St Joe's chips - scammed by @5aces (8 Viewers)
- Thread starter DerberAlter
- Start date
5aces
Full House
Since he started to slender me on other forums as well, linking to this thread I should add some words to explain my position before thread is closed.
He had these pictures ( https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/by-best-offer-best-of-st-jos-frontier.41149/ he was linked to the thread, posted...), a description saying these have cracks, he already had a rack in the same (to me less valuable condition, otherwise I wouldn‘t have sold it first), he threatens and abuses me by pm and openly and I should refund money?!
I sorted the edge spots to show average condition. Is this wrong? Scam?
Are 300€ too much for this rack?! I had an offer for 260$ in the same week from an US buyer. He offered more. Is it condemnable as a seller to take as much as possible, even you said several times „I don’t want to break the set up“ or "I don't want to sell this rack"?!
300€ are a lot FOR SURE, but I wouldn’t have sold my last (and to me best rack) for 250€.
Now I am just done with this "guy".
What about all seller buying AS, ES, BTP or PNY chips on the primary market and selling them for 3,6,8,10,15 or 35$ per chip?! All scammers?? Selling buy auction? Scammers? Selling with profit? Scammers?
I really appreciate some messages I have received talking to me, trying to help, but this and the other threads are like a witch hunt. People judge very fast just because one member spams the forum telling lies (to me).
I consider to leave the forum because of this... really. I am not a drama queen, but’s after 12 years of CT and PCF it‘s hard to believe that such an open discussion possible and judgments are spoken very fast.
It becomes a matter of principles to me after he threatens and abused myself.
Sebastian
He had these pictures ( https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/by-best-offer-best-of-st-jos-frontier.41149/ he was linked to the thread, posted...), a description saying these have cracks, he already had a rack in the same (to me less valuable condition, otherwise I wouldn‘t have sold it first), he threatens and abuses me by pm and openly and I should refund money?!
I sorted the edge spots to show average condition. Is this wrong? Scam?
Are 300€ too much for this rack?! I had an offer for 260$ in the same week from an US buyer. He offered more. Is it condemnable as a seller to take as much as possible, even you said several times „I don’t want to break the set up“ or "I don't want to sell this rack"?!
300€ are a lot FOR SURE, but I wouldn’t have sold my last (and to me best rack) for 250€.
Now I am just done with this "guy".
What about all seller buying AS, ES, BTP or PNY chips on the primary market and selling them for 3,6,8,10,15 or 35$ per chip?! All scammers?? Selling buy auction? Scammers? Selling with profit? Scammers?
I really appreciate some messages I have received talking to me, trying to help, but this and the other threads are like a witch hunt. People judge very fast just because one member spams the forum telling lies (to me).
I consider to leave the forum because of this... really. I am not a drama queen, but’s after 12 years of CT and PCF it‘s hard to believe that such an open discussion possible and judgments are spoken very fast.
It becomes a matter of principles to me after he threatens and abused myself.
Sebastian
RocAFella1
Royal Flush
Sebastian, I appreciate you taking the time to reply to this. I have wanted to hear your side so it isn’t a witch hunt and people can hear your side as well.
IMHO the pictures in your ad are VERY different from the pictures of the actual chips.
I will say that if I saw your ad and got these chips, I would not be happy with them. In your pictures, there is not a crack to be seen.
I can understand why it feels like a witch hunt from your point of view. However do you realize how your pictures and the actual chips differ?
DerberAlter
Flush
not the same. they came without cracks. for gods sake
First I asked you nice and friendly in private message about refunding the money (and I pay all shipping costs) and I also give you the option to reduce the price in case you don't want them back.
But you made clear, that refunding the money is no option for you and you started offending me.
So what should I do? Of course I put the pressure on you, so I told the truth here in the forum, because it's the only thing I left - more many reasons
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DerberAlter
Flush
I don't lie at all. Not a single word. This is ridiculous. You scammed me and now you face the consequences. this is just reality.
RocAFella1
Royal Flush
The issue is not selling for profit here. It is simply the condition of the chips. If I sold you chips that I claimed were mint (never used) but the chips came with flea bites and color transfer, how would you feel? When people sell BTP, boat chips, etc., people know the condition of the chips they are receiving. @DerberAlter was willing to pay the premium for chips that were cherry picked and would not have many cracks. However, he received chips that did not meet his standard. If someone sold me “mint” boat chips and I received boat chips with many flea bites, I would not be happy either.
DerberAlter
Flush
I will upload the complete private conversation history to a third platform. ask via pm for url
moose
4 of a Kind
I don't know what you are talking about. In the rack pic you can clearly see 3 cracked chips in the first barrel. The second barrel shows at least 4 cracked chips, including the very front chip, and so on. The second pic both chips are cracked at the right hand edge spot. The second chip is cracked all the way to the inlay for Christ's sake.
If I am dropping 300 euros on chips and seller clearly states in all his ads that the chips are cracked and I can't see the cracks then I am asking for more pics. He even offers more pics in his ad.
I've been hassled to death before by a different euro buyer and it is super annoying when you give in to an aggressive buyer and then the deal goes bad.
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DerberAlter
Flush
please show this picture to someone and ask him about the condition of those. if this person never handled those broken chips, the chance are high, that this person will not see the cracks. but this is not the major issue here.
If I am selling cracked chips for 300 euro in private conversation, I should mention the cracks
Okay ... cool story ... so what?
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RocAFella1
Royal Flush
Maybe I need glasses but the chips in these pics
RocAFella1
Royal Flush
Would I have asked for more pics of the cracks? Personally, most definitely because I’m picky. However just based on the pics on the ad, if I received chips like that I would be disappointed too.
asian bino
Two Pair
Pics sketchy from seller.
1. Get chips returned
2. refund money
3. Post legit pics if you want to resell.
4. Regain good rep.
It's really simple. If the 300 euros means that much to you, you are in the wrong hobby.
1. Get chips returned
2. refund money
3. Post legit pics if you want to resell.
4. Regain good rep.
It's really simple. If the 300 euros means that much to you, you are in the wrong hobby.
moose
4 of a Kind
You know he has the chips because of the ads. You are the one asking him to sell you the chips. He knows you are contacting him because of the ads. Is he supposed to say, hey btw did you read the fucking ad? Did he at any point represent the chips to you as not cracked?
If I show those pictures to someone and say, these chips are cracked, please find the cracks, I'm pretty they could look and see some chips are cracked.
There are cracked chips in the pics. He didn't line up all the chips so that all the cracks are hidden. The front fucking chip in barrel two is cracked.
You lined up all the chips to show the cracks. You have only shown a barrel of presumably the worst chips to make your point. You say the original rack is not cracked but they are also more clearly worn than the second rack and where is the equivalent zoomed in pic showing both sides of the chip so that we know they are not cracked. Given that the chips are cracked the seller obviously considered that cracked St. Jos are a fact of life and that he thought the sharper edges of the last rack represented better condition chips.
So what? I can only imagine that you were just as fucking aggressive before the fact are you are now after the fact.
I would be "get the fuck out of my face too".
If I can see the cracks on a five inch cell phone screen you need glasses.
DerberAlter
Flush
Nope. you missed big parts of the topic. Some months ago I bought a first rack of those chips from him, and they had no cracks. Mid of may I asked him in private conversation about another 1 or 2 racks of them. he sold me "the best rack" for 300 euro. he never mentioned with words or pictures to me that those chips are broken.
https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/st-joes-chips-scammed-by-5aces.42610/page-2#post-792844
https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/st-joes-chips-scammed-by-5aces.42610/page-2#post-792872
https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/st-joes-chips-scammed-by-5aces.42610/page-2#post-792898
BonScot
Straight Flush
Woah! Somebody’s an angry drunk
moose
4 of a Kind
Finally if he was trying to rip you off do you think he would sell you a rack of chips with no cracks and keep back a rack of cracked chips as some sort of crazy meta scam to convince you to buy the second rack but ha ha fooled you these are the cracked chips.
No, he wasn't even trying to sell the last rack. YOU wanted them.
Get the fuck out of here.
No, he wasn't even trying to sell the last rack. YOU wanted them.
Get the fuck out of here.
DerberAlter
Flush
you are wrong. I will picture now all 5 barrels. please let's just talk with facts, not with fiction. thank you @moose
I wanted good chips for good money. I got broken chips. where is my fault here?
moose
4 of a Kind
You are a stjo owner. Eyes wide open. You know many of these chips were cracked. As has been stated before the cracks don't affect the playability of the chips. The cracks aren't fatal and the chips are not breaking in half. They are cracked not broken, as you continue to say. Stjo owners accept this and live with the cracks.
Did you ever once ask him, so like I know many of the chips are cracked but these are not cracked right?
Seriously why wouldn't the last rack he keeps back be the ones that 5aces considers the best condition?
How did he scam you when he didn't want to sell you the chips and you convinced him to do it? Did he ever represent the chips as not cracked to you?
In your eagerness to acquire more chips you were hoping they weren't cracked but they were and you didn't ask and now you have buyers remorse. Live with it. Other than the cracks, which are the fault of the hotstamping, not the seller, they appear to be pretty much mint condition. You are the owner, sell them if you no longer want them. Many people buy chips, don't like them and resell them but they don't cry about it.
Did you ever once ask him, so like I know many of the chips are cracked but these are not cracked right?
Seriously why wouldn't the last rack he keeps back be the ones that 5aces considers the best condition?
How did he scam you when he didn't want to sell you the chips and you convinced him to do it? Did he ever represent the chips as not cracked to you?
In your eagerness to acquire more chips you were hoping they weren't cracked but they were and you didn't ask and now you have buyers remorse. Live with it. Other than the cracks, which are the fault of the hotstamping, not the seller, they appear to be pretty much mint condition. You are the owner, sell them if you no longer want them. Many people buy chips, don't like them and resell them but they don't cry about it.
slisk250
Straight Flush
DerberAlter
Flush
okay now I got it. you troll
Oggy
Flush
Its a fight between German Chipers! So we are sure it will not happen a 3th World War
Seriously, I hope everything will be fine for both of u!
Peace, Love and Poker Chips!
Seriously, I hope everything will be fine for both of u!
Peace, Love and Poker Chips!
BonScot
Straight Flush
You staying neutral?Its a fight between German Chipers! So we are sure it will not happen a 3th World War
Seriously, I hope everything will be fine for both of u!
Peace, Love and Poker Chips!
Oggy
Flush
and you? you finally decide if you want to be in Europa or not? ChipXit or Not?You staying neutral?
Changster
Full House
5 Aces... he had an Ace up his sleeve!!
Sorry bad joke.
Sorry bad joke.
BonScot
Straight Flush
We’re too busy fighting amongst ourselves about independence never mind Brexitand you? you finally decide if you want to be in Europa or not? ChipXit or Not?
Stevosan
High Hand
I have a rack of these chips and just went through them noticing about half have noticeable cracks. Something in this thread doesn't make sense.
The first rack apparently only contained chips in perfect condition with no noticeable cracks, which is a miracle of biblical proportions (#BLESSED). The second rack apparently only contains chips with very noticeable cracks. Unless you believe in some serious lotto type random event, someone sorted the good / bad chips between these two racks and only the buyer / seller know who did.
I only point this out since so many people have jumped on the finger pointing bandwagon assuming villain / victim roles when we do not know exactly what happened. I don't pretend to know, but I am saying that insisting the seller take a rack of cracked chips back for a full refund that may have been sorted by the buyer with another rack is not necessarily the "fair" option that has been suggested by nearly every person that posted in this thread.
Finally, IMHO, if we were talking a full set of chips sold for a few thousand, I would be more sympathetic for the refund request and then this scam-thread troll job. But all this fuss for one rack of chips after already buying two racks from the same set and seller? A simple check on this site using the available search function would have highlighted the cracked chip issue for this set. Buyer beware (and do a little research next time.) I have a full set of these chips and enjoy putting them in play for my group's .25 / .50 games. I think the hairline cracks are part of the story for how these chips were rescued and sold to those of us that collect and value authentic casino chips.
Again, don't @at me bro as I'm not trying to say who is the villain / victim, but the rest of us don't know either.
P.S. - "Like" if you've ever received an unsolicited DM from DerberAlter asking you to sell chips to him that you never listed. #METOO!
The first rack apparently only contained chips in perfect condition with no noticeable cracks, which is a miracle of biblical proportions (#BLESSED). The second rack apparently only contains chips with very noticeable cracks. Unless you believe in some serious lotto type random event, someone sorted the good / bad chips between these two racks and only the buyer / seller know who did.
I only point this out since so many people have jumped on the finger pointing bandwagon assuming villain / victim roles when we do not know exactly what happened. I don't pretend to know, but I am saying that insisting the seller take a rack of cracked chips back for a full refund that may have been sorted by the buyer with another rack is not necessarily the "fair" option that has been suggested by nearly every person that posted in this thread.
Finally, IMHO, if we were talking a full set of chips sold for a few thousand, I would be more sympathetic for the refund request and then this scam-thread troll job. But all this fuss for one rack of chips after already buying two racks from the same set and seller? A simple check on this site using the available search function would have highlighted the cracked chip issue for this set. Buyer beware (and do a little research next time.) I have a full set of these chips and enjoy putting them in play for my group's .25 / .50 games. I think the hairline cracks are part of the story for how these chips were rescued and sold to those of us that collect and value authentic casino chips.
Again, don't @at me bro as I'm not trying to say who is the villain / victim, but the rest of us don't know either.
P.S. - "Like" if you've ever received an unsolicited DM from DerberAlter asking you to sell chips to him that you never listed. #METOO!
Geremie
Full House
Wait...who is selling crack?
DerberAlter
Flush
First Batch: 100x $0.5
- excellent condition (based on sharpness of edges)
- the cancellation stamps were removed
- no cracks
Second Batch: 100x $0.5
- near mint (based on sharpness of edges)
- the cancellation stamps were NOT removed
- cracks
DerberAlter
Flush
I bought those chips to mill them and make quarters from them. Is is possible to mill chips with cracks? or will they maybe break? This is the only question left from my side
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