Sports Trash Talk (5 Viewers)

So if it’s a blatant illegal screen and Paige drains a game winning jumper because she’s wide open from the pick, you’re cool with that? So instead of the team that sets the illegal pick having their season end, it’s the team that got screwed when the ref swallows his whistle has their season end? It’s a tough way to end the season for either team. But for the talking heads with heavy UCONN bias to say the call sucked in the post-game chatter is just wrong.

That said, as soon as the call was made, I told my wife and daughter, “that looks like a good call, but refs hardly ever call it.”
Your kids played sports, you know better. That play is made thousands of times without being called.

Yes, in football you don’t call holding on every single play. In basketball, you don’t call carry on every single ball handler. Etc, etc.

And yes, you know the answer. You swallow the whistle there. In every sport everywhere, you let the players determine the finish.

Guess what? Before someone decides to run off a stagger screen, defender holds a jersey. Every single out of bounds play end of the game there’s a significant push off because no defender would flop in that moment to try and draw a call for fear of giving up an easy shot. On and on and on and on.

There’s protocol for this that everyone understands. Idc who wins, and reverse the teams and I stand pat. It was the wrong decision.

Total guess here. If you could privately poll every nba and wnba player, coach, and rep, I’m guessing an overwhelming % would prefer no call there, regardless of which side they’re on.

Edit to say for people that want the whistle blown there…whelp I’d advise those people to not watch NFL, NBA, NHL, or really most any sport at the highest level. Because rules, regulations, and refs are there to control the game and it’s well known that discernment is applied throughout the games. You’ll have a conniption fit trying to understand why and when they call things.
 
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Your kids played sports, you know better. That play is made thousands of times without being called.

Yes, in football you don’t call holding on every single play. In basketball, you don’t call carry on every single ball handler. Etc, etc.

And yes, you know the answer. You swallow the whistle there. In every sport everywhere, you let the players determine the finish.

Guess what? Before someone decides to run off a stagger screen, defender holds a jersey. Every single out of bounds play end of the game there’s a significant push off because no defender would flop in that moment to try and draw a call for fear of giving up an easy shot. On and on and on and on.

There’s protocol for this that everyone understands. Idc who wins, and reverse the teams and I stand pat. It was the wrong decision.

Total guess here. If you could privately poll every nba and wnba player, coach, and rep, I’m guessing an overwhelming % would prefer no call there, regardless of which side they’re on.
Personally, I’m guessing that an overwhelming percent of players and coaches would want the refs to be consistent throughout the game and not swallow their whistle at the end of a game.

My beef with your original post is you said for some of those UCONN players this was their final game. They put in thousands of hours of work at the gym and practiced even more shots. And their careers ended on a [correct] foul call. You seem to think it’s ok for the Iowa players - who put in those same thousands of hours and even more shots - to end THEIR playing careers on a blatant no-call.
 
My opinion - it’s not blatant enough to warrant letting the refs determine the game outcome instead of the players.

If the NCAA really wants people to watch more women’s basketball, instead of shoving Caitlin Clark down our throats (who won’t be there next year), let those moments happen where Paige either hits it or misses for a trip to the National Championship. When they play the One Shining Moment montage at the end of the NCAA tournament, they don’t have a bunch of moments where refs are coming in and calling fouls.

FWIW, I would’ve hated the call if it was on Clark with 8 seconds left too.

Let ‘em play.
 
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Personally, I’m guessing that an overwhelming percent of players and coaches would want the refs to be consistent throughout the game and not swallow their whistle at the end of a game.
I would agree here, this doesn’t disagree with my statement. If they called every illegal pick throughout the entire game and this game heavily regulated, then that whistle should be blown.

If it wasn’t, then I as an athlete would expect consistency with how every almost every game I’ve played up til now has been called, expecting to play through some additional contact and movement in the final frame. 100% agree with you, and don’t think your statement actually supports your stance.
My beef with your original post is you said for some of those UCONN players this was their final game. They put in thousands of hours of work at the gym and practiced even more shots. And their careers ended on a [correct] foul call. You seem to think it’s ok for the Iowa players - who put in those same thousands of hours and even more shots - to end THEIR playing careers on a blatant no-call.
Naw, I didn’t even think of Iowa players. Place this as the final instead of semi final - I’d hold the same stance for players on both sides of the coin. I would hate to think anyone’s last game ends on a whistle - winners or losers. Shot goes up and everyone deals with the results, i.e., how things normally (consistently) happen.

I would personally not want to be on the winning side of this. I didn’t spend the thousands of minutes hours and days to win on a whistle. I’m winning cause I bodied home girl up and she misses.

Honestly maybe I’m completely off base, who knows? But the time I put in, I would’ve hated a whistle. And anyone on the winning side who wants a whistle there? Lol I’d rather have them on the other team than mine, cause they ain’t it. And that’s coming from some scrub who couldn’t even really walk on at his NAIA college (simply inferring that I know the effort I put in, and I’d hate a call. Couldn’t imagine the level these athletes have poured in). I’d be heavily disappointed if any of the kids on the teams I coach want a call there.
 
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@Himewad I could center myself a little by saying I do agree it was blatant. The screen completely reset the defenders trajectory to be taken out of the play. I *would* agree that the whistle should be called if this happened with the defender on an island leading to a point blank layup/dunk.

But that wasn’t the case, a second defender was right there, and were 20 feet from the rim. There’s still plenty of time and action to occur. Similarly, what if an illegal screen happens off the ball here that has 0 effect on the play? Or a defender holds a player having nothing to do with the on the ball actions? A whistle there to end the game for either side?

There’s levels to this.
 
If you rewatch that game, CONN gets called for 3 illegal screens, Iowa gets called for none. Also the foul disparity after the half is ridiculously one-sided. There is a clip out there of a foul being called on a driving Iowa player and literally nobody touched her.
 
I hated the call when it was made.

I still don’t like the call but I do think Edwards moved in panic. Gabbie was already trailing. Personally, I think you swallow the whistle and let it play out there. If you look at Edwards elbow, you can tell that she’s trying to do extra and maybe that triggered it. I’ve never seen a screen set with the elbows bent outward that way.
 
If someone was called jockeying for position under the basket, sure, I think that would be ridiculous.

But to suggest that Edwards should have been allowed to move the key defender out of position with a blatantly illegal screen because we “need to let the players determine the outcome” is equally ridiculous.

Edwards wasn’t set, her feet were wide, her elbow came out. I don’t even think Gabbi sold it. It was solid contact from a much bigger player.

 
The better question is "in what sport is this NOT a penalty?" Seriously. In basketball it is the moving screen. In hockey they call the elbow. In football they flag it for the crack back block. This was so bad that the officials eating their whistles would be cause to investigate.
 
If someone was called jockeying for position under the basket, sure, I think that would be ridiculous.

But to suggest that Edwards should have been allowed to move the key defender out of position with a blatantly illegal screen because we “need to let the players determine the outcome” is equally ridiculous.

Edwards wasn’t set, her feet were wide, her elbow came out. I don’t even think Gabbi sold it. It was solid contact from a much bigger player.

Exactly. That video is gold.
 
I’ve been a sports fan all my life and I’ve never understood the appeal of college basketball. But I guess I could say the same for college sports in general. I get rooting for a school if you went there or if your kid goes there. But otherwise, why not watch the professionals?
 
I’ve been a sports fan all my life and I’ve never understood the appeal of college basketball. But I guess I could say the same for college sports in general. I get rooting for a school if you went there or if your kid goes there. But otherwise, why not watch the professionals?
College basketball has the best post season tournament of any sport. Pro, college, amateur, etc.

It’s a truly “any team can win any year” thing: That’s the appeal and I will die on that hill.
 
I’ve been a sports fan all my life and I’ve never understood the appeal of college basketball. But I guess I could say the same for college sports in general. I get rooting for a school if you went there or if your kid goes there. But otherwise, why not watch the professionals?
It was the school pride, the rivalries, the passion, and in some instances the determination to get to the next level.

NIL is/has ruined this.
 
I would blame the transfer portal more than NIL.
In a conversation with friends, I just said that NIL and the transfer portal doesn’t play well together.

With the NIL in place, the old transfer rules need to be reimplemented. If you transfer, you sit out a year. That would at least give coaches the ability to kind of coach these kids again.
 
College athletics WERE the best. Kids playing their hearts out for the love of the game. Decades and century old rivalries in some cases. The traditions of college sports WAS like no other. One by one, each beauty is being disintegrated.

The entitlement and BS of pro sports pushed me away a long time ago.
 
In a conversation with friends, I just said that NIL and the transfer portal doesn’t play well together.

With the NIL in place, the old transfer rules need to be reimplemented. If you transfer, you sit out a year. That would at least give coaches the ability to kind of coach these kids again.
Totally agree. An Iowa high school offensive lineman (highly rated) ended up taking an offer from Alabama last year (can’t really blame him for that). He was so good he started as a freshman thru the national title game. After Saban retired, he transferred to Iowa, where he took $100K in NIL money. Couple weeks later, he re-enters the portal and is going back to Alabama, keeping the money. Both the portal and NIL have combined to ruin college sports.
 
Totally agree. An Iowa high school offensive lineman (highly rated) ended up taking an offer from Alabama last year (can’t really blame him for that). After Saban retired, he transferred to Iowa, where he took $100K in NIL money. Couple weeks later, he re-enters the portal and is going back to Alabama, keeping the money. Both the portal and NIL have combined to ruin college sports.
It’s truly sad. I’ve heard coaches say in interviews that kids are coming in and asking them how much money they can make at a specific school. It’s definitely not amateur sports anymore. These kids are essentially negotiating deals.
 
It was the school pride, the rivalries, the passion, and in some instances the determination to get to the next level.

NIL is/has ruined this.
I disagree. I think NIL could fix a lot of the problems. Do your biggest stars still leave for the pros? Probably. But your 1B stars might stay longer to cash in on the money instead of trying their hand in the draft where they payday might not be a sure thing.

And paying these players is the right thing to do. You can say NIL killed the vibes, but really it was the NCAA making billions of dollars from cable channels that created the gap, and the schools benefitted right behind them. The only ones who couldn’t benefit were the ones creating the product on the field. And if they did benefit through back door channels, they got their Heisman taken away.

At the end of the day, the NIL money won’t even come close to what these sports generate. If the product on the field suffers, blame the big guys. Because at the end of the day, they’re the ones who don’t give a damn if the product suffers. It’s still making them too much money to cause them any stress
 
I disagree. I think NIL could fix a lot of the problems. Do your biggest stars still leave for the pros? Probably. But your 1B stars might stay longer to cash in on the money instead of trying their hand in the draft where they payday might not be a sure thing.
What you end up with is a watered down version of basketball that no one cares about cause these guys don’t have much pro potential and the focus switches to something else (ala Women’s College Basketball)

And paying these players is the right thing to do. You can say NIL killed the vibes, but really it was the NCAA making billions of dollars from cable channels that created the gap, and the schools benefitted right behind them. The only ones who couldn’t benefit were the ones creating the product on the field. And if they did benefit through back door channels, they got their Heisman taken away.
I never said these players shouldn’t be compensated for their name image and likeness, I’m saying that it has to be controlled. The sports are being watered down because the focus is more on being paid. Mind you, the NCAA and the colleges are not footing the bill so it bothers me when people act as if the NCAA and the schools are not still profiting off of these kids.

At the end of the day, the NIL money won’t even come close to what these sports generate. If the product on the field suffers, blame the big guys. Because at the end of the day, they’re the ones who don’t give a damn if the product suffers. It’s still making them too much money to cause them any stress
Not even sure how to respond to this.


All I’m saying is that you have to put protocols in place to keep some level of control. Lots of people and social media with no understanding of internal workings of how this sports operates are influencing these decisions and causing chaos.

And I do believe these schools are operating at a financial loss in a lot of these situations while people believe they are “generating millions”. I happen to know for a fact that there are schools that are operating with 8 figure deficits just to try and keep up.
 
What you end up with is a watered down version of basketball that no one cares about cause these guys don’t have much pro potential and the focus switches to something else (ala Women’s College Basketball)


I never said these players shouldn’t be compensated for their name image and likeness, I’m saying that it has to be controlled. The sports are being watered down because the focus is more on being paid. Mind you, the NCAA and the colleges are not footing the bill so it bothers me when people act as if the NCAA and the schools are not still profiting off of these kids.


Not even sure how to respond to this.


All I’m saying is that you have to put protocols in place to keep some level of control. Lots of people and social media with no understanding of internal workings of how this sports operates are influencing these decisions and causing chaos.

And I do believe these schools are operating at a financial loss in a lot of these situations while people believe they are “generating millions”. I happen to know for a fact that there are schools that are operating with 8 figure deficits just to try and keep up.
I think we’re a lot closer to the same viewpoint on this than it might have come off. I 100% agree that it needs better management and oversight for it to work as intended. It’s the Wild West right now out there, and it for sure has an impact on the court, pools and fields. But until it’s better regulated, I’m totally ok with the players going out and getting everything they can for themselves

And while I would prefer that the people actually making money off the play of the players were the ones footing the bill for the NIL, that’s the line in the sand that’s been drawn by the NCAA, who are, curiously, the ones who have the most to gain by not footing the bill from their own pockets. But can you blame them if they have businesses practically falling over themselves to dole out NIL money to these players? And as long as they’re getting something “valuable” back in exchange for those NIL dollars, it would seem that the system is “working” for all parties involved.

The one place that I feel we do differ is that people will care less if the product isn’t as good on field/court. Ratings would suggest otherwise. People still care. A lot. And while there were still a fair number of upsets and instability within the bracket this year, it still wound up being largely chalk at the end, save for a Cinderella run by NC State (Damnit. Damnitdamnit. (Still waiting for Marquette to hit some 3’s)). As far as I can tell, NIL has just meant that people are talking about college sports even more than before. Whether it’s trying to figure out how the hell it works and what it means, or about the unknown it brings to the sports, and rarely in a bad way.

While I’m sure there are some schools out there that are operating at a loss, my guess would be that they might not have the benefit of a robust football and basketball program to help foot the bill. And a lot of these schools will have to decide what it is they want to do and where they want to dig their heels in against the system. It will mean they lose out on some prospects for sure, but I don’t see how that’s any different than what pulls people to different professional sports teams when they’re free agents. I’m a huge Brewers fan, and I know that every year the Yankees and Mets and the Effing Dodgers will outspend Milwaukee by a mile. Does it suck? Sure does. And I won’t say it doesn’t. But does a salary cap fix the problem? Probably a little, but there will still be huge disparities. Same in the NCAA.

And do I think a bunch of people with no business making real decisions on the issues forced the hand of the NCAA into making this decision? Yup! Do I care? Not really. The powers that be dragged their feet on this issue for far too long. They could have worked on how to roll this out in a coordinated and meaningful fashion, but they chose to count their money instead. I’m just happy that anyone gave traction to the problem and got the ball moving. Now they need to figure out how to level the playing field as much as possible for all parties involved to corral the instability.

TLDR: NCAA bad! Product good (enough, for now)
 

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