Is there a set that goes with this dealer button? (1 Viewer)

[Pliskin42]

The dealer button is the one pictured in A). The California card room.

Found it while browsing group buys out of the broken arrow card room threads. I asked there but no one replied and I assume I got burried by orders. I did I did a quick search but only found old sets with the name that look out dated and appear to be out of production. Nothing with the California Bear on it.

I would love one with the bear or even a two headed bear for the NCR.

 

[Szczesnk]

The dealer button is the one pictured in A). The California card room.

Found it while browsing group buys out of the broken arrow card room threads. I asked there but no one replied and I assume I got burried by orders. I did I did a quick search but only found old sets with the name that look out dated and appear to be out of production. Nothing with the California Bear on it.

I would love one with the bear or even a two headed bear for the NCR.

The rounders replicas from CPC...

http://classicpokerchips.com/stock/index.htm

 

[AlbinoDragon]

Rounders is the closest you will find.

I did a tribute set to the long closed California Club (on Fremont, in a space now part of the Golden Nugget) maybe 15 years ago back when I was on Chiptalk, but I only know of one other California Club set that has been made beyond that.

TLDR version, there's no available version of a California Club set of chips. I'm honestly unsure how the button got made as it was not me.

[EDIT] Mostly my pictures. I let one other person on CT get a set of them and a few of the pictures are theirs:

https://www.pokerchipforum.com/thre...tos-of-over-200-sets.13031/page-7#post-218566

 

[Pliskin42]

Rounders is the closest you will find.

I did a tribute set to the long closed California Club (on Fremont, in a space now part of the Golden Nugget) maybe 15 years ago back when I was on Chiptalk, but I only know of one other California Club set that has been made beyond that.

TLDR version, there's no available version of a California Club set of chips. I'm honestly unsure how the button got made as it was not me.

[EDIT] Mostly my pictures. I let one other person on CT get a set of them and a few of the pictures are theirs:

https://www.pokerchipforum.com/thre...tos-of-over-200-sets.13031/page-7#post-218566

Those are awesome! Pretty much exactly what I would be looking for too.

Would you ever consider allowing the design to be used again?

I don't know what the timing would be if I were to decide to go in on a group buy. Obviously costs would be a factor ect, and I'm mostly just browsing to see what my options are.

 

[AlbinoDragon]

Those are awesome! Pretty much exactly what I would be looking for too.

Would you ever consider allowing the design to be used again?

I don't know what the timing would be if I were to decide to go in on a group buy. Obviously costs would be a factor ect, and I'm mostly just browsing to see what my options are.

A quick answer to a long story, I would prefer that design not be used for another set.


There is a history with that design that some here witnessed back on the old ChipTalk group. Specifically there was another tribute set to the California Club that came out just before my chips were done but after I had spent a few months iterating the design openly with the members of the group there.

This is nothing personal, but what amounted to some cheap I.P. theft to make a set that was intended for commercial use makes me extremely reluctant to allow this or any of my designs for use. I'd rather not have any additional chips made with my designs.

Sorry about that.

 

[Pliskin42]

A quick answer to a long story, I would prefer that design not be used for another set.


There is a history with that design that some here witnessed back on the old ChipTalk group. Specifically there was another tribute set to the California Club that came out just before my chips were done but after I had spent a few months iterating the design openly with the members of the group there.

This is nothing personal, but what amounted to some cheap I.P. theft to make a set that was intended for commercial use makes me extremely reluctant to allow this or any of my designs for use. I'd rather not have any additional chips made with my designs.

Sorry about that.

No worries! I get it. I appriciate the answer honesty!

i might see if I or a friend can mock something different up at some point. or i might go with something existing. I dunno. Like I said I'm mostly looking at my options

 

[Pliskin42]

The rounders replicas from CPC...

http://classicpokerchips.com/stock/index.htm

View attachment 1271631

Those are some baller chips. Though a bit expensive, and I would like something thst isn't a movie replica.

 

[DZPoker]

This is nothing personal, but what amounted to some cheap I.P. theft to make a set that was intended for commercial use makes me extremely reluctant to allow this or any of my designs for use. I'd rather not have any additional chips made with my designs.

Both the font and the bear in the button seem to differ drastically from your design. It’s certainly possible that someone else came up with an idea to do a set named ‘California Club’ with the California bear on it, no? Maybe related to the casino you mentioned or maybe just because they were from California and thought it was a catchy name?

All I’m saying is someone did the design work for that button separately from yours so there’s a chance the OP can find that person on here, isn’t there? Or are you saying that specific design was the offending design from your story? If that’s the case, I completely understand your frustration.

 

[ekricket]

I’ve been thinking about a California club, inspiration is not a bear but more along the lines of current events

 

[Szczesnk]

I’ve been thinking about a California club, inspiration is not a bear but more along the lines of current events

View attachment 1271688

Lol, but Maher said he has great hair...

 

[WedgeRock]

A quick answer to a long story, I would prefer that design not be used for another set.


There is a history with that design that some here witnessed back on the old ChipTalk group. Specifically there was another tribute set to the California Club that came out just before my chips were done but after I had spent a few months iterating the design openly with the members of the group there.

This is nothing personal, but what amounted to some cheap I.P. theft to make a set that was intended for commercial use makes me extremely reluctant to allow this or any of my designs for use. I'd rather not have any additional chips made with my designs.

Sorry about that.

Basically, it can only be produced on China Clays... Because China doesn't care about IP...

 

[Kensco]

Spinettis had two of these 300 ct tribute sets for sale a couple years ago. Maybe they can tell you if they sold them or just delisted them.

 

[AlbinoDragon]

Both the font and the bear in the button seem to differ drastically from your design. It’s certainly possible that someone else came up with an idea to do a set named ‘California Club’ with the California bear on it, no? Maybe related to the casino you mentioned or maybe just because they were from California and thought it was a catchy name?

All I’m saying is someone did the design work for that button separately from yours so there’s a chance the OP can find that person on here, isn’t there? Or are you saying that specific design was the offending design from your story? If that’s the case, I completely understand your frustration.

Spinettis had two of these 300 ct tribute sets for sale a couple years ago. Maybe they can tell you if they sold them or just delisted them.

View attachment 1271802 View attachment 1271803

These were the chips that were made at the same time as mine. I remember he tried to sell me his chips after removing them sale. I didn't know they wound up at Spinettis. The text and bear here looks like the one on the button.


It was extremely unlikely that two sets to commemorate a tiny and 45 years gone (at the time) casino from downtown Vegas. I had spent two months iterating my design on the group before submitting my order. I've been trying to be polite and not name names, but it was Michael Dambach who made the other set. We was at ASM-Maine learning how to use the equipment before what became the sale to Red Ott and the ASM-Vegas era. He saw my design, had an artist make a different version and was able to make the chips before mine were done. "Happened to like the California bear" or "were from California and wanted a set" were never options. He wanted a design that he could sell commercially as pre-made sets and took advantage of a design concept that was floating around on the forum.

 

[AlbinoDragon]

No worries! I get it. I appriciate the answer honesty!

i might see if I or a friend can mock something different up at some point. or i might go with something existing. I dunno. Like I said I'm mostly looking at my options

Custom chips are a labor of love. Take your time and make something that means something to you, In this "click and buy" and instant gratification society we live in, it's hard to do that at times.

Good luck with the process, it'll be worth it in the end. Oh, and welcome to PCF!

 

[DZPoker]

These were the chips that were made at the same time as mine. I remember he tried to sell me his chips after removing them sale. I didn't know they wound up at Spinettis. The text and bear here looks like the one on the button.


It was extremely unlikely that two sets to commemorate a tiny and 45 years gone (at the time) casino from downtown Vegas. I had spent two months iterating my design on the group before submitting my order. I've been trying to be polite and not name names, but it was Michael Dambach who made the other set. We was at ASM-Maine learning how to use the equipment before what became the sale to Red Ott and the ASM-Vegas era. He saw my design, had an artist make a different version and was able to make the chips before mine were done. "Happened to like the California bear" or "were from California and wanted a set" were never options. He wanted a design that he could sell commercially as pre-made sets and took advantage of a design concept that was floating around on the forum.

I get that this is close and personal to you…but the font and bear on the button are quite different than on yours AND on the Spinettis chips (which also differs from yours). If you step back and look objectively…at least three people appear to have come up with this similar design. You feel one stole what you feel was yours to use and yours alone (and I’m not arguing that given the story), but what about the other? Can no one ever use California Club arched over a California bear because you did? That doesn’t seem right to me but I understand if you disagree.

At the end of the day, I personally cannot possibly call that name in an arc over the California bear IP but you may feel different. We don’t have to agree. I’m just trying to help the OP out because it’s a cool design, a design the OP is interested in, and not a design I think anyone ‘owns’. And maybe, just maybe…the third designer had no malicious intent and shouldn’t be treated as a villain simply because something bad happened between you and someone else.

Again though, given your closeness and how it influenced you, I under you feel differently so as I said, happy to agree to disagree and move on.

OP - I hope you find what you’re looking for!

 

[AlbinoDragon]

I get that this is close and personal to you…but the font and bear on the button are quite different than on yours AND on the Spinettis chips (which also differs from yours). If you step back and look objectively…at least three people appear to have come up with this similar design. You feel one stole what you feel was yours to use and yours alone (and I’m not arguing that given the story), but what about the other? Can no one ever use California Club arched over a California bear because you did? That doesn’t seem right to me but I understand if you disagree.

I never said the arched text and bear motif was exclusive to me. The fact that the concept of a tribute to a small and otherwise forgotten casino was made at the same time and by someone who had been both reading the forums and had access to make clay chips was downright scuzzy and done by someone who turned out to be a bit sketchy anyway (and also by association with another known sketch artist).

I'm not trying to claim exclusive rights to the California Club. I'm just trying to explain the history of my customs and where the design on the dealer button might fit in.

And maybe, just maybe…the third designer had no malicious intent and shouldn’t be treated as a villain simply because something bad happened between you and someone else.

If the designer of the button was the same designer as the person who did the work on the chips Spinettis now have, he and I made peace via private message on CT.

Again though, given your closeness and how it influenced you, I under you feel differently so as I said, happy to agree to disagree and move on.

Again, I have no claim to the California Club. That said, people's customs are custom for a reason, tribute or otherwise. In the end, take the time to make a set your own. When someone lifts the design from your customs, we can talk again.




If it means anything, I've ordered one of those buttons and I can't wait to get it in play.

 

[DZPoker]

I never said the arched text and bear motif was exclusive to me. The fact that the concept of a tribute to a small and otherwise forgotten casino was made at the same time and by someone who had been both reading the forums and had access to make clay chips was downright scuzzy and done by someone who turned out to be a bit sketchy anyway (and also by association with another known sketch artist).

I'm not trying to claim exclusive rights to the California Club. I'm just trying to explain the history of my customs and where the design on the dealer button might fit in.

If the designer of the button was the same designer as the person who did the work on the chips Spinettis now have, he and I made peace via private message on CT.

Again, I have no claim to the California Club. That said, people's customs are custom for a reason, tribute or otherwise. In the end, take the time to make a set your own. When someone lifts the design from your customs, we can talk again.

If it means anything, I've ordered one of those buttons and I can't wait to get it in play.

Gotcha. As I said, best of luck OP…the dealer button is a cool unique design…I hope you find what you’re looking for!

 

[DZPoker]

In the end, take the time to make a set your own. When someone lifts the design from your customs, we can talk again.

I missed this little ‘attack’ previously. For the record, I currently have a custom set being produced and there is literally someone else newly seeking advice on a set RIGHT NOW with the exact same name. Unlike you, I don’t claim some absurdity ownership of it.

Back to the point of this thread — OP - if you need someone to do the artwork, I’d be happy to create something similar free of charge based on that entirely unique dealer button that someone else now feels they own. And no….I do not traditionally sell my services as a designer on this site, but I like to call BS when BS is present. Happy to help OP, despite any hate it causes.

 

[AlbinoDragon]

WTF? You ignored the rest of my message and came back for this?

It's not an attack. Sorry if that set off your sensitivity. We're so busy making copies of copies around here anymore that it's rare to see something original anymore. Lift and copy away. Do what makes you happy. I guess original ideas don't really matter anymore.

The OP asked to use my design and I politely refused. I gave feedback on the history of my customs, yet we're still here. Now I have to defend myself.

I HAVE NEVER CLAIMED OWNERSHIP OF THAT DESIGN HERE OR ELSEWHERE. STOP PUTTING WORDS IN MY MOUTH.

Sheesh. I figured this was over hours ago. I'm out.


For the OP, sorry this has become a shit show in your thread. I didn't expect this to happen.

 

[Pliskin42]

Back to the point of this thread — OP - if you need someone to do the artwork, I’d be happy to create something similar free of charge based on that entirely unique dealer button that someone else now feels they own. And no….I do not traditionally sell my services as a designer on this site, but I like to call BS when BS is present. Happy to help OP, despite any hate it causes.

So this thread kinda went in a different direction than I was expecting.

Thank you a lot for your very kind offer. I would love to accept outright, however I am still not totally sure what I want to do yet. Like I said earlier I have mostly been just poking around and, for lack of a better term, window shopping a bit. I've mostly been looking for a good looking micro stakes set that has nickles, quarters, and a $20 chip/plaque option. In all likelihood my actual upgrade will be months or years down the line. Tinas seem like a good option, but I honestly don't know if they would really end up working out cost wise. Group buys seem to have a lot of variables in them, and even 40 cents a chip would likely be pushing my budget signifigantly at the moment. Honestly, I know it is heresy on here, but some of the ABS options also look attractive for the costs.

So all this is to say I have no real idea when I am actually going to pull the trigger on my upgrade. By the time it comes my mind may well have changed on options, ideas, or budget.

Therefore I would hate for you to do work without knowing at least roughly when or even wether it would get used.

That said, if it was something you wanted to mock up and pass along for free to the major group buy folks here on PCF that could be super cool. Then hopefully they would still be in the wild as an option if/when I finally pull the trigger and others could get them as well. Unless that is a big no no for some reason thst I as a new user don't yet understand.

Also regarding the disagreement between you and the other poster. I feel obliged to say I'm probably taking the cop out input of saying that i think you both had some understandable points. I don't want to stoke anything because I appriciate both your inputs. That said I am a little concerned that the heat of the exchange is what prompted your offer. In which case also please don't feel obligated in any way. I would hate or you to feel an obligation from something said when emotions ran high for a bit.

 

[Pliskin42]

For the OP, sorry this has become a shit show in your thread. I didn't expect this to happen.

no worries. Emotions ran high for a moment. It happens. As ai told thebother poster in a different reply I am gonna cop out and not take a side. I really do think you both had some excellent points and I get why you both felt the way your did. Times can make stress run hi.

I hope you are both doing okay.

 

[DZPoker]

The OP asked to use my design and I politely refused

I let this sit a while to calm everyone down (including me)….but…

The OP did not ask to use your design. The OP asked to use a design that is nothing like yours. You do not own some generic arched text ‘California Club’ over the generic California state flag logo (drawn crudely in your case). You flat out don’t own it. You said so yourself. No one owns it. And the Dealer button referenced has a VERY different font and a VERY different bear so they ARE DEFINITELY NOT your ACTUAL design at all.

I recreated a similar (but different) design to both your chips and the dealer button in under 15 minutes using freely and publicly available SVG images online. For a few bucks, anyone could do so entirely within licensing laws. You can claim your design was IP, it’s not. Sorry that bothers you, but it’s true.

We cannot become a community that takes such liberal definitions of ownership of a design that no name can be re-used, no design elements can co-exist. I’m sorry it hurts, but something has to be unique enough to be considered unique.

 

[Pliskin42]

The OP did not ask to use your design. The OP asked to use a design that is nothing like yours.

Just to clarify I in fsct ask both. I asked if there was a specific set for the button. When albinodragon posted his set as an example I liked it so much that I dod ask if he would be willing to let me and others use it one day. He also politley declined that use which I think is okay if dissapointing.

As for the wider discussion on the merits of the use if these as IP I'll leave that between you two. I just wanted to be clear about what I actually said before something got misconstrewed.

 

[BGinGA]

I let this sit a while to calm everyone down (including me)….but…

The OP did not ask to use your design. The OP asked to use a design that is nothing like yours. You do not own some generic arched text ‘California Club’ over the generic California state flag logo (drawn crudely in your case). You flat out don’t own it. You said so yourself. No one owns it. And the Dealer button referenced has a VERY different font and a VERY different bear so they ARE DEFINITELY NOT your ACTUAL design at all.

I recreated a similar (but different) design to both your chips and the dealer button in under 15 minutes using freely and publicly available SVG images online. For a few bucks, anyone could do so entirely within licensing laws. You can claim your design was IP, it’s not. Sorry that bothers you, but it’s true.

We cannot become a community that takes such liberal definitions of ownership of a design that no name can be re-used, no design elements can co-exist. I’m sorry it hurts, but something has to be unique enough to be considered unique.

I think you're making a big deal out of nothing. OP in fact did ask, and was politely refused. End of story.

Nothing stopping OP from using the dealer button artwork, so long as he gets permission from the designer/owner. Michael is no longer on PCF, and the artist has not been identified.

Creating brand new original artwork is also an option.

 

[Machine]

so long as he gets permission from the designer/owner. Michael is no longer on PCF, and the artist has not been identified.

I think this could be a topic of discussion for another thread