Tourney My First Home Mystery Bounty Tournament: How-To? (2 Viewers)

[Taxi500]

18 players, $200 buy in. I love HEAVY bounty tournaments (40-50% of money towards knockouts). We have lots of rebuys (40-60% of the field). AKA I expect 7-11 guys to rebuy.

I was going to randomize prizes into 24 envelopes. You get one at the start, if you rebuy you get another and when all 24 envelopes are gone you no longer have a bounty on your head.

Am I on the right track here or am I screwing up how they typically work?

 

[upduck]

For a mystery bounty, I would start bounties after the rebuy period ends. That way the number of players/bounties is fixed.

Then I would allocate a % to each mystery envelope based on the bounty prize pool.

 

[FestiveKnight]

For a mystery bounty, I would start bounties after the rebuy period ends. That way the number of players/bounties is fixed.

Then I would allocate a % to each mystery envelope based on the bounty prize pool.

This has logistical ease but ignores what I think @Taxi500’s vibe is. Moar bounty moar action moar better. So let’s not limit bounties.

What I do for my season finale is bounty on every buy in/rebuy. Then I set up a formula in advance that accommodates for whatever the final number of bounties awarded is. E.g 1 MEGA bounty at 25% of bounty pool, 2 Large at 15%, 4 mediums at 7.50%, and 6 smalls at 2.50%. Mediums are then cannibalized into more small bounties if needed or visa versa. As long as you have a stated formula in advance for how it will work then it’s okay to have it flex.

I would then give out bounty chips instead of envelopes and at the end you calculate the bounties, write out slips and then have people draw from a hat or whatever (we’re online so we spin a wheel which is fun). You can premake most of the slips and I’d only put percent so you don’t have to do math on each slip. Just have total bounty pool $ on a whiteboard or something so everyone can do % math

 

[Taxi500]

This has logistical ease but ignores what I think @Taxi500’s vibe is. Moar bounty moar action moar better. So let’s not limit bounties.

What I do for my season finale is bounty on every buy in/rebuy. Then I set up a formula in advance that accommodates for whatever the final number of bounties awarded is. E.g 1 MEGA bounty at 25% of bounty pool, 2 Large at 15%, 4 mediums at 7.50%, and 6 smalls at 2.50%. Mediums are then cannibalized into more small bounties if needed or visa versa. As long as you have a stated formula in advance for how it will work then it’s okay to have it flex.

I would then give out bounty chips instead of envelopes and at the end you calculate the bounties, write out slips and then have people draw from a hat or whatever (we’re online so we spin a wheel which is fun). You can premake most of the slips and I’d only put percent so you don’t have to do math on each slip. Just have total bounty pool $ on a whiteboard or something so everyone can do % math

I do like this and that makes more sense than what I'm doing... BUT I was really looking forward to the yelling and screaming as guys publicly opened their envelopes after knocking a friend out.

 

[FestiveKnight]

I do like this and that makes more sense than what I'm doing... BUT I was really looking forward to the yelling and screaming as guys publicly opened their envelopes after knocking a friend out.

Yep. The trade off though is not competing for bounties for the main chunk of the tournament and no consolation prize bounties for early losers

 

[TheRealStephen12]

Prepare bounty envelopes ahead of time, and separate them until you mix the correct combination of values together after the rebuy period ends. For the largest bounty, you could just label it "jackpot" if you do not want to produce a $350 and $400 envelope, and announce the jackpot value once the rebuy period ends. The following is a bounty schedule I came up with for a similar tournament previously, adjusted for scale (£20>$200). Give players a bounty chip for each elimination, but don't allow them to cash them in until at least the end of the rebuy period.

18: 9x $50, 6x $100, 2x $200, 1x $350
19: 9x $50, 7x $100, 2x $200, 1x $350
20: 9x $50, 8x $100, 2x $200, 1x $350
21: 11x $50, 6x $100, 3x $200, 1x $350
22: 11x $50, 7x $100, 3x $200, 1x $350
23: 11x $50, 8x $100, 3x $200, 1x $350
24: 12x $50, 8x $100, 3x $200, 1x $400
25: 12x $50, 9x $100, 3x $200, 1x $400
26: 12x $50, 10x $100, 3x $200, 1x $400
27: 14x $50, 8x $100, 4x $200, 1x $400
28: 14x $50, 9x $100, 4x $200, 1x $400
29: 14x $50, 10x $100, 4x $200, 1x $400
30: 15x $50, 10x $100, 4x $200, 1x $450

For more than 30 total entries:

For each 6 full entries greater than 30, add 3x $50, 2x $100, 1x $200, and increase the largest bounty by $50.

For the remainder (fewer than 6), do exactly ONE the following:
1 additional entry: add 1x $100
2 additional entries: add 2x $100
3 additional entries: add 2x $50 and 1x $200
4 additional entries: add 2x $50, 1x $100, and 1x $200
5 additional entries: add 2x $50, 2x $100, and 1x $200

 

[Taxi500]

Thank you for taking the time to write that up for me. I see what you're saying now. But what happens if a player gets a knockout chip, then gets himself knocked out and chooses not to rebuy? Does he get nothing because the rebuy period has not ended and solidified the field/envelopes?

 

[TheRealStephen12]

Thank you for taking the time to write that up for me. I see what you're saying now. But what happens if a player gets a knockout chip, then gets himself knocked out and chooses not to rebuy? Does he get nothing because the rebuy period has not ended and solidified the field/envelopes?

No he gets to draw, he just has to wait until the rebuy period ends to do so.

 

[Poker Zombie]

Bumping this thread, as we are about to host our first bounty tournament on June 20th.

Our buy-in is much smaller than the OP's ($30) but everything is scalable. I also recognize that there are dozens of ways to handle a Mystery Bounty event, and I believe this to be the best way. Below I will add colored text when I thought of a different way to handle Mystery Bounties, and why I decided to go they way I plan.

My method involves some extra "work" on the front end. Poker is my hobby, and hobby work = fun, so really, my method involves some extra "fun" on the front end. I also enjoy Excel. I don't know why, I just do. A lot of how I'm handling this comes down to Excel.

First I decided to allocate roughly 1/3 the initial entry fee as bounties. I rounded the bounty pool up to the nearest $25 increment. Right now (10 days before the event) we have 13 players with 2 maybes. All remaining money goes to the prize pool (1st - 4th places).
Why round up to $25 increments instead of a static $10 per player? Because I just learned the CIELING function in Excel. It also makes things a little more predictable, as there are occasions (though rare) that a player remains a "maybe" on game day. It's usually related to a kids sporting event, so even if I don't like it, I accept it and make plans accordingly. I understand that kids come first.

Rebuys add to the prize pool, but do not alter the bounty pool.
I could take $10 from the rebuys too, but the prize pool for 4 players and a $30 is tiny. Before rebuys, (taking the obligatory $20 out for the end of the year bonus) it pays 1st $90, 2nd $60, 3rd $40 and 4th $30 on a projected 40%/30%/20%/10% prize pool before rounding. With an expected 4 rebuys, that prize pool goes up to $140/$100/$70/$30 - a much more respectable prize pool for a $30 entry.

I will also add to this, that when it comes to knockouts, @Mrs Poker Zombie and I have a combined average 0.98 knockouts per time we buy-in or rebuy. A bounty tournament is mathematically -EV for us, while players like @Jonesey07 (with 1.72 KO/buy-in ratio) would probably argue for more money in the bounty pool. As host, you build the rules, so I'm leaning toward a smaller bounty pool - and hosting the Mystery Bounty game when Jonesey is out of town.

Instead of money in envelopes, our prizes will be chips drawn out of a sack.

1. Because MOAR CHIPS.
2. Someone gifted me a set of sluggos with 1s, 5s, 10s, 25s, and 50s. I'm not going to be rude, I'm going to figure out a way to put them in play. Thus, the Zombie Mystery Bounties game was born.

Our games run from 7pm to about 11:45ish, with a break every hour for color ups, drink refills, snacking away from the table, etc. At 2nd break rebuys end, and we race off the smallest denom. We also put away food that should be refrigerated (we serve dinner from 5:30-6:45). That makes 2nd break pretty busy as hosts, so bounties will go live at 3rd break. Historically (and because I keep stats), going back 10 years an average of 57.2% of players remain at 3rd break. That number goes up to 65.6% if you only take the last 5 years, and that's probably because my players have gotten better (learning to fold in the face of obviously better). Eliminations before 3rd break drive up the future value of bounties.

At 3rd break I consult this chart:

13-15 players
2	150	150
3	152	51	51	25	25
4	151	51	50	25	25
5	150	50	50	25	25
6	151	51	50	25	10	10	5
7	151	51	50	25	10	5	5	5
8	151	51	25	25	10	10	10	10	10
9	151	51	25	25	10	10	10	10	5	5
10	151	51	25	25	10	10	10	5	5	5	5
11	151	51	25	10	10	10	10	10	10	5	5	5
12	151	51	25	10	10	10	10	10	5	5	5	5	5
13	151	51	25	10	10	10	10	5	5	5	5	5	5	5
14	150	50	25	10	10	10	10	5	5	5	5	5	5	5
15	150	50	25	10	10	10	5	5	5	5	5	5	5	5	5

The number on the right is the number of players remaining at 3rd break. The rest of the numbers are the individual chips added to the sack, with "51" being a $1 chip worth $50 plus a second draw. Thus, with 14 players we should see 9 players remaining. We add a 1x"51", 2x$25s, 4x$10s, and 2x $5s. The player that draws the 51 gets $50 plus a redraw for a total "Big Prize" between $55-$75 (EV $62.50).

However, that anticipates knockouts per a regular no-bounty night. I can absolutely see big stacks playing more aggressively, driving up the value for the Mystery Bounties. At least that is my hope. I'd love to see someone sweat a draw that could be worth $100.

...and don't worry about how difficult it is to read that chart, as Excel is also how my pay table is displayed. Once I enter the number of players remaining at 3rd break, the payout screen looks like this:

This allows players to both determine the EV of their draw and allows me, at a glance, to determine what chips need to be added to the sack.

Open to thoughts, comments, and concerns.

 

[Jonesey07]

Bumping this thread, as we are about to host our first bounty tournament on June 20th.

Our buy-in is much smaller than the OP's ($30) but everything is scalable. I also recognize that there are dozens of ways to handle a Mystery Bounty event, and I believe this to be the best way. Below I will add colored text when I thought of a different way to handle Mystery Bounties, and why I decided to go they way I plan.

My method involves some extra "work" on the front end. Poker is my hobby, and hobby work = fun, so really, my method involves some extra "fun" on the front end. I also enjoy Excel. I don't know why, I just do. A lot of how I'm handling this comes down to Excel.

First I decided to allocate roughly 1/3 the initial entry fee as bounties. I rounded the bounty pool up to the nearest $25 increment. Right now (10 days before the event) we have 13 players with 2 maybes. All remaining money goes to the prize pool (1st - 4th places).
Why round up to $25 increments instead of a static $10 per player? Because I just learned the CIELING function in Excel. It also makes things a little more predictable, as there are occasions (though rare) that a player remains a "maybe" on game day. It's usually related to a kids sporting event, so even if I don't like it, I accept it and make plans accordingly. I understand that kids come first.

Rebuys add to the prize pool, but do not alter the bounty pool.
I could take $10 from the rebuys too, but the prize pool for 4 players and a $30 is tiny. Before rebuys, (taking the obligatory $20 out for the end of the year bonus) it pays 1st $90, 2nd $60, 3rd $40 and 4th $30 on a projected 40%/30%/20%/10% prize pool before rounding. With an expected 4 rebuys, that prize pool goes up to $140/$100/$70/$30 - a much more respectable prize pool for a $30 entry.

I will also add to this, that when it comes to knockouts, @Mrs Poker Zombie and I have a combined average 0.98 knockouts per time we buy-in or rebuy. A bounty tournament is mathematically -EV for us, while players like @Jonesey07 (with 1.72 KO/buy-in ratio) would probably argue for more money in the bounty pool. As host, you build the rules, so I'm leaning toward a smaller bounty pool - and hosting the Mystery Bounty game when Jonesey is out of town.

Instead of money in envelopes, our prizes will be chips drawn out of a sack.

1. Because MOAR CHIPS.
2. Someone gifted me a set of sluggos with 1s, 5s, 10s, 25s, and 50s. I'm not going to be rude, I'm going to figure out a way to put them in play. Thus, the Zombie Mystery Bounties game was born.

Our games run from 7pm to about 11:45ish, with a break every hour for color ups, drink refills, snacking away from the table, etc. At 2nd break rebuys end, and we race off the smallest denom. We also put away food that should be refrigerated (we serve dinner from 5:30-6:45). That makes 2nd break pretty busy as hosts, so bounties will go live at 3rd break. Historically (and because I keep stats), going back 10 years an average of 57.2% of players remain at 3rd break. That number goes up to 65.6% if you only take the last 5 years, and that's probably because my players have gotten better (learning to fold in the face of obviously better). Eliminations before 3rd break drive up the future value of bounties.

At 3rd break I consult this chart:

13-15 players
2	150	150
3	152	51	51	25	25
4	151	51	50	25	25
5	150	50	50	25	25
6	151	51	50	25	10	10	5
7	151	51	50	25	10	5	5	5
8	151	51	25	25	10	10	10	10	10
9	151	51	25	25	10	10	10	10	5	5
10	151	51	25	25	10	10	10	5	5	5	5
11	151	51	25	10	10	10	10	10	10	5	5	5
12	151	51	25	10	10	10	10	10	5	5	5	5	5
13	151	51	25	10	10	10	10	5	5	5	5	5	5	5
14	150	50	25	10	10	10	10	5	5	5	5	5	5	5
15	150	50	25	10	10	10	5	5	5	5	5	5	5	5	5

The number on the right is the number of players remaining at 3rd break. The rest of the numbers are the individual chips added to the sack, with "51" being a $1 chip worth $50 plus a second draw. Thus, with 14 players we should see 9 players remaining. We add a 1x"51", 2x$25s, 4x$10s, and 2x $5s. The player that draws the 51 gets $50 plus a redraw for a total "Big Prize" between $55-$75 (EV $62.50).

However, that anticipates knockouts per a regular no-bounty night. I can absolutely see big stacks playing more aggressively, driving up the value for the Mystery Bounties. At least that is my hope. I'd love to see someone sweat a draw that could be worth $100.

...and don't worry about how difficult it is to read that chart, as Excel is also how my pay table is displayed. Once I enter the number of players remaining at 3rd break, the payout screen looks like this:
View attachment 1689837

This allows players to both determine the EV of their draw and allows me, at a glance, to determine what chips need to be added to the sack.

Open to thoughts, comments, and concerns.

My comment is postpone the game til Sunday night. K thanks bye.

 

[Knoxymoron]

Bumping this thread, as we are about to host our first bounty tournament on June 20th.

Our buy-in is much smaller than the OP's ($30) but everything is scalable. I also recognize that there are dozens of ways to handle a Mystery Bounty event, and I believe this to be the best way. Below I will add colored text when I thought of a different way to handle Mystery Bounties, and why I decided to go they way I plan.

My method involves some extra "work" on the front end. Poker is my hobby, and hobby work = fun, so really, my method involves some extra "fun" on the front end. I also enjoy Excel. I don't know why, I just do. A lot of how I'm handling this comes down to Excel.

First I decided to allocate roughly 1/3 the initial entry fee as bounties. I rounded the bounty pool up to the nearest $25 increment. Right now (10 days before the event) we have 13 players with 2 maybes. All remaining money goes to the prize pool (1st - 4th places).
Why round up to $25 increments instead of a static $10 per player? Because I just learned the CIELING function in Excel. It also makes things a little more predictable, as there are occasions (though rare) that a player remains a "maybe" on game day. It's usually related to a kids sporting event, so even if I don't like it, I accept it and make plans accordingly. I understand that kids come first.

Rebuys add to the prize pool, but do not alter the bounty pool.
I could take $10 from the rebuys too, but the prize pool for 4 players and a $30 is tiny. Before rebuys, (taking the obligatory $20 out for the end of the year bonus) it pays 1st $90, 2nd $60, 3rd $40 and 4th $30 on a projected 40%/30%/20%/10% prize pool before rounding. With an expected 4 rebuys, that prize pool goes up to $140/$100/$70/$30 - a much more respectable prize pool for a $30 entry.

I will also add to this, that when it comes to knockouts, @Mrs Poker Zombie and I have a combined average 0.98 knockouts per time we buy-in or rebuy. A bounty tournament is mathematically -EV for us, while players like @Jonesey07 (with 1.72 KO/buy-in ratio) would probably argue for more money in the bounty pool. As host, you build the rules, so I'm leaning toward a smaller bounty pool - and hosting the Mystery Bounty game when Jonesey is out of town.

Instead of money in envelopes, our prizes will be chips drawn out of a sack.

1. Because MOAR CHIPS.
2. Someone gifted me a set of sluggos with 1s, 5s, 10s, 25s, and 50s. I'm not going to be rude, I'm going to figure out a way to put them in play. Thus, the Zombie Mystery Bounties game was born.

Our games run from 7pm to about 11:45ish, with a break every hour for color ups, drink refills, snacking away from the table, etc. At 2nd break rebuys end, and we race off the smallest denom. We also put away food that should be refrigerated (we serve dinner from 5:30-6:45). That makes 2nd break pretty busy as hosts, so bounties will go live at 3rd break. Historically (and because I keep stats), going back 10 years an average of 57.2% of players remain at 3rd break. That number goes up to 65.6% if you only take the last 5 years, and that's probably because my players have gotten better (learning to fold in the face of obviously better). Eliminations before 3rd break drive up the future value of bounties.

At 3rd break I consult this chart:

13-15 players
2	150	150
3	152	51	51	25	25
4	151	51	50	25	25
5	150	50	50	25	25
6	151	51	50	25	10	10	5
7	151	51	50	25	10	5	5	5
8	151	51	25	25	10	10	10	10	10
9	151	51	25	25	10	10	10	10	5	5
10	151	51	25	25	10	10	10	5	5	5	5
11	151	51	25	10	10	10	10	10	10	5	5	5
12	151	51	25	10	10	10	10	10	5	5	5	5	5
13	151	51	25	10	10	10	10	5	5	5	5	5	5	5
14	150	50	25	10	10	10	10	5	5	5	5	5	5	5
15	150	50	25	10	10	10	5	5	5	5	5	5	5	5	5

The number on the right is the number of players remaining at 3rd break. The rest of the numbers are the individual chips added to the sack, with "51" being a $1 chip worth $50 plus a second draw. Thus, with 14 players we should see 9 players remaining. We add a 1x"51", 2x$25s, 4x$10s, and 2x $5s. The player that draws the 51 gets $50 plus a redraw for a total "Big Prize" between $55-$75 (EV $62.50).

However, that anticipates knockouts per a regular no-bounty night. I can absolutely see big stacks playing more aggressively, driving up the value for the Mystery Bounties. At least that is my hope. I'd love to see someone sweat a draw that could be worth $100.

...and don't worry about how difficult it is to read that chart, as Excel is also how my pay table is displayed. Once I enter the number of players remaining at 3rd break, the payout screen looks like this:
View attachment 1689837

This allows players to both determine the EV of their draw and allows me, at a glance, to determine what chips need to be added to the sack.

Open to thoughts, comments, and concerns.

Do you have players draw their chip as they knock people out or after the tournemant is over?

 

[Poker Zombie]

Do you have players draw their chip as they knock people out or after the tournemant is over?

The current plan is to pause the clock, then let the victim draw the chip to see what they are worth too the victor.

• Gives the eliminated player a little mental reset. I mean, who wouldn't feel a little better knowing that they were the big value target, or jokingly lament that they were only worth $5?
• Allows the entire room to enjoy the sweat
• Allows players that calculate the EV of a knockout to reassess after each KO.

It will make the game run a little longer, as it gives active players one more thing to chatter about and time to sweat the draw. Figure <1 minute to draw the chip shouldn't be too bad though if we are down to the final table. If we are at 2 tables still, it could be up to 3 extra minutes, as I doubt that players would want to pause their hand to watch a draw happening at the other table. The chances that we are still at 2 tables is unlikely though.

If, for some reason, the eliminated player storms off without determining their value we will let the "killer" draw their chip.

 

[Knoxymoron]

let the victim draw the chip to see what they are worth too the victor.

I like it! I agree that it shouldn't take too long to do right then and there and the excitement would make it worth it (for my group of guys anyway). Plus it's the basis of the tournament so everyone should already be aware (and hopefully excited) of this happening.

 

[Taxi500]

Very cool - I never followed up on this thread but the entire process of opening the envelope to find out what bounty a player had won was so much fun we will likely always do something with this effect from now on. The whole room was chanting "25...25...25" (min value) to the guy opening. Was a riot highly recommend.

 

[ScallyWagers]

Mystery bounty is one of the most fun formats for a home game — the "run it twice" reveal moment gets everyone involved. For the structure side, the main thing people trip over is making sure the bounty pool is separate and clearly tracked. We added a payout/chop calculator to ScallyWagers that handles prize pool splits including bounty overlays if that's useful — but honestly even on paper, just keep the bounty envelope count and the regular prize pool completely separate and you'll be fine.


Hope the June 20th game went well!

 

[Poker Zombie]

T-4 hours!

I feel I've got this airtight. Now to see if it's alcohol resistant.

 

[Poker Zombie]

The event went off without a hitch. Drawing bounties was deemed hilariously cruel, as after you were knocked out you would draw to give money to the player that eliminated you.

Not that I know what that feels like. Not only did I eliminate the final 4 players (my only KO's of the night) I also received the top 3 bounty chips, and was awarded 70% of the bounty pool.

 

[Poker Zombie]

As a side note... I kept off the booze* to make sure I had a clear head going into the bounty period so as not to muck up the bounty chip setup.

*I only had a martini, a glass of wine and a beer. After the bounty period had started, I had a 2nd martini and started winning hands.