Tourney Rate my Structure (2 Viewers)

[Snapplefacts]

Hey guys, I’ve been really excited to put some new chips into play and I came up with a fun way to do it.
I’m calling it the Millionaire Maker (original, I know) and adding a bounty twist. I have 10 players at a single table each starting ultra-deep with 100k. I’ve gone back and forth for whether to include T25s or not, but I settled on moar chips and keeping them in play until the 1st break.

Starting stacks are:
8x 25
8x 100
6x 500
11x 1k
7x 5k
2x 25k
1x BOUNTY

My group has always been excited about the idea of a bounty tournament and they love the idea of playing super deep and feeling like they’re on poker after dark or something - but they’re generally cash players and I don’t want the tourney to feel like it’s dragging.

Here’s my preliminary blinds structure:

[+0:00] -- 50 / 100
[+0:20] -- 100 / 200
[+0:40] -- 300 / 600
[+1:00] -- 500 / 1000
[+1:20] -- 500 / 1000 /1000
[+1:40] -- 700 / 1400 /1400
——- BREAK ——— (Race 100s?)
[+2:00] -- 1000 / 2000 /2000
[+2:20] -- 2000 / 4000 /4000
[+2:40] -- 3000 / 6000 /6000
[+3:00] -- 6000 / 12000 /12k
——- BREAK ——— (Race 500s?)
[+3:20] -- 10000 / 20000 /20k
[+3:40] -- 15000 / 30000 /30k
[+4:00] -- 30000 / 60000 /60k
[+4:20] -- 40000 / 80000 /80k
[+4:40] -- 70000 / 140000 /140k
[+5:00] -- 100000 / 200000 /200k

My guess is the tourney will end around level 11 or 12, but possibly earlier knowing my group.

Anyway let me know what you think, and as reward for reading here is some pr0n

 

[SlowPokeTony]

Structure is really bad. First 2 levels are almost meaningless in comparison to the jumps that are coming up. Get rid of the 25s completely. Start at 100/200, 200/400, 300/600 for the first hour and then remove the 100s. 500/1000, 1000/1500, 1000/2000, 1500/3000, 2000/4000, 2500/5000, remove 500s.

 

[bergs]

You put the Turbo in hey this TURnament BlOws. This is way too fast. Ditch the 25s has suggested earlier and find a tourney structure that is a slower tourney with 10K in starting stacks. Multiple those blinds by 10 starting with the 100/200 level. Skip the antes unless you play with nits, they just get in the way.

Curious how many players and what duration you’re thinking for the levels.

 

[Snapplefacts]

You put the Turbo in hey this TURnament BlOws. This is way too fast. Ditch the 25s has suggested earlier and find a tourney structure that is a slower tourney with 10K in starting stacks. Multiple those blinds by 10 starting with the 100/200 level. Skip the antes unless you play with nits, they just get in the way.

Curious how many players and what duration you’re thinking for the levels.

Ouch tell me how ya really feel!
My goal was to create a super-deep stack tournament. I have 10 players and my thought was 20 minute levels with an endpoint around 4 hours. I think deep down I knew the 25s were going to be excessive. My original idea had the lowest denom being T100, so I’m glad I was talked back from the edge here

 

[bergs]

Ouch tell me how ya really feel!
My goal was to create a super-deep stack tournament. I have 10 players and my thought was 20 minute levels with an endpoint around 4 hours. I think deep down I knew the 25s were going to be excessive. My original idea had the lowest denom being T100, so I’m glad I was talked back from the edge here

I thought it was funny, but I certainly wouldn’t take anything anyone says here personally

 

[SlowPokeTony]

Super deep and just 4 hours is tough. You have to jump up really quickly. My last post ends at 2500/5000 after 3 hours but with a million in play you still have a ways to go. Maybe at that point drop it to 15 minute levels and hope to be done within 5 hours? 3/6, 4/8, 5/10, 6/12, 8/16, 10/20, 15/30, 20/40

 

[upNdown]

It’s just ridiculous having a t25 chip in a 100,000 stack. I guess given those parameters, your structure isn’t bad. But the parameters are dumb. Ditch the t25 and start at 100/200/200. Then you can smooth out your structure a bit.

Or you can do it the way you want. Plenty of people do plenty of things at their home games that many of us think are dumb, and I’m sure they’re still having fun.

 

[Snapplefacts]

I thought it was funny, but I certainly wouldn’t take anything anyone says here personally

I thought it was hilarious, nothing taken personally at all!

 

[Snapplefacts]

It’s just ridiculous having a t25 chip in a 100,000 stack. I guess given those parameters, your structure isn’t bad. But the parameters are dumb. Ditch the t25 and start at 100/200/200. Then you can smooth out your structure a bit.

Or you can do it the way you want. Plenty of people do plenty of things at their home games that many of us think are dumb, and I’m sure they’re still having fun.

Yeah it’s a bit ridiculous, part of the reason I posted was to check myself a bit. I’ve also never run BB ante in a home tourney but I thought it would help speed the structure a bit without having to balloon the blinds more than I already am

 

[Snapplefacts]

This is the structure from the WSOP monster stack T50k. Obviously that’s a much bigger field, but with a 100k starting stack I think this could work well as-is with maybe 10 or 15 minute levels

 

[upNdown]

This is the structure from the WSOP monster stack T50k. Obviously that’s a much bigger field, but with a 100k starting stack I think this could work well as-is with maybe 10 or 15 minute levels

You’ll probably want to skip some levels - that structure seems very slow.
This is like the three bears, but you’ll get there.

 

[Snapplefacts]

You’ll probably want to skip some levels - that structure seems very slow.
This is like the three bears, but you’ll get there.

what do we think of Goldilocks’ 3rd option?

[+0:00] - 100-200
[+0:15] - 200-400
[+0:30] - 300-600
[+0:45] - 400-800
[+1:00] - 500-1,000
[+1:15] - 600-1,200

[+1:30] - 1,000-2,000
[+1:45] - 1,500-3,000
[+2:00] - 2,000-4,000
[+2:15] - 3,000-6,000
[+2:30] - 4,000-8,000

[+2:45] - 5,000-10,000
[+3:00] - 8,000-16,000
[+3:15] - 10,000-20,000
[+3:30] - 10,000-25,000
[+3:45] - 15,000-30,000
[+4:00] - 20,000-40,000

[+4:15] - 25,000-50,000
[+4:30] - 40,000-80,000
[+4:45] - 60,000-120,000

 

[CSW]

Definitely some good advice in here already. @BGinGA is usually my go-to authority on stuff like this, but I’ll give you my thoughts on how I usually approach a structure question like this.

Start with your parameters and constraints. In this case, your most important parameters seem to be a 100,000 chip stack and 10 players. That means 1 million chips and play, and your tournament will likely end when the big blind is about 50,000 chips or so, give or take a level.

The next most important thing I would want to know is how long you want the tournament to last and how long you want the levels to be. In all of the forums I have looked at, it seems like everybody always wants to have long levels, and deep stacks, but somehow still get the tournament over in a relatively short amount of time. Just doesn’t work.

Sounds like you are beginning to settle for 15-minute levels and about a 4-hour tournament. I agree with the consensus here that given these priorities, dropping the T25 chip is the way to go. Maybe if you had 8 hours and just wanted to show off all the denoms, you could make it work. But best to start at the 100-200 level (200-400 would be better to smooth out the jumps in the lower levels, but I understand that it’s not really an ultra deep stack event at that point).

So, assuming 1M chips in play, starting blinds of 100-200, 15-minute levels, and 4 hours of play, you are looking at 16 levels to to get from a big blind of 200 to a big blind of somewhere around 50,000. That means you have 15 blind increases to get a roughly 250x total increase in blinds. So, x^15=250 (where X is the average blind increase per level) gives you an average blind increase of 45% per level. So, start at 100-200 and increase by roughly 45% per level (rounding to logical increments) and see how that goes. Something like:

100-200
100-300
200-400
300-600
500-1000
800-1600
1000-2000
1200-2400
2000-4000
3000-6000
4000-8000
6000-12000
8000-16000
12000-24000
20000-40000*
25000-50000*
40000-80000

*Tournament likely ends around level 15/16.

If you wanted 20-minute levels, you would only have 11 blind increases to get where you want to be, which gives you about 65% each increase.

Final note is that I normally agree with dropping the BB ante in single table tournaments (and I have actually been talked out of using it in all of my tournaments, even with three tables and people who want to get out in 3 hours). Here, it might help you speed things up on the margins and get out in time, but it won’t be the driving factor. Maybe gets you done one level sooner.

Hope this helps.

 

[Snapplefacts]

Definitely some good advice in here already. @BGinGA is usually my go-to authority on stuff like this, but I’ll give you my thoughts on how I usually approach a structure question like this.

Start with your parameters and constraints. In this case, your most important parameters seem to be a 100,000 chip stack and 10 players. That means 1 million chips and play, and your tournament will likely end when the big blind is about 50,000 chips or so, give or take a level.

The next most important thing I would want to know is how long you want the tournament to last and how long you want the levels to be. In all of the forums I have looked at, it seems like everybody always wants to have long levels, and deep stacks, but somehow still get the tournament over in a relatively short amount of time. Just doesn’t work.

Sounds like you are beginning to settle for 15-minute levels and about a 4-hour tournament. I agree with the consensus here that given these priorities, dropping the T25 chip is the way to go. Maybe if you had 8 hours and just wanted to show off all the denoms, you could make it work. But best to start at the 100-200 level (200-400 would be better to smooth out the jumps in the lower levels, but I understand that it’s not really an ultra deep stack event at that point).

So, assuming 1M chips in play, starting blinds of 100-200, 15-minute levels, and 4 hours of play, you are looking at 16 levels to to get from a big blind of 200 to a big blind of somewhere around 50,000. That means you have 15 blind increases to get a roughly 250x total increase in blinds. So, x^15=250 (where X is the average blind increase per level) gives you an average blind increase of 45% per level. So, start at 100-200 and increase by roughly 45% per level (rounding to logical increments) and see how that goes. Something like:

100-200
100-300
200-400
300-600
500-1000
800-1600
1000-2000
1200-2400
2000-4000
3000-6000
4000-8000
6000-12000
8000-16000
12000-24000
20000-40000*
25000-50000*
40000-80000

*Tournament likely ends around level 15/16.

If you wanted 20-minute levels, you would only have 11 blind increases to get where you want to be, which gives you about 65% each increase.

Final note is that I normally agree with dropping the BB ante in single table tournaments (and I have actually been talked out of using it in all of my tournaments, even with three tables and people who want to get out in 3 hours). Here, it might help you speed things up on the margins and get out in time, but it won’t be the driving factor. Maybe gets you done one level sooner.

Hope this helps.

This is awesome and detailed advice, thank you

 

[BGinGA]

T100-base deep-stack with 100k starting stacks (500bb):

L1 100/200
L2 200/300
L3 300/600
L4 500/1000
L5 800/1600
L6 1200/2400
remove T100/T500 chips
L7 2000/4000
L8 3000/6000
L9 5000/10000
L10 8000/16000
L11 12k/24k
remove T1000 chips
L12 20k/40k **eot
L13 30k/60k
L14 50k/100k

Average blinds increase is ~ 59% and blinds never double.

A 10-player BBA event using this structure should finish no later than L12, which is 4 hours plus breaks if using 20-minute blind levels (or 3 hours with 15-minute levels). Add a 100/100 starting level if you want 1000bb and have the extra time.

Use T5000 chips to color-up the T100 (3) and T500 chips (7), and use T25000 chips (6) to color-up the T1000 chips.

100k stack:
15 x T100
7 x T500
15 x T1000
11 x T5000
1 x T25000

chip set:
150 x T100
70 x T500
150 x T1000
120 x T5000 (includes 10x for color-ups)
16 x T25000 (includes 6x for color-ups)

 

[Snapplefacts]

I see why @BGinGA is the go-to. This is perfect, thank you for your help!

 

[detroitdad]

I think it's horrible for multiple reasons. I'll break it down more if your want. I recommend starting over.

Bill

 

[ovo]

@BGinGA Dave used to be the authority I would go to for breakdowns, but he's getting older and slipping, this is what I would do

T100-base deep-stack with 100k starting stacks (500bb):

L1 100/200
L2 200/300
L3 300/600
L4 500/1000
L5 800/1600
L6 1200/2400
remove T100/T500 chips
L7 2000/4000
L8 3000/6000
L9 5000/10000
L10 8000/16000
L11 12k/24k
remove T1000 chips
L12 20k/40k **eot
L13 30k/60k
L14 50k/100k

Average blinds increase is ~ 59% and blinds never double.

A 10-player BBA event using this structure should finish no later than L12, which is 4 hours plus breaks if using 20-minute blind levels (or 3 hours with 15-minute levels). Add a 100/100 starting level if you want 1000bb and have the extra time.

Use T5000 chips to color-up the T100 (3) and T500 chips (7) and use T25000 chips (6) to color-up the T1000 chips.

100k stack:
15 x T100
7 x T500
15 x T1000
11 x T5000
1 x T25000

chip set:
150 x T100
70 x T500
150 x T1000
120 x T5000 (includes 10x for color-ups)
16 x T25000 (includes 6x for color-ups)