chip. Even lower at 10k per denom.
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No, BGinGA is being 100% honest and his quotes are absolutely accurate. 95c per chip might be for solids at best. Let’s lay the angst aside people. Chipping is supposed to be fun.
 
bivey said:
No, BGinGA is being 100% honest and his quotes are absolutely accurate. 95c per chip might be for solids at best. Let’s lay the angst aside people. Chipping is supposed to be fun.
Click to expand...

Well they could both be right. Dave is referencing prices from the boat chips and Glom saw an invoice in a card room. Like most things buying in volume will effect the price. There is probably a price range that THC chips sell for depending on options included and the quantity.
 
The quotes I saw were for the US. My understanding is the boat chips were over seas. This could be the difference.
 
Also keep in mind that the boat chips were not a traditional Group Buy. It was a private venture. I have never seen a GB where there was significant risk. There were questions about the legitimacy of the overseas contact. There were business aspects, including shippers, phone numbers, and other buisness-side aspects involved.

Yes, a group of people were involved. Yes they were buying chips. That is where the similarity ends. The rest was an at-risk venture. Some chose to take their reward for the risk and turn it into a profit. Phooey on them. When the prices skyrocketed, others sold extras they didn't need or sold their sets outright. I can't say I blame them. As @DrStrange once pointed out, everyone has a price they will sell every chip they own for. I love my Zombies, but if I were offered a ridiculous amount for them, every one would be gone and I'd be living in a mansion (or maybe a casino :cautious:). The point is, the boat chips, being both mint Paulsons, and very aesthetically pleasing (to many) fetched a price at auction that made it difficult to hold onto them.

...but the vast majority of the buyers did just that. They bought the chips and they still have them. Those people, again the vast majority, are doing nothing to really affect market values of other chips.
 
Poker Zombie said:
Also keep in mind that the boat chips were not a traditional Group Buy. It was a private venture. I have never seen a GB where there was significant risk. There were questions about the legitimacy of the overseas contact. There were business aspects, including shippers, phone numbers, and other buisness-side aspects involved.

Yes, a group of people were involved. Yes they were buying chips. That is where the similarity ends. The rest was an at-risk venture. Some chose to take their reward for the risk and turn it into a profit. Phooey on them. When the prices skyrocketed, others sold extras they didn't need or sold their sets outright. I can't say I blame them. As @DrStrange once pointed out, everyone has a price they will sell every chip they own for. I love my Zombies, but if I were offered a ridiculous amount for them, every one would be gone and I'd be living in a mansion (or maybe a casino :cautious:). The point is, the boat chips, being both mint Paulsons, and very aesthetically pleasing (to many) fetched a price at auction that made it difficult to hold onto them.

...but the vast majority of the buyers did just that. They bought the chips and they still have them. Those people, again the vast majority, are doing nothing to really affect market values of other chips.
Click to expand...

the very fact that they have the 300,000 chips that they are not selling means there is less of a market for current chips. I have seen many posts here about the stagnation of the chip market, and other threads on it being more of a buyers market now, and how things aren't moving. There was a large contingency of buyers taken out of the market because they had this opportunity.

Not saying this is bad or wrong, just that it seems to be true.
 
glom said:
the very fact that they have the 300,000 chips that they are not selling means there is less of a market for current chips. I have seen many posts here about the stagnation of the chip market, and other threads on it being more of a buyers market now, and how things aren't moving. There was a large contingency of buyers taken out of the market because they had this opportunity.

Not saying this is bad or wrong, just that it seems to be true.
Click to expand...

Yea this is how I see it. I can't say whether the boat chips caused other sets to decrease in value. I really don't know.

Some sets may just not sell because the potential buyers already have chips they like and have their funds tied up.

Same could be said about any large influx of new chips to the market.
 
glom said:
the very fact that they have the 300,000 chips that they are not selling means there is less of a market for current chips.

There was a large contingency of buyers taken out of the market because they had this opportunity.
Click to expand...
Well, that's a theory I guess, but one that doesn't hold true by my personal observation. The vast majority of the participants in the star chip purchase never stopped buying and selling non-star chips, and continue to do so to this day. Having access to nice chips has never stopped any serious chipper I know from buying even ~more~ nice chips. At some point some chippers might reach a saturation point, I suppose..... but even most of those are merely temporary stopping points. People's taste change, there is the challenge of the hunt, and a variety of other reasons that people acquire (or attempt to acquire) chips.... and more chips.... and even more chips.....
 
I still have every boat chip I purchased and have not bought any on the secondary market. I bought what I wanted { needed } and nothing more. Yes I will part with one or both of my boat chip sets at a high enough price as I would with any of my other sets.

Just because I bought some fancy Star Cruise Line chips doesn't mean there were not other chips I liked well enough to purchase. I bought something like 15,000 chips in the last couple of years - 2,100 of them were boat chips.

The market prices of collectable poker chips fluctuates, sometimes quite a lot. It is difficult to impossible to ascribe cause and effect. The whims of the market can be arbitrary. CiC chips once were one of the hottest chips going, not so much now. Faux clay chips had a major following back in the day on Chip Talk. What caused those changes? Is it someone's fault?

Opinions about the cause of fluctuation in chip prices are certainly interesting but in the end unverifiable guesses. Could be accurate, might be plausible but in the end just unprovable assertions. Certainly fodder for discussion since there isn't ever going to be a way to "win" the argument - everyone is a winner! [ well given the original thrust of this thread, maybe better to say everyone is a loser :( ]

I do miss the days when you could buy a playable set of casino Paulson chips for $0.25 to $0.60 per chip. Who's fault is it that we can't get a rack of used one dollar vintage casino chips for $30 anymore? I'd like another thousand used roulette for $150 like the last couple of thousand I bought.

The good ol' days -=- DrStrange
 
My issue with CPC is the barrier to entry is so high. I understand why, but it makes fantasy sets unattainable for those without substantial disposable income. I would love to have my own custom CPC set made but looking at a price tag around $4,000 for a 1000 chip set means that will remain a pipedream.
 
Jonesey07 said:
My issue with CPC is the barrier to entry is so high. I understand why, but it makes fantasy sets unattainable for those without substantial disposable income. I would love to have my own custom CPC set made but looking at a price tag around $4,000 for a 1000 chip set means that will remain a pipedream.
Click to expand...
Sorry for the possible thread-crapping, since this is a side issue, but you can get a lovely set of CPCs for clearly less than $2 per chip.
For $4 per chip at CPC, you can get what costs clearly higher than that as boat chip - especially with relabelling.
 
What an interesting thread. I take what I like from this site (cool sets, custom and otherwise; interesting poker and chip tidbits; funny, informative and helpful members; the occasional chip transaction; etc.) and I leave/ignore the rest (trolls, a$$hats, and other loser members; dumb political debates; chip/d**k measuring; etc.). Based on my time on both, PCF is an exponentially better site than CT, and I thank Tommy for that.

I'm not on here a lot, though, and I missed all the drama with the "boat" chips. So, where do I catch up on that drama?! :sneaky:
 
BNM said:
What an interesting thread. I take what I like from this site (cool sets, custom and otherwise; interesting poker and chip tidbits; funny, informative and helpful members; the occasional chip transaction; etc.) and I leave/ignore the rest (trolls, a$$hats, and other loser members; dumb political debates; chip/d**k measuring; etc.). Based on my time on both, PCF is an exponentially better site than CT, and I thank Tommy for that.

I'm not on here a lot, though, and I missed all the drama with the "boat" chips. So, where do I catch up on that drama?! :sneaky:
Click to expand...

It's all but buried
 
Coyote said:
Sorry for the possible thread-crapping, since this is a side issue, but you can get a lovely set of CPCs for clearly less than $2 per chip.
For $4 per chip at CPC, you can get what costs clearly higher than that as boat chip - especially with relabelling.
Click to expand...

You can get a very basic CPC set for less than $2 a chip but if you want any sort of progression or anything the price quickly jumps up. Just my humble opinion.


1873ACE9-ED9D-4B88-A840-B78285BE9A75.jpeg
 
Dr Newnham said:
Of course everyone would be forced to purchase the boat chips at inflated prices. For example, if multiple brand new desirable houses were build in your area and are now for sale, the current market price will automatically be imposed on these new houses straight away. The buyers dont exactly have a choice. The seller are able to set prices above the average easily due to how well designed and desirable those chips are. These chips may not have affected the price significantly, but contributes to the slowing of the chipping economy. This doesnt bother me, just stating what i observed.
Click to expand...


Lol, I'm sorry but this argument seems utterly ridiculous to me.

When you live in a certain area there are home values based on a variety of factors. At the end of the day, no one forces you to live in a certain area. You can pay a premium to live closer to your work, or pay less and suffer a longer commute, as a for instance.

Given that I purchased my first home last year (a 3 bed, 2 bath doublewide on more than half an acre of land, conveniently located half a mile from my employer) for only 80 grand and pay $700/month on a 20-year note, you'll be hard pressed to convince me of the validity of this particular argument you're slinging here.

Just a few blocks down are half a million and million dollar homes (lakefront properties). I could cry that I don't have one of those really nice homes, but instead I find joy in the home I do have. Hell, I was paying $1,150/month in frigging rent for a 1 bed 1 bath up until I purchased my home. Now I have a ton more space, save $450/month in housing costs, a shorter commute and I'm building equity.

At the same time, I moved out of my 2013 Altima Coupe with a monthly payment in the $200 range and into my first brand new car ever, a 2017 Maxima which I pay around $600/month for at 0% interest.

Nobody forced me to purchase a cheaper home or a more expensive car, I made the choices on my own.

Likewise, nobody is "forced to purchase the boat chips at inflated prices". Just because something desirable exists doesn't give you the right of owning it. Saying "the buyers don't exactly have a choice" is again ludicrous. Of course they have a choice. They can choose to buy or not buy. They can buy other chips, they can pay less money than the boat chips were selling for and get their own custom set that nobody else owns for that matter, which is what I'd rather do with my money when that time comes.

Just because a Rolls Royce exists doesn't mean I'm going to cry that it's not fair that I'm stuck with my Maxima. There's a gazillion other vehicles or homes I could have chosen. The same applies with poker chips, there's tons of options out there.
 
Hey stocky

looks like you were right.

Secondly thank god for the boat chips. Have you seen the classifieds!?!? If that was all up to the boat chips i can only say well done people! The classifieds have not been this alive since the old site in its hey day!

and by the way accomplishing the impossible... Nice work...

thank god you diddnt pick the rhc mold. all my paulsons are RHC. they are nice but not my cup of tea.

I love what i love. a tourney and a cash set of mint rhc paulsons... it took years but there mine!!!!! all mine.... my precious....

not to mention the thousand odd china clays for mtts.

I also have a box of shame.... all those slugged chips.

Personally i have been blessed by this community. Thank you all.

Sure there are divisions, but any online group of enthusiasts get emotional. then we get vocal. sometimes add beer, then we hit the keyboard

ill put my hand up. Ive done it (minus the beer i dont drink. yeah im a weirdo... but i'm handsome and my charm gets me through! Please don't hate me cause im handsome), and I've apologized more than once. Not for being handsome, when ive hit the keyboard with a feeling.

PS we are a fairly weird bunch of individuals. Ever spoken to someone outside the community about what you have invested in chips? I have a hard time justifying it to myself sometimes. or how you got the blister on your thumb from relabeling 1000 chips? Who would do that!?!?

So yeah there are a bunch of passionate weirdos with feelings and the internet. What did u expect?!?!

one thing learnt from this is - no matter what you do, sooner or later a new scandal will appear.

I love you guys!
 
@Jonesey07
What I wrote was exactly based on the CPC price list you were kind enough to post.
According to that list, these beauties
6D18.png

can be had for $3.68 each (Level 8 6D18 edge spots, Jockey mold, inlaid)

I have the impression that very similar if not identical mint Paulson THCs may sell for even more, but again I might be wrong.
 
Coyote said:
@Jonesey07
What I wrote was exactly based on the CPC price list you were kind enough to post.
According to that list, these beauties
View attachment 199544
can be had for $3.68 each (Level 8 6D18 edge spots, Jockey mold, inlaid)

I have the impression that very similar if not identical mint Paulson THCs may sell for even more, but again I might be wrong.
Click to expand...

That proves my point of the barrier to entry. One rack of those chips would cost $368. The boat chips were sold at under $2 for every chip.
 
You can get a nice spot progression without a bunch of level 8 chips.

I've got a level 10 in my set, but it's the highest denomination and that's only 20 chips. The average cost of my set is about $2.25.
 

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