Tourney To add on or not to add on? That is the question? (1 Viewer)

[SixSeven]

When running a tourney, do you like to have an add on option after break or not, either making it possibly more expensive but gives you more chips to play with, or less expensive but you're stuck with you current stack. This is besides surrendering your stack and rebuying. This is for more lower stakes tourneys, like a $20 buy in. If you like the add on option, keep the add on also at $20, or lower it to $10 or $5 to make it more affordable?

 

[BPTDirector]

The only add on I like is the on time add on, I have used that in the past. Mid- tournament I’m not a fan.

 

[doublebooyah85]

Add ons are generally a money grab and not friendly to the players imho

Rebuys are a good compromise, and at the end of rebuys, a player can “forfeit” their stack for a full rebuy.

 

[upNdown]

I don’t like addons. The only time I’ve used them, I’ve made them contingent on no rebuys - so players know if they get knocked out, they can rebuy, but then they don’t get to add on.

But to answer your question, if you make the add-on cheap enough that everybody will buy it, then what’s the point? The tournament is just artificially extended for everybody.
And if you make the addon more expensive, then you’re giving an advantage to people with deeper pockets.

 

[SixSeven]

Add ons are generally a money grab and not friendly to the players imho

Rebuys are a good compromise, and at the end of rebuys, a player can “forfeit” their stack for a full rebuy.

I feel that way about Add ons. It's just to inflate the pot. But some players, maybe more deep pocketed/more experienced, want an inflated pot, in case they win.

I like what you are saying as Rebuys as a compromise, and forfeit their stack.

 

[SixSeven]

I don’t like addons. The only time I’ve used them, I’ve made them contingent on no rebuys - so players know if they get knocked out, they can rebuy, but then they don’t get to add on.

But to answer your question, if you make the add-on cheap enough that everybody will buy it, then what’s the point? The tournament is just artificially extended for everybody.
And if you make the addon more expensive, then you’re giving an advantage to people with deeper pockets.

I hear you. I like that option that they can't can add on if they rebuy. That keeps the cost fixed.

I was thinking if the money is an issue, but players want more chips after the first break, that making it half or a quarter is affordable, and makes them feel like they have a better chance later in the tournament. If also adds to the pot, making the prizes bigger, although not as much as $20 would if that was the add on cost. Yes you are right, the tourney is artificially extended.

Yes, I agree, that making add on more expensive or even unlimited rebuys is an advantage to those with deeper pockets. Right now I like one rebuy, in case of a cooler. I'm trying to see tho if after the end of rebuys, we should do an add on. So far, many good reasons from you and @doublebooyah85 not to.

 

[Craig D]

You could just do a 2nd chance tournament.... If you take a beat early you get another stack "free" and carry on, if you don't use it early you get a "free add-on" at the first break

Eg You start with 25K if a player busts they get another 25K, unused 2nd chance chips become free add-ons and are exchanged for 25K chips at the first break. I use seating chips, these double as 2nd chance or reentry / add-on coupons, they don't play until they are redeemed for live chips

Have Fun

 

[Santa123]

You could just do a 2nd chance tournament.... If you take a beat early you get another stack "free" and carry on, if you don't use it early you get a "free add-on" at the first break

Eg You start with 25K if a player busts they get another 25K, unused 2nd chance chips become free add-ons and are exchanged for 25K chips at the first break. I use seating chips, these double as 2nd chance or reentry / add-on coupons, they don't play until they are redeemed for live chips

Have Fun

I’ve played Second and Triple Chance tournaments and always found them very pleasant. Basically, almost no players bust in the early levels.

 

[ekricket]

if you make the add-on cheap enough that everybody will buy it, then what’s the point? The tournament is just artificially extended for everybody.

Out structure pretty much is this, if you don’t use your 1/2 rebuy chip before the first break it becomes an addon. Most of the time everyone gets it. We probably play an extra level 3-4 handed because of the chip stack sizes left. But who cares? It’s not a big thing and it helps avoid players going home early on coolers. Players quickly learned that it’s not a license to go crazy.

 

[thePokerClub]

Add on at the first break and end of rebuy period for sure.

As a player, always add on is my philosophy.

 

[Huskerchipper]

I allowed it a couple times this year but decided it wasn't what was best for my group as a whole. It was definitely giving the players with deeper pockets an advantage.

My game is much more focused on being a social get together than a highly competitive whatever it takes to win game. Though nobody complained, I knew that enough people didn't like it that it made my decision easy. The Cons definitely outweighed the Pros on this topic for me. Having your finger on the pulse of your players is the key to running a successful long term game.

 

[thePokerClub]

It was definitely giving the players with deeper pockets an advantage.

I had a concern like you mention re: deeper pockets having an advantage so I actual ran some correlation analysis in R to come up with a quick visual comparing rebuys to wins. Interestingly, the two are not correlated based on that but I am always updating the data after my Events.

Maybe I will post that here.

My rebuy period is first 2 hours, which is long. And then the one optional add on happens at that first 2 hour mark (break).

Thusfar all the data tells me that (with my group) if it is not your night it is not your night and you are you are just pumping the pot

 

[HiveKueen]

I don’t do add ons in my league because we need to get the game over before midnight?

 

[Huskerchipper]

I had a concern like you mention re: deeper pockets having an advantage so I actual ran some correlation analysis in R to come up with a quick visual comparing rebuys to wins. Interestingly, the two are not correlated based on that but I am always updating the data after my Events.

Maybe I will post that here.

My rebuy period is first 2 hours, which is long. And then the one optional add on happens at that first 2 hour mark (break).

Thusfar all the data tells me that (with my group) if it is not your night it is not your night and you are you are just pumping the pot

That's interesting. My data would DEFINITELY show a correlation between Rebuys and Top 3 finishes. Each group is different though.

 

[Gunnar]

I have been an firm no addon in my tournaments I find they devalue the early levels. But I must admit I have never thought about giving players that have not used their second chance an Addon possibility. How would one make that fair ?

Starting stack 25k
Player A busts out player B
Player A has 50k
Player B rebuys for 25k
Break comes and Player A buys an Addon for x chips?

I think the only way to make this fair would be with a scaling rebuy stack
Starting stack 25k
Rebuys first hour 25k
Rebuys after 1 hour 35k
Rebuy at break 40k
Addon stack is then 25k extra for less money than rebuy?

 

[ekricket]

I have been an firm no addon in my tournaments I find they devalue the early levels. But I must admit I have never thought about giving players that have not used their second chance an Addon possibility. How would one make that fair ?

Starting stack 25k
Player A busts out player B
Player A has 50k
Player B rebuys for 25k
Break comes and Player A buys an Addon for x chips?

I think the only way to make this fair would be with a scaling rebuy stack
Starting stack 25k
Rebuys first hour 25k
Rebuys after 1 hour 35k
Rebuy at break 40k
Addon stack is then 25k extra for less money than rebuy?

We do a half starting stack for rebuy. Enough to play but not an advantage to shove and rebuy. But if you don’t use your half stack rebuy it becomes an addon at the first break.

 

[thePokerClub]

That's interesting. My data would DEFINITELY show a correlation between Rebuys and Top 3 finishes. Each group is different though.

Believe me I was surprised by it - maybe over time it will change.

 

[Jaxen]

Of our 7 annual tournaments, 1 has add-ons; it also has "rebuys" as opposed to "re-entries". Then again, this 1 tournament has a lower buy-in, you get fewer BBs (50 to 60) to start and during the 1st 3 levels you can "rebuy" a set amount (less than a full stack) if you get lower than 40% of the starting stack.
All players can add-on at the 1st break (the "rebuy" period ends 3 minutes before the break) for a range of chips for a range of prices. Nearly everyone does except the 1-2 players who build a big stack and still have the chip lead after everyone else adds on (but the point formula rewards those whose total cost is lower). It never fails the pot for this one is always bigger than a higher buy-in freezeout with the same sized field.

 

[Labrat]

Reading this thread makes me love cash games a little bit more.

 

[Defarse]

No to addons. Yes to rebuys.