Dealing with a banned player (1 Viewer)

[detroitdad]

eye for an eye..........or foot for a shoe...........chop one off and call it a day.

 

[CO0LHand]

Give crazy guy his league fees back and ban him. If anyone in your league has a problem with it, throw their shoes across the lawn.

This made me laugh at work and now I have to pretend I am doing something serious, dangit!

 

[spikeithard]

I am going through a situation now with a hot head player. We had two incidents last night were tempers got out of hand with this player. Also a few games back he accused me or the guy beside on stealing a $5 chip that was set aside for a UFC prop bet.
After he left, one of my great regulars said to me that he is never coming back if he is coming. and everyone else at the end of the night was also feeling he should not come back.

I am about to email him and let him know he is not welcome anymore.... this is how I have drawn it up. if I should change anything on it, let me know




"It was quite unfortunate how it ended last night.


After you left last night, we all spoke about it. All of them were regulars.


I feel that it would be best if you did not attend the games anymore.


I am very sorry but there has been a few incidents now in the last few games involving different people and all have involved you as well.


I feel that for the integrity of my game, this is the best decision I can make at this time.


I am very sorry about this and hope you can find another regular game to attend


all the best,


Chris M"

 

[courage]

Spike, I think you're on right track but your note seems to start with an apology and doesn't say what he did wrong. Even if pointing out anger management it needs to specify.

 

[spikeithard]

ok thanks ill tweak it a bit

 

[ChaosRock]

I agree with courage Spike... You have nothing to apologize for... I ended up writing a note to shoe-man and although it's very particular to the situation I had on my hands, it might give you a few ideas... I can send it to you confidentially if you wish... If it was me, I would point to his bad behaviors, how it's impacting the game and other players and that it's not a sustainable situation... The problem is that the more you apologize, the more reason you're giving him to push back... Sorry you're going through that stuff man... It sucks...

 

[Starem Down]

Did Shoe Man ever give any "rationale" for what he did?

 

[Mental Nomad]

I don't see any apology in Spike's letter.

To say you're sorry you did something wrong is to apologize.

To just say you're sorry about a situation doesn't take responsibility for it, and is not an apology. It just expresses regret that it's the way it is. And that's probably appropriate.

The way I read it, Spike feels bad to be telling the guy he's not welcome any more, but he's not welcome any more. Spike isn't taking any blame for anything; the guy is clearly responsible for making everyone uncomfortable, and for making himself unwelcome at the game.

 

[grandgnu]

"It was quite unfortunate how it ended last night. After you left last night, we all spoke about it. All of them were regulars. I feel that it would be best if you did not attend the games anymore.


I am very sorry but there has been a few incidents now in the last few games involving different people and all have involved you as well. I feel that for the integrity of my game, this is the best decision I can make at this time. I am very sorry about this and hope you can find another regular game to attend

all the best,

Chris M"

Here's how I might word it:


Dear [about to be banned player]

In the past couple of games there have been multiple incidents that detracted from the enjoyment of the game I host and resulted in multiple players being upset or made uncomfortable. Unfortunately, each of these incidents involved you as one of the parties in the conflict.

My goal when I host is to have a fun, laid back game without these types of negative interactions. As such, I will be removing you from future invites as I don't feel this is working out.

Sincerely,

Chris M

 

[Mojo1312]

Great job Gnu! Straight to the point, without the fluff.

 

[manamongkids]

NEED to post the response when you get it

 

[Poker Zombie]

I like Gnu's letter, but I would approach it from the HR perspective.

Dear Banned,

It has been my goal over the last # years to provide a fun safe environment to play the game I truly love, poker. In order to achieve this goal, I need to invite players that gel well together. While your poker skills are admirable, you do not appear to get along with the other players in a satisfactory manner. For this reason, I will not be inviting you to any events with the current group of players. I hope to see you again at another venue, where we can play with another group of players.

Signed Host.


Players (or employees) that are about to get banned (fired) usually know when they are "on the bubble". If you point out specific traits that get them banned, they will claim they will change them. The truth though, it they already knew they were about to get banned (fired) if they maintained the current traits, yet they continued o act in an unacceptable manner. Therefore, I prefer the broader brush approach. You can pretend to stop being angry. You cannot try to stop being you.

 

[spikeithard]

thanks for your help guys. I just sent out the email to him now. Ill post reply if he does reply. hes a bit of a hot head 'know it all UFC' kind of guy so I hope he doesnt try to start shit with me. Hope he takes it well.

I also emailed the other 5 guys that were there at the end of the night and all involved in all of his antics to let them know my actions so they feel better clicking 'yes' to the next RSVP



EDIT:

he just got back to me now..... here is his response.

Yeah I know and I don't know what the fuck their problem is. James is the prick who started it both times Chris insulting other players the first time. Why don't you remove him? He's the sore loser. Oh I know why cause he's got deep stack and he gets respect whereas I don't. There are no other games. But it's fine I understand. Can't blame me for snapping back when from the moment I got there I got attitude.

2nd followup email 2 min later..

I get it though. I'm not wanted there and you agree so be it. But I did nothing wrong by calling him out on his bullshit and lies and attitude same as the old guy. I don't take shit from anyone man, period. That's just me. I have the right to stand up for myself If I'm being harassed or treated poorly. If you want to shed some light on why the fuck I'm not allowed to speak there but everyone else can say whatever they want that would be great! Being a small younger looking guy I've been treated like this my whole life and I don't put up with it. Amyways it's all good I was sick of their attitudes anyways. There's a few guys I do like there though it's too bad I won't be playing with them anymore. Ciao


So there it is. Helluva nice guy eh?

One incident last night is I was taking about 5 min for a $80 or so river call and he started to do the Jeopardy theme song so one of the other regulars (who has 'deep stacks' according to him) said something like 'fuck man, you take 5 min on a $5 decision all the time, chill out'. Thats when it got heated. Later on near the end he got in to it with the 'old guy' because banned player spoke about how he could of got all his money or something and the 'old guy' took offense to it. I trust the 'old guy' because he is a solid regular and solid guy all around with great poker sense and great etiquette sense.

 

[courage]

Banned player is clueless, doesn't get it, never will get it. It's always someone else' fault. I wouldn't give him the benefit of a reply, but I don't know the social circle. If he persists, it's easy to point out that others at least tried to patch things up while he made no effort whatsoever.

 

[Mr Tree]

It's always someone else' fault.

^^^This

In fact I would say this is a trait he applies to everything in life. It's not my fault...I'm just unlucky/unloved/etc. one of the most common traits of unsuccessful people, externalizations of blame and locus of power.

Sounds like a complete douchebag. Your game just improved without him.

 

[links_slayer]

Your game just improved without him.

x1000

 

[Shaggy]

Being a small younger looking guy I've been treated like this my whole life and I don't put up with it.

This statement says a lot about his personality. Always feels like he is being picked on. Quick to snap back... often escalates conflict. I knew the type.

Notice I said "knew." I try to avoid the conflict these days.

 

[TheDeezer]

Agree... Napolean complex. Just make sure he does not bust your game ... that's the tight rope we walk as well which blows

 

[Strike1st]

My wife wants to host a regular league at the house...I enjoy reading your responses because I guarantee mine wouldn't have been diplomatic, politically correct or gentlemen like.

Learn something hear every day.

 

[spikeithard]

Agree... Napolean complex. Just make sure he does not bust your game ... that's the tight rope we walk as well which blows

bust in what sense?

 

[stocky]

Bust caps

 

[ChaosRock]

Did Shoe Man ever give any "rationale" for what he did?

Thanks for all those who helped me to deal with the Shoe-Man situation... It's much appreciated...

I was trying to avoid posting more details about the incident since a few PCF members might be attending some of my games... I didn't want them to have a pre judgement on the guy and take it as a clean slate... That's why I've been a bit silent on the issue... I hope you understand...

But trying to thread the needle here, and give you guys a bit of the scoop without too much details: I wrote Show-Man a very tough, albeit polite, email describing the events how I saw them and how he had disrespected me, my guests and my house. His reply was veeeeeery apologetic and full of excuses also. After talking to a couple of other league members, I decided to write him back saying he would be allowed to finish the season providing there would be absolutely no more disrespectful behaviors. Once again he apologized. Our first game after that, he called me asking if he could come and I said yes, as I had wrote him. He's behaved nicely the last couple of games. I believe it's a time bomb but I decided to take the risk until the season is over. Just a reminder that my league players are NOT the same players he messed with their shoes, that was a different league and only a couple of the players even know what happened. I prefer this way for now... Thanks again guys!

 

[TexRex]

Chaos, I'm glad there seems to be a peaceful resolution to this. I'm generally willing to give people a second chance, unless the case is extreme and/or the person isn't the least bit contrite, and it seems to me the action you took was reasonable for your situation. It's always hard for others to judge. I would love to know how this worked out long-term since it is likely that most of us who host will be confronted with something similar at some point. It always helps to know how someone else handled it and how it worked out.

 

[Mental Nomad]

I'd also like to hear about the long run... Turning someone around is better than turning them out, so if it works, kudos to you.

 

[Chippy McChiperson]

I almost banned myself from my friend's game last night. This miserable drunk who happens to be the biggest donator went off on me last night, basically because he wouldn't count his stack when asked, so I took it upon myself to do it for him. It took all the strength I had not to deck the guy in the face, and I am not a violent man.

 

[TexRex]

Chippy, try to remember if he's a big donator, while me might have his nights, he's ultimately paying you for the trouble he's causing. I try to weigh that against the annoyance.

 

[Mental Nomad]

It took all the strength I had not to deck the guy in the face, and I am not a violent man.

I agree with TexRex; you have to weigh everything. Also, were you dealer? Technically, if a player refuses to count, the dealer should do it, or the host/ref/director. If you were just a fellow player, he's got some right to take offense.

Meanwhile, etymological note (because I'm into that): you don't deck someone in the face. To deck them is to hit them so hard that they end up lying on the deck (which is naval lingo for on the floor, as in, "hit the deck!") So deck refers to the effect of laying them out, not the hitting.

Unless you mean you were going to slap them across the face with a deck of cards, in which case, I recommend solid plastic.

 

[BGinGA]

Unless you mean you were going to slap them across the face with a deck of cards, in which case, I recommend solid plastic.

These work best.

 

[MikesDad]

Unfortunately, this donator exhibits the same behavior at every game. Last night was not a one time thing.

He's out

 

[maxim_666666]

in your place, I would have bought a drink for the victims of this trick. Of course money Villain. And give a kick in the ass!
if, I will lay a bunch of crap on bartending stand, I do not think I will be forgiven, because 5 minutes before, I bought a drink and gave a tip the bartender ....
In general, it is better to discuss it with other players ...