Tourney Tournament Denominations (1 Viewer)

[GamingWithChips]

Quick question here. I’m doing some research to build a tournament set. I’m trying to do a 300 chip set for 4-8 people max. I see most standard tournament sets go:
T25
T100
T500
T1,000
T5,000
T25,000
Etc etc

I also see in a lot of discussions that people say when building sets your denomination should be either 4 or 5 times the lower denomination (ie 25x4 = 100, and 100x5 = 500).

Why is it that there is a 500 chip and a 1000 chip?

Wouldn’t it make sense to have your denominations go:
T25
T100
T500
T2,500 (or 2,000)
T10,000
T50,000
Etc etc

Is this just to make “better” partial bets, ie a 6000 bet with a 1x1000 and 1x5000? Whereas without the 1000 chip you’d have to use 2x500, and 2x2,500 to make the same bet?

Does anyone make their sets like I suggested above?

Thanks!

 

[tabletalker7]

I played in a tournament that the chip set was made in a similar way as you suggested. Everyone was just confused. Nobody liked it. Casinos have been set up one way for so long that it has become what people expect. People don't like change

 

[MichaelBubly]

If you have a 2k-2.5k chip, you'd never be able to colour up the 500s because you'd always need odd denoms. I think overall it optimizes the amount of chips needed without compromising color ups and blind levels.

 

[GamingWithChips]

I played in a tournament that the chip set was made in a similar way as you suggested. Everyone was just confused. Nobody liked it. Casinos have been set up one way for so long that it has become what people expect. People don't like change

I kind of assumed that too, but was wondering if anyone has really tried it to see if it’s just flat out worse or not.

My only poker chip set right now kind of follows the “standard denominations” logic.

I have a micro stakes set where we play for $20 and have chips in the denominations of:
$0.05
$0.10
$0.25
$1
$5
$10
$25

I actually like having the middle ground chips as I like having different coloured chips for more variety and partial bets, I just thought it was a bit odd and does bug my OCD slightly lol

 

[Nine_high]

Quick question here. I’m doing some research to build a tournament set. I’m trying to do a 300 chip set for 4-8 people max. I see most standard tournament sets go:
T25
T100
T500
T1,000
T5,000
T25,000
Etc etc

I also see in a lot of discussions that people say when building sets your denomination should be either 4 or 5 times the lower denomination (ie 25x4 = 100, and 100x5 = 500).

Why is it that there is a 500 chip and a 1000 chip?

Wouldn’t it make sense to have your denominations go:
T25
T100
T500
T2,500 (or 2,000)
T10,000
T50,000
Etc etc

Is this just to make “better” partial bets, ie a 6000 bet with a 1x1000 and 1x5000? Whereas without the 1000 chip you’d have to use 2x500, and 2x2,500 to make the same bet?

Does anyone make their sets like I suggested above?

Thanks!

Some people do use a T2,000 chip etc but this is not all that common.

The 4-5x multiplier is the norm yes, but as you keep scaling up you eventually need to "reset" as you cross three orders of magnitude. 1,000 = 4 x 5 x 5 x 5 x 2. Normally the reset happens into three zeroes so 500 x 2 = 1,000 and 500,000 x 2 = 1,000,000 are common 2x multiplier denominations.

 

[GamingWithChips]

If you have a 2k-2.5k chip, you'd never be able to colour up the 500s because you'd always need odd denoms. I think overall it optimizes the amount of chips needed without compromising color ups and blind levels.

Ya that makes a lot of sense too, like I said in my other comment. I have a micro stakes set which follows a similar logic and is nice for optimizing between sized bets and I find it doesn’t force people to bet larger because of the next biggest chip denomination

Some people do use a T2,000 chip etc but this is not all that common.

The 4-5x multiplier is the norm yes, but as you keep scaling up you eventually need to "reset" as you cross three orders of magnitude. 1,000 = 4 x 5 x 5 x 5 x 2. Normally the reset happens into three zeroes so 500 x 2 = 1,000 and 500,000 x 2 = 1,000,000 are common 2x multiplier denominations.

I actually kind of like that, a soft reset at each next big milestone is kind of nice. Thanks!

 

[tabletalker7]

If you have a 2k-2.5k chip, you'd never be able to colour up the 500s because you'd always need odd denoms. I think overall it optimizes the amount of chips needed without compromising color ups and blind levels.

That tournament I mentioned earlier used a T2000. Everyone confused it for a T1000. I had to set up the blind structure for that hot mess. The color up for 500 had to be drastically delayed, which in turn messed up the normal break routine. It was all bad. Not something I look forward to doing again.

Now I understand the philosophy behind using a 2K instead of a 1K. By being more efficient you reduce the number of chips needed. Now, I could be mistaken, but isn't needing and getting less chips a violation of the terms of service here at PCF?

 

[GamingWithChips]

That tournament I mentioned earlier used a T2000. Everyone confused it for a T1000. I had to set up the blind structure for that hot mess. The color up for 500 had to be drastically delayed, which in turn messed up the normal break routine. It was all bad. Not something I look forward to doing again.

Now I understand the philosophy behind using a 2K instead of a 1K. By being more efficient you reduce the number of chips needed. Now, I could be mistaken, but isn't needing and getting less chips a violation of the terms of service here at PCF?

Haha, I think you are right about the second part for sure. But despite that I also wanted to build a “perfect” chip set for newbies like myself. This would be (only ) 300 chips, and it would be built for up to 8-10 players. I want to balance having efficiency in chip denominations because I only have 300 chips, but also a good flow in play and smooth colour ups etc. I think the easiest way to do it would be having $0.05, $0.25, $1, $5 and $20. This is like a cash set, but my friends play with cash denominations but tournament style because we often have really new players where I find it helps knowing the exact value of your chip (as it’s labeled) when making bets.

I am playing with a lot of different combinations and trying to see what would work best for most, as obviously each game is different.

 

[Nine_high]

I actually kind of like that, a soft reset at each next big milestone is kind of nice. Thanks!

Yup we naturally want single units of 1, 1,000, 1,000,000.

What's interesting (to me, anyway...I'm a math nerd) is the way our currency plays into this. You can theoretically start at .01 and scale up to 500 without ever needing to reset since our fractional currency is 1/100 not 1/1000 of a dollar. That lets you avoid a reset.

500 = .01 x 5 x 5 x 4 x 5 x 5 x 4 x 5

 

[Mr Winberg]

Quick question here. I’m doing some research to build a tournament set. I’m trying to do a 300 chip set for 4-8 people max. I see most standard tournament sets go:
T25
T100
T500
T1,000
T5,000
T25,000
Etc etc

I also see in a lot of discussions that people say when building sets your denomination should be either 4 or 5 times the lower denomination (ie 25x4 = 100, and 100x5 = 500).

Why is it that there is a 500 chip and a 1000 chip?

Wouldn’t it make sense to have your denominations go:
T25
T100
T500
T2,500 (or 2,000)
T10,000
T50,000
Etc etc

Is this just to make “better” partial bets, ie a 6000 bet with a 1x1000 and 1x5000? Whereas without the 1000 chip you’d have to use 2x500, and 2x2,500 to make the same bet?

Does anyone make their sets like I suggested above?

Thanks!

Here's some info:
https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/arguments-against-t25-t100-t500-t2000-t10000-sets.38197/

 

[tabletalker7]

I also wanted to build a “perfect” chip set for newbies like myself

That's the problem. Newbies only know what they have seen before. Casinos, TV, YouTube and all that ..... No one uses a T2000 chip. You know, you avoid all this by making a T5 base. Then your big chip can be a T500 and you never have to ask this question

 

[GamingWithChips]

That's the problem. Newbies only know what they have seen before. Casinos, TV, YouTube and all that ..... No one uses a T2000 chip. You know, you avoid all this by making a T5 base. Then your big chip can be a T500 and you never have to ask this question

Yup, you are right. And I didn’t really say this but I’m looking at many different kinds of sets, micro stakes to high roller. And while looking at different options and playing with different denominations I wanted to bring this up to see what others were thinking.

Although, my current set I do $0.05, 0.10, 0.25, 1, 5, 10, 25. So I’m kind of doing both at the moment ha.

It’s why I’m looking at all of this stuff before I go out and buy a set.

 

[GamingWithChips]

Yup, you are right. And I didn’t really say this but I’m looking at many different kinds of sets, micro stakes to high roller. And while looking at different options and playing with different denominations I wanted to bring this up to see what others were thinking.

Although, my current set I do $0.05, 0.10, 0.25, 1, 5, 10, 25. So I’m kind of doing both at the moment ha.

It’s why I’m looking at all of this stuff before I go out and buy a set.

And to reply to myself I’m also half debating going:
$0.05
$0.25
$1
$5
$20

But my friends like the $0.10 and $10 chips we are currently using, it’s a nice in between-er. Honestly the way ours games go, the $0.05 chip is basically a small blind chip until they get coloured out. We basically play $0.10/$0.25 and then move up through the tournament.

 

[tabletalker7]

Yup, you are right. And I didn’t really say this but I’m looking at many different kinds of sets, micro stakes to high roller. And while looking at different options and playing with different denominations I wanted to bring this up to see what others were thinking.

Although, my current set I do $0.05, 0.10, 0.25, 1, 5, 10, 25. So I’m kind of doing both at the moment ha.

It’s why I’m looking at all of this stuff before I go out and buy a set.

Alright. You want a tournament set. 300 chips. Up to 8 players. Have you used the "Poker Chip Calculator" in the resources section?

Even with color ups accounted for you can run a standard T10K with 8 8 4 7 starting stacks and still be below 300 chips. Why are we reinventing the wheel?

 

[Frogzilla]

I did a 2k/10k instead of 1k/5k and it’s not that big of a deal, but if I redid it or next tourney set I’ll probably stick with standard denoms.

 

[GamingWithChips]

Alright. You want a tournament set. 300 chips. Up to 8 players. Have you used the "Poker Chip Calculator" in the resources section?
View attachment 1102604
View attachment 1102605
View attachment 1102606
Even with color ups accounted for you can run a standard T10K with 8 8 4 7 starting stacks and still be below 300 chips. Why are we reinventing the wheel?

I have looked at a few calculators, but I’ve also made some excel sheets. I’m a bit of a perfectionist and I’m trying to balance different things in my set. I know I could do a standard tourney set, I saw one that recommend exactly what you suggested. But I’m experimenting with a hybrid set that is cash denominated, but played like a tournament set.

I would ideally do a $20 buy in, and then you get $20 in chips. So my set is similar to a T20K I think? And my starting stack likely has high 20’s or 30+ chips per person.

Ultimately I’m playing around and I like to look into things a research things before I commit. Just trying see what may or may not work. And a lot of what I’ve learned so far is from YouTube videos and some PCF threads. But I’m still new here so finding it a little hard to view/review different threads and find all of the info I’m looking for. I appreciate your input!

 

[tabletalker7]

I would ideally do a $20 buy in, and then you get $20 in chips. So my set is similar to a T20K I think?

$20 buy in, based on cash ...... You would have a starting stacks of $20.00 and your base chip is either a penny (yuk) or a nickel (standard micro stakes). Think more of it as a T2K not a T20K, and you have your standard T5 base tournament. Blinds would start out as 5¢/10¢ and work their way up. Research T5 base here. It is pretty standard. People have T5 base blind schedules posted. Just look at their blinds as cents instead of dollars and it will all line up perfectly

EDIT - Using this as your template, you could easily use $20 chips or plaques for color ups, which is what A LOT of us do with our micro stakes sets.

 

[GamingWithChips]

$20 buy in, based on cash ...... You would have a starting stacks of $20.00 and your base chip is either a penny (yuk) or a nickel (standard micro stakes). Think more of it as a T2K not a T20K, and you have your standard T5 base tournament. Blinds would start out as 5¢/10¢ and work their way up. Research T5 base here. It is pretty standard. People have T5 base blind schedules posted. Just look at their blinds as cents instead of dollars and it will all line up perfectly

EDIT - Using this as your template, you could easily use $20 chips or plaques for color ups, which is what A LOT of us do with our micro stakes sets.

Ya, I think a lot of what I have been doing works as the standard some people do, but another consideration is my friend group play a slow and casual game compared to most I see here. Our blind levels have been known to last 45-1hour! (don’t judge us lol).

My latest thought is just skipping the $0.05 outright and going:
$0.10
$0.25
$1
$5
$10
$25

With a starting stack of:
$0.10x15 = $1.50
$0.25x10 = $2.50
$1 x6 = $6
$5 x2 = $10

Our blinds are not structured yet which is a bad thing, our blinds have also been known to double where my friends agree is crazy but they also want each level to last a super long time.

I’m trying to balance things and maybe do 30 minute levels with some bigger than normal blind jumps to balance things out.

I will check out the T5 structures to see how I can compare and steal from them. Thanks!

 

[tabletalker7]

Most of us here would tell you a 10¢ chip is just a hot mess of change making, and that is why we use 5¢/25¢/$1/$5. Why do your players prefer that chip? Are you sure it isn't just a happy color that can be used for something else?

 

[Sprouty]

What about doing a 10x tourney?

$20 gets you $200 in chips.

Blinds start at $1/$1 for 200bb.

 

[GamingWithChips]

Most of us here would tell you a 10¢ chip is just a hot mess of change making, and that is why we use 5¢/25¢/$1/$5. Why do your players prefer that chip? Are you sure it isn't just a happy color that can be used for something else?

I’d have to experiment a bit but what happens right now is our small blind starts at $0.05, and each starting hand has 5 or ten of them, depending on how many people are playing. Since the big blind is $0.10, a standard bet for us is $0.20 or $0.30. And to place that bet most people use the $0.10 chips because it’s easier and honestly we typically don’t have enough $0.05 chips.

So the solution (or the easy solution) is just doing $0.05, $0.25, $1, $5 as a standard but part of me wants to experiment and get a good balance of having many different chip colours/denominations as possible with a small set.

Part of this idea is because I bought the 600 chip bird cage and I’d love to be able to store two separate 300 chip sets so we can mix it up and play with different sets depending on the night. And ideally the sets would play out the exact same way with the same starting hands and blinds.

Maybe it’s not worth the effort but I’d like to see what I can do.

 

[GamingWithChips]

What about doing a 10x tourney?

$20 gets you $200 in chips.

Blinds start at $1/$1 for 200bb.

Yup, and I’ve debated just scrapping this but we play with pennies basically, so our $100 chip is really $1 (or 100 pennies).

So our starting stack right now is technically $2000 in chips for a $20 buy in. I really wanted to keep the chip value equal to the price of the buy in but trying to balance a few things I’m finding it a little hard.

Like I said, I might just scrap this whole thing and buy a standard tournament set with $20K in a starting stack and be done with it haha, but I did want to play around and see what I can do and if it works

 

[Gunnar]

This is a rabbit hole that I have dived in as well. My local currency is Krónur so we have 500-1000-5000-10000 bills. So even every cash set that I have owned has a need for both 500 & 1000 (5$ and 10&) And I can't get away from it. I often dream about a 2000chip in a tournament set but I know most players won't like it.

For a micro set I once went 25-100-500-2500 and that was okey as the 2500 was a bigger chip, I really like that but I think I need a 1000 chip for all other stakes. I think if you have a steady group then you can get away with most things but consistency is key. The players that get overwhelmed with different denomations are usually the one that you really want to have in your game.

 

[GetUrShineBox]

I’d have to experiment a bit but what happens right now is our small blind starts at $0.05, and each starting hand has 5 or ten of them, depending on how many people are playing. Since the big blind is $0.10, a standard bet for us is $0.20 or $0.30. And to place that bet most people use the $0.10 chips because it’s easier and honestly we typically don’t have enough $0.05 chips.

So the solution (or the easy solution) is just doing $0.05, $0.25, $1, $5 as a standard but part of me wants to experiment and get a good balance of having many different chip colours/denominations as possible with a small set.

Part of this idea is because I bought the 600 chip bird cage and I’d love to be able to store two separate 300 chip sets so we can mix it up and play with different sets depending on the night. And ideally the sets would play out the exact same way with the same starting hands and blinds.

Maybe it’s not worth the effort but I’d like to see what I can do.

Making change with these denoms will be tedious, slow the game down, and confuse the dealer. Having two chips especially your blinds where multiples of the small blind cannot equal the big blind is tilting.
0.10/0.25 blinds you simply can't just limp in without pulling your 0.10 back and throwing in a .25, oh but wait i don't have a 0.25 so I need to throw in a $1 and get change, but there isn't 0.75 in the pot so now your neighbor with all the 0.25's has to give you change.
Now the flop comes and someone bets 0.30 or 0.40 and multiple players in that hand don't have the exact amount of 0.10's to call that bet now each one of them needs to throw in 0.50 and get more change. Oh now someone is all in for $4.95, ok now two players call but one only has 3.85 and the other just throws in a $5 chip and will get change, oh no wait there are no 0.05 chips, ok so now what???????

It's super cOnfUsiNg!!! lol

If it ain't broke, don't fix it!!!

 

[GamingWithChips]

Making change with these denoms will be tedious, slow the game down, and confuse the dealer. Having two chips especially your blinds where multiples of the small blind cannot equal the big blind is tilting.
0.10/0.25 blinds you simply can't just limp in without pulling your 0.10 back and throwing in a .25, oh but wait i don't have a 0.25 so I need to throw in a $1 and get change, but there isn't 0.75 in the pot so now your neigher with all the 0.25's has to give you change.
Now the flop comes and someone bets 0.30 or 0.40 and multiple players in that hand don't have the exact amount of 0.10's to call that bet now each one of them needs to throw in 0.50 and get more change. Oh now someone is all in for $4.95, ok now two players call but one only has 3.85 and the other just throws in a $5 chip and get change, oh no wait there are no 0.05 chips, ok so now what???????

It's super cOnfUsiNg!!! lol

If it ain't broke, don't fix it!!!

Haha good point. That’s why I need to experiment. It’s super easy to get lost in the numbers (ie denoms and blinds) only to find out the game doesn’t flow well.

Like you said, I might just give up and go with the standard 0.05, 0.25, 1, 5…but I will continue to look and try first!

 

[tabletalker7]

So the solution (or the easy solution) is just doing $0.05, $0.25, $1, $5 as a standard

IMG_20200228_115314.jpg

• tabletalker7
• Apr 30, 2020

quick breakdown

IMG_20200228_115231.jpg

• tabletalker7
• Apr 30, 2020

Micro Stakes

That's what I did

 

[BGinGA]

Haha good point. That’s why I need to experiment. It’s super easy to get lost in the numbers (ie denoms and blinds) only to find out the game doesn’t flow well.

Like you said, I might just give up and go with the standard 0.05, 0.25, 1, 5…but I will continue to look and try first!

Suffice it to say that the reason that the 1/5/25/100/500 variations are "standard" denominations is because of the improved game play they provide.

 

[GamingWithChips]

IMG_20200228_115314.jpg

• tabletalker7
• Apr 30, 2020

quick breakdown

IMG_20200228_115231.jpg

• tabletalker7
• Apr 30, 2020

Micro Stakes

That's what I did

Nice, I was thinking of the same with the plaques but with CAD where’d the plaques come from?

 

[GamingWithChips]

Suffice it to say that the reason that the 1/5/25/100/500 variations are "standard" denominations is because of the improved game play they provide.

Absolutely, things get worked on and ironed out over time. But I know our game is already a little non standard, so I wanted to see if I could make a nice custom set that fits us “perfectly” but isn’t too much of a deviation from the normal as you said, the normal/standard just works.

 

[tabletalker7]

where’d the plaques come from?

https://www.apachepokerchips.com/product/andrew-jackson-20-plaque/

was thinking of the same with the plaques but with CAD

https://www.chanmanpokertables.com/product-page/canadian-currency-plaques