Buyer Beware--Ruff'd up chips from Big_Dog_FL (1 Viewer)

[RyGuy]

Hello PCF,

May my $180 loss be your gain. I would heavily advise against purchasing chips from @Big_Dog_FL

I've only ever had pleasant transactions on PCF. I've recently conducted transactions with @Jasap47 and @Colquhoun who can vouch for me (hopefully). As a result, I felt comfortable using PayPal F&F instead of G&S, but that was my mistake in this case.

I purchased 500 CC Pharaoh $1 chips the other day from this classified sale. They arrived quickly which I was ecstatic about because I planned to host my first $1/$2 seven-card stud game later this week, but I needed more Pharaoh $1 chips to do so. Unfortunately, they arrived in this condition (please see attached).

Of the 500, I've inspected about two barrels worth that I grabbed from the top of the bag (I can only imagine what the chips at the bottom look like). Almost every chip is damaged and/or has red scuffs on the white clay or inlay. I didn't need to inspect more before I firmly requested a refund. Unfortunately, not only is he not refunding me, but the gaslighting is unreal:

"I find it hard to believe"
"I've been shipping chips for years, never had one problem"
"Those chips were wrapped pretty well"
"The first two chips you showed me are not my chips. The chips I sent you are brand new."
"How dare you accuse me of sending chips that were not as advertised"
"Looks like you switched chips"
"Those are not mine"
And, ultimately, "Don't give me your bullshit. I will not accept your tone of voice."

Since I paid via PayPal F&F through my checking account, I have no other financial recourse. Losing the money hurts, but I'm also bummed about my game this week. Since Apache is out of the office until August 1, it'll be a bit until I have the chips. So, until then, I'll try to find solace in this warning so that this doesn't happen again to someone else from @Big_Dog_FL

 

[joker80]

It's how they were packed. Loose packed and rattled around on the trip, causing the flea bites

 

[JMC9389]

Best you can do is leave negative feedback if you feel what you got didn't match what you thought you were getting.

I've been here long enough to understand there are three sides to every story, but I'm sorry that this happened.

 

[Josh Kifer]

Yeah, that's a shit packing job.

When buying at PCF, seniority matters. Generally old PCFers will do anything to fix items as word of mouth will destroy people here.

 

[joker80]

Also if you check the archives, there was a batch of Pharoah CC ones that were prone to this

 

[RyGuy]

It's how they were packed. Loose packed and rattled around on the trip, causing the flea bites

Right, I don't doubt they were in brand new condition before shipment, but c'mon now...

I would be mortified if I shipped something in that manner that led to such poor condition upon arrival. I would have refunded the buyer so fast due to embarrassment.

 

[RyGuy]

Best you can do is leave negative feedback if you feel what you got didn't match what you thought you were getting.

I've been here long enough to understand there are three sides to every story, but I'm sorry that this happened.

Appreciate it. Yeah, I thought about leaving negative feedback, but then he'll need negative feedback on me most likely...

 

[Bacon Dad]

Great warning at your cost. Sorry that happened to you if you are telling the truth.

When we buy chips, we should be looking at who is selling them. What is their feedback status? Do they buy/sell chips frequently? Buy enough of them and you learn how they should be packaged.

 

[RyGuy]

Also if you check the archives, there was a batch of Pharoah CC ones that were prone to this

Yikes! Sounds like that could be the reason for such severe damage, but I still argue it's not on the buyer to cover such costs. But, perhaps I dodged a bullet if this was a bad batch of Pharaoh's (although they still had the manufacturer chalk on them).

 

[joker80]

Yikes! Sounds like that could be the reason for such severe damage, but I still argue it's not on the buyer to cover such costs. But, perhaps I dodged a bullet if this was a bad batch of Pharaoh's (although they still had the manufacturer chalk on them).

Were the other denominations ok? If I remember right it was just the ones that chipped like that

 

[RyGuy]

Great warning at your cost. Sorry that happened to you if you are telling the truth.

When we buy chips, we should be looking at who is selling them. What is their feedback status? Do they buy/sell chips frequently? Buy enough of them and you learn how they should be packaged.

Yes, I'm being 100% truthful. I have nothing to gain here (except to hope that he'll refund me after seeing the community response). I can copy/paste the side conversation I'm having with him to prove it, if anyone asks.

 

[kmccormick100]

Looks like he's only ever sold Paulsons - and shipped them in chip boxes. There are a lot of ways to ship chips so that they are secure and don't rattle all over the place breaking each other into pieces while loose in a ziplock. Wrap them in Saran Wrap stacks of 50, wrap them in paper towels, or stuff them tightly into a SFRB in stacks. @Big_Dog_FL was clearly lazy and careless. Be better man, and make this guy right or don't bother ever trying to sell anything around here again.

 

[Bacon Dad]

No need to do that. I find it unlikely you are trying to do anything underhanded here. It takes too much energy!
But as @JMC9389 said, there are different sides to every story.
I would hope the seller would refund your the value of the damaged $1s give how poorly he packaged them. That's just being a decent person!

 

[RyGuy]

Were the other denominations ok? If I remember right it was just the ones that chipped like that

Unfortunately the sale was for 500 $1s. I haven't looked at all 500 chips, but I don't really need to at this point. Even if half of the chips in that Ziploc bag are pristine, I would still send them all back for a full refund. I even offered to ship them back on my dime in order to secure the refund after I encountered some resistance, but no luck--just more gaslighting.

 

[KHarp1]

All the above suggestions, plus, ask how they plan to ship. Are they in racks, boxes, etc. I've started writing that they'll be shipped in racks or boxes. I don't tape the boxes any longer because I hate the way the tape destroys the boxes. Beautiful gold Paulson boxes torn all to hell because they were wrapped in excessive amounts of packaging tape was kind of sad. Wrap in plastic cling wrap. A few good questions during your transaction can hopefully prevent these sort of things.
To send chips in a big bag is just unacceptable. That's asking for trouble. If this is truly what happened then @Big_Dog_FL should step up and do the right thing. Would like to hear his version of events.

 

[Bacon Dad]

^^^ This here EXACTLY!!

 

[SiouxperStack]

The classified ad states there are 500 ones but only 400 are pictured- did he send photos of all 500?

 

[RyGuy]

Looks like he's only ever sold Paulsons - and shipped them in chip boxes. There are a lot of ways to ship chips so that they are secure and don't rattle all over the place breaking each other into pieces while loose in a ziplock. Wrap them in Saran Wrap stacks of 50, wrap them in paper towels, or stuff them tightly into a SFRB in stacks. @Big_Dog_FL was clearly lazy and careless. Be better man, and make this guy right or don't bother ever trying to sell anything around here again.

To be fair, he did ship the other denominations from the sale to another buyer (I reached out to this buyer to inquire of his experience). This buyer said they were shipped in the same manner (Ziploc bag, air pockets), but he only encountered a few nicks--nothing out of the ordinary. It was for 340 chips, not 500, so maybe the lesser weight allowed them to be more secure, or now I've learned that could have been a bad batch of Pharaoh $1 chips. But, still, doesn't change my situation no matter how much this seller claims it's my fault using the other buyer as an example.

 

[Josh Kifer]

I haven't looked at all 500 chips, but I don't really need to at this point.

Always have a complete picture before complaining and bringing it to PCF. Any doubts or confusion will always cause issue.

Go thru them all, create a pass and fail pile, and get a count.

15 damage chips is alot different than 300 damaged chips here. We know that shipping method is crap and the ones are prone to fleabites, but get a count to back your claim and it'll give you ground to stand on.

Not saying your wrong, just saying to get the ducks in a row before pitchforks. Not pitchforks then ducks.....

 

[Josh Kifer]

I don't tape the boxes any longer because I hate the way the tape destroys the boxes.

Heheheh. I tape boxes and will never stop! Anti cling wrap forever!

 

[RyGuy]

The classified ad states there are 500 ones but only 400 are pictured- did he send photos of all 500?

Good question--I have not counted all of them due to my initial shock when I picked up the first few. I will count tonight.

 

[RyGuy]

All the above suggestions, plus, ask how they plan to ship. Are they in racks, boxes, etc. I've started writing that they'll be shipped in racks or boxes. I don't tape the boxes any longer because I hate the way the tape destroys the boxes. Beautiful gold Paulson boxes torn all to hell because they were wrapped in excessive amounts of packaging tape was kind of sad. Wrap in plastic cling wrap. A few good questions during your transaction can hopefully prevent these sort of things.
To send chips in a big bag is just unacceptable. That's asking for trouble. If this is truly what happened then @Big_Dog_FL should step up and do the right thing. Would like to hear his version of events.

Yes, I tagged him on purpose. I have not blocked him, so he's more than welcome to respond.

 

[RyGuy]

Always have a complete pictures before complaining and bringing it to PCF. Any doubts or confusion will always cause issue.

Go thru them all, create a pass and fail pile, and get a count.

15 damage chips is alot different than 300 damaged chips here. We know that shipping method is crap and the ones are prone to fleabites, but get a count to back your claim and it'll give you ground to stand on.

Not saying your wrong, just saying to get the ducks in a row before pitchforks. Not pitchforks then ducks.....

Thank you--good advice. I will do so tonight and post the results.

 

[Josh Kifer]

Thank you--good advice. I will do so tonight and post the results.

Good man! Hope it works out for you.

 

[Rieguy]

I always preach waiting to hear the other side of the story in such situations, but damn do chips loose in a zip-lock bag just make me cringe. Not sure that one can be explained away regardless of what is packed around it.

Also:

GL! There's always time for things to be made right.

 

[upNdown]

but I'm also bummed about my game this week.

Not to excuse or overlook anything about the transaction, but don't let it affect your game. You can still play with those chips, at least in the short term. Might even be an amusing topic of conversation.

 

[RyGuy]

Not to excuse or overlook anything about the transaction, but don't let it affect your game. You can still play with those chips, at least in the short term. Might even be an amusing topic of conversation.

Thanks for your optimism! Unfortunately, it's eight players with a $50 buy-in. I planned stacks of .25 x 20 and $1 x 45, but I have only 200 $1s from my NLHE cash set. I need 160 more at least, but 500 was perfect because I wouldn't need to use $5 chips for rebuys and force them to make change.

Edit: Oh, haha, I misread your post! Nah, even though I play with CC Pharaoh's (which I love, btw), my game has standards! And oiling those would just make me cry after passing through each one.

 

[allforcharity]

This is why I don't buy, and generally don't recommend, CC chips. You can get batches that literally crumble apart. I daresay Tina CM chips (gasp!) are a better value.

 

[RyGuy]

This is why I don't buy, and generally don't recommend, CC chips. You can get batches that literally crumble apart. I daresay Tina CM chips (gasp!) are a better value.

Honestly, I didn't know that until now. I have a set of 500-600 Pharaoh's that have served me well for several years.

Sounds like this could have been one of those batches. At least I found out during shipment rather than in the middle of a game!

 

[SiouxperStack]

Good question--I have not counted all of them due to my initial shock when I picked up the first few. I will count tonight.

That’s a good idea- but did he share photos prior to shipping of all 500 chips?