PAHWM: Q10 in the big blind (1 Viewer)

[JMC9389]

Been a while since I did one.

Setting is a 0.25/0.25 NLHE cash game, full ring, 10 handed. Hero has about 180 BB's in the big blind. Two limpers to the cutoff who has about 250 BB's, pops it to $1.50, which has been a standard open for the most part tonight to this point. Button and small blind fold. Hero looks down at in the big blind with the two limpers behind.

Hero?

 

[springbox]

Offsuit 1 gapper facing a 6BB open where we'll potentially be 4 ways OOP? Fold. We're never getting enough folds to justify a 3b here and it's going to be very hard to get to showdown with this hand if we call.

 

[RagingAZN]

The RIO with a hand like this is huge so no thank you, I’m folding!

 

[MichaelBubly]

Probably folding OOP for 6BB with 2 players to act.

 

[Jimulacrum]

Unless one of these opponents is mega-exploitable in some way, I have to agree with the rest of the thread so far.

Save your money for better spots.

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

Fold and act like its a big imposition. Sigh, act frustrated, and mention some recent struggles with ED.

 

[dpeks13]

How bad was the tilt? Obvious fold but if it’s been one of those days…

 

[theshepherd]

I'll call with you, Joe.. let's go get 'em!

 

[MichaelBubly]

I guess I'll add an adjustment. If I'm up a bunch, a few beers in I'm almost 100% flicking in the call and losing the max with top pair on the flop. Or been seeing shit cards for an hour and desperate to see a flop. But normal me is folding.

 

[WedgeRock]

Fold and act like its a big imposition. Sigh, act frustrated, and mention some recent struggles with ED.

Don't forget bitching about the Islanders

 

[JMC9389]

Don't forget bitching about the Islanders

Rangers*

On topic, I think that there's still enough equity for a call, or better yet, a three bet to get the marginal hands like Ax, suited connectors, or low pocket pairs that didn't raise out in early position out of the hand to try and get this heads up with the cut off. Hero has no reads on the raising villain or his playstyle as he's only sat down with them for about 90 minutes at the table that night.

The question is, how do we size a three bet here? Do we go big to punish the limpers or go small to exercise pot control and hope to fold out at least one limper to get it heads up or three ways. Either way, this is a clear fold to a back 4 bet.

This is what happened though. In retrospect, I hate my play here. Hero ends up flat calling. Looking back, I think that this is a fold>>raise>call. Suited one gappers can made a stronger case to three bet to fold out those aforementioned hands that don't want to play a bloated pot multiways.

Fortunately, the two limpers folded and its heads up to the flop. Pot $3.75.

Flop comes

Hero?

 

[RagingAZN]

Agree with you about the 3! being better than calling. Folding is still by far the best option though.

I think being OOP with a marginal hand, we really want to win PF/get rid of as many as we can so we go bigger.

As played, I’m check calling any reasonable c-bet here. As best a flop as we could’ve hoped for.

PS: When you say the cutoff flat calls, he is the initial raiser right?

 

[JMC9389]

Agree with you about the 3! being better than calling. Folding is still by far the best option though.

I think being OOP with a marginal hand, we really want to win PF/get rid of as many as we can so we go bigger.

As played, I’m check calling any reasonable c-bet here. As best a flop as we could’ve hoped for.

PS: When you say the cutoff flat calls, he is the initial raiser right?

Correct. Edited.

 

[WedgeRock]

If you are calling the PF raise, what kinda flop were you hoping for?

 

[Legend5555]

This is just a fold pre. It can be an low frequency adventurous 3 bet if suited. But even then, fold I think would be standard.

Though, the are lineups and games where I don't just have a 3 bet or fold strategy on this spot. And QTs wouldn't be the worst call against certain players. But it's still hard to play OOP.

 

[JMC9389]

If you are calling the PF raise, what kinda flop were you hoping for?

That one.

 

[WedgeRock]

That one.

Top pair, fourth kicker, OOP? All in to see where you're at in the hand.

 

[springbox]

check/call flop, check/call turn, check/call the river all in when no flushes or reasonable straights or higher cards come in, get shown the bad news with KQ or AQ.

In all seriousness, probably do look to check/call the flop. If the flop goes x/x lead blank turns. We can have 77 and 55 here but so can CO, and we don't have any of the better Qs because we'd have 3 bet with them (KQo+ QJs+). The best Q we can reasonably have is QJo.

 

[Jimulacrum]

Rangers*

On topic, I think that there's still enough equity for a call, or better yet, a three bet to get the marginal hands like Ax, suited connectors, or low pocket pairs that didn't raise out in early position out of the hand to try and get this heads up with the cut off. Hero has no reads on the raising villain or his playstyle as he's only sat down with them for about 90 minutes at the table that night.

The question is, how do we size a three bet here? Do we go big to punish the limpers or go small to exercise pot control and hope to fold out at least one limper to get it heads up or three ways. Either way, this is a clear fold to a back 4 bet.

This is what happened though. In retrospect, I hate my play here. Hero ends up flat calling. Looking back, I think that this is a fold>>raise>call. Suited one gappers can made a stronger case to three bet to fold out those aforementioned hands that don't want to play a bloated pot multiways.

Fortunately, the two limpers folded and its heads up to the flop. Pot $3.75.

Flop comes

Hero?

Straight-up shove and lose everything to AQ right on the flop.

Less painful than going round by round.

 

[JMC9389]

Right then, Hero considers leading out here for about 3/4 pot to see where they're at, but even with drilling the flop almost the best way possible, hero should be checking 99% of the time. With a flop like this that is rather dry, hero has very little reason to think we don't have the best hand. Considering this, hero checks.

Villain leads out for $1.50 into $3.75. Hero?

 

[RagingAZN]

If we’re calling PF, we’re calling this bet.

 

[warma]

The good news is, you bet like you had something, so the might assume you do have something. So what do you want your story to be? What are you repping?

 

[dpeks13]

"and then I raised and he folded. The end."

 

[Frogzilla]

Good squeeze spot to $8ish but folding this one

QTs fine. ATo fine. QTo muckeroo.

As played, check flop.

 

[CantSpellPoker]

Fold > 3-bet > call preflop, in this setting, IMO.

Check-call on the flop. This is the exact flop we envisioned, no need to overcomplicate things. Once you commit to playing , you couldn’t have asked for much better. See what the turn brings.

 

[Taghkanic]

Preflop fold or 3bet to clear out the limpers; calling worst option. 3bet only if you think the original raiser is too wide or likely to play poorly postflop.

On the flop, check-call or check-raise any “normal” cbet. Check-raise if you think the villain is mostly just auto betting Ax that missed or underpairs.

The value of a check-raise is that it might actually save you money. It makes it more likely things will check through on the turn and maybe even the river. If the villain calls and then keeps betting later streets, or reraises you on the flop, fold.. and you’ve only lost that one extra bet rather than getting into murky/dangerous waters.

Hard to game out though with no reads on the villain (who might actually be the hero here?).

 

[JMC9389]

I'm glad there were a couple of calls here to potentially check raise. Hero considered it, but there's still potentially a bit of equity to pick up on future streets. Hero should still be ahead of quite a bit that would continue with a c-bet. Any low to mid pocket pair, AK, Suited ace, etc.

Hero opts for a flat call. Pot $6.75.

Turn: on a flop of

Hero?

 

[grandmeme]

Make a big deal out of the fact that there are two 7c and get your money back. Phew!

I check.

 

[RagingAZN]

I think check-raising on the flop is a bad option in this case because it allows villain to play perfectly. He will fold all his worse hands and only continue with hands that beat us.

We shouldn’t have QQ here and are we really going to be check raising 55 or 77 on this dry flop? As @Taghkanic said though, its always hard without a read.

The turn is another good card for us. As played, I’m checking on this turn and still calling I think but this is why calling PF with marginal hands is trouble!

 

[Perthmike]

Right then, Hero considers leading out here for about 3/4 pot to see where they're at, but even with drilling the flop almost the best way possible, hero should be checking 99% of the time. With a flop like this that is rather dry, hero has very little reason to think we don't have the best hand. Considering this, hero checks.

Villain leads out for $1.50 into $3.75. Hero?

Thinking about villains calling 6x OOP with Q10 offsuit and donking their flopped top pair to see where they are at, really makes me want to come out of poker retirement lol.

Fold pre.

But given the action call.