Mucking your hand (1 Viewer)

[Gobbs]

Good question, Wedge.

Yes, definitely violates both rules but especially not protecting other players at the table for the very reason you gave. It’s probably not worth saying or doing anything unless it is a persistent problem, but it is wrong.

 

[WedgeRock]

I see this violation far more often...

 

[JustinInMN]

Unrelated question: action on Player A in MP. Player A says, "Raise" and contemplates and amount. Upon hearing 'Raise' (but before an amount is announced), Player B folds.

Ruling?

IMO, it's technically improper. Action is not on Player B yet.

Yes it is absolutely improper, at a minimum player should be warned, and in a tournament player should be penalized.

I had to explain this once in my home game, everyone caught on right away.

 

[Poker Zombie]

If it is not heads up, I will call it "improper". If it is heads up, "Player A" announcing "raise" and then player B folds, I have no issue... and support the process of announcing raise, as it speeds up the game.

 

[Poker Zombie]

Actually, a player may not get up from the table and let his hand be auto-folded when it gets to his turn.

First, the TDA Rule is very clear that players may not leave the table with a live hand.

Second, players are responsible for protecting other players at the table and revealing your action out of turn does not do that. “Making statements or taking action that could unfairly influence the course of play, whether or not the offender is involved in the pot.” is not allowed. This would clearly fall into the category of taking an action that can unfairly influence play, especially if done after some have acted and others have not.

So, the conclusion is simple. No, you can’t fold out of turn or leave your hand to be folded out of turn. (Only dealer mucks, despite the very common misuse of the term.)

Do you have a rule citation?

I believe you, but cannot recall the rule and am not in the position to research it.

 

[CdnBeerLover]

Do you have a rule citation?

I believe you, but cannot recall the rule and am not in the position to research it.

PokerTDA, rule 31 seems to fit.
https://www.pokertda.com/view-poker-tda-rules/


31: At the Table with Action Pending
Players with live hands (including players all-in or otherwise finished betting) must remain at the table for all betting rounds and showdown. Leaving the table is incompatible with protecting your hand and following the action, and is subject to penalty.

 

[Gobbs]

Rule 31 above is correct (Thanks, CBL). Also, Rule 2 Player Responsibilities:

Players should verify registration data and seat assignments, protect their hands, make their intentions clear, follow the action, act in turn with proper terminology and gestures, defend their right to act, keep cards visible and chips correctly stacked, remain at the table with a live hand, table all cards properly when competing at showdown, speak up if they see a mistake, call for a clock when warranted, transfer tables promptly, follow one player to a hand, know and comply with the rules, practice proper etiquette, and generally contribute to an orderly event.

 

[1A25R]

I found this picture to illustrate the fold / muck difference

 

[JustinInMN]

I found this picture to illustrate the fold / muck difference

I will say if there is one thing I fight as hard about as you guys on the "muck" terminology is that burn cards should always be kept separately and under the pot.

 

[1A25R]

burn cards should always be kept separately and under the pot.

Agree

 

[Gobbs]

I will say if there is one thing I fight as hard about as you guys on the "muck" terminology is that burn cards should always be kept separately and under the pot.

X2