No more auctions (1 Viewer)

Kyle said:
Better then "PM me your offer" Fuck that. You have no idea where you stand.
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I agree. I hate that shit.

All three of my non custom sets were purchased via a private sale (TRK Hot stamps, TRK Poseidon's, and BCC Mardi Gras). I've sold a few sets privately as well. Sometimes if I'm selling a set I'll do a forum search and see who is/was interested in it and I'll make them an offer. Sometimes we negotiate and make the sale. Sometimes we don't.

I don't necessarily care for auctions. That's because my pockets aren't as deep as some of the PCF'ers here. I guess its more "jealousy" than anything else lol
 
detroitdad said:
I agree. I hate that shit.

All three of my non custom sets were purchased via a private sale (TRK Hot stamps, TRK Poseidon's, and BCC Mardi Gras). I've sold a few sets privately as well. Sometimes if I'm selling a set I'll do a forum search and see who is/was interested in it and I'll make them an offer. Sometimes we negotiate and make the sale. Sometimes we don't.

I don't necessarily care for auctions. That's because my pockets aren't as deep as some of the PCF'ers here. I guess its more "jealousy" than anything else lol
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Your last point here is what hits me. There’s a lot of talk about “market price” blah blah blah, but it’s really the deep pockets guys who can “set” the “market price”.
Imagine what you would end up with in life if you had to bid against Bill Gates and Warren Buffett for everything and they got to “set the market price”.
 
Fine to have opinions and be a bit hypocrite (I agree everyone is to an extent) but if you’re going to take the time to make a public statement about it in a quite negative tone including providing reasons that they’re not necessary to sell your chips, you should probably make sure someone can’t easily fact check if you sold stuff via auctions.

GIANTDustySquid said:
I do not find it fair to say "an auction is the only way to find out true market value of a chip".

You can argue, "it doesn't matter what class of person you are, the value is determined by what someone is willing to pay for the product" all you want, but when you have people literally trying to suck every cent out of their chips

I do not think this is a realistic expectation for judging "market value".

At the end of the day, why can't you just put a price on your chips, and put them for sale?

Add on your shipping fees, and your nuisance fees or whatever, and put a frigging price on your chips. It's embarassing.

NO MORE AUCTIONS!
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:whistle: :whistling::whistle: :whistling::whistle: :whistling:

Cause if you did, people are inevitably going to mention it.
 
ekricket said:
Your last point here is what hits me. There’s a lot of talk about “market price” blah blah blah, but it’s really the deep pockets guys who can “set” the “market price”.
Imagine what you would end up with in life if you had to bid against Bill Gates and Warren Buffett for everything and they got to “set the market price”.
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Except if Bill Gates and Warren Buffet got into a bidding war for say a Honda Element and it went for $16M, that wouldn’t mean Honda could price the car at $16M and expect to sell more of them. The market price isn’t the last sale price (that’s an estimate of the current/future price) it’s what people are willing to pay now/for the next sale.

So sexy
289384
 
ReallyGoodUsername said:
Except if Bill Gates and Warren Buffet got into a bidding war for say a Honda Element and it went for $16M, that wouldn’t mean Honda could price the car at $16M and expect to sell more of them. The market price isn’t the last sale price (that’s an estimate of the current/future price) it’s what people are willing to pay now/for the next sale.

So sexy
View attachment 289384
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True but If Warren buffet and bill Gates are suddenly in the market for a grail set, that set is gonna go for more than it would otherwise.

I don't love it, but high prices are the way of the chipping world and most other things these days.
 
Perthmike said:
True but If Warren buffet and bill Gates are suddenly in the market for a grail set, that set is gonna go for more than it would otherwise.

I don't love it, but high prices are the way of the chipping world and most other things these days.
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Grail sets make up a tiny part of the chip sales here, are hard to value, and the number of likely buyers is very small which is why I used the Honda Element example.

The point being that one person overpaying for non-grail chip sale would be treated as an outlier when valuing the same chips going forward. Sure someone could price dice chips for $5/chip based on a sale they saw for that price but it doesn’t mean they’d sell them at that price.
 
ReallyGoodUsername said:
Grail sets make up a tiny part of the chip sales here, are hard to value, and the number of likely buyers is very small which is why I used the Honda Element example.

The point being that one person overpaying for non-grail chip sale would be treated as an outlier when valuing the same chips going forward. Sure someone could price dice chips for $5/chip based on a sale they saw for that price but it doesn’t mean they’d sell them at that price.
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Haha I'm just salty that I'm no longer buying mint paulsons at $1usd, when the aud was above parity.

Now I'm paying $2-$3 usd and the aud is worth 0.68.

It's no one's fault, there are more buyers about and we only have one clay manufacturer left that's selling to the public.
 
Perthmike said:
Haha I'm just salty that I'm no longer buying mint paulsons at $1usd, when the aud was above parity.

Now I'm paying $2-$3 usd and the aud is worth 0.68.

It's no one's fault, there are more buyers about and we only have one clay manufacturer left that's selling to the public.
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Agreed on all those points and I wasn’t even here in the hay day. Very surprised at how many new members there are each week since I joined too but hopefully the influx of the Jack casinos, the roadhouse, and maybe even an MGM/Wynn casino soon, will push price down across the board (except prob grail stuff :().

Looking at the 2013-2016 classifieds makes me sad.
 
ReallyGoodUsername said:
Grail sets make up a tiny part of the chip sales here, are hard to value, and the number of likely buyers is very small which is why I used the Honda Element example.

The point being that one person overpaying for non-grail chip sale would be treated as an outlier when valuing the same chips going forward. Sure someone could price dice chips for $5/chip based on a sale they saw for that price but it doesn’t mean they’d sell them at that price.
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The grail sets are more like late 60's muscle cars for this analogy.
 
GIANTDustySquid said:
I know everyone has a right to sell their chips for whatever they want, but come off it, put a price on your chips and negotiate from there if you have to!

Damn near 100% of the world's true chip (set) enthusiasts are on PCF. Among them are many different classes of people.

I do not find it fair to say "an auction is the only way to find out true market value of a chip".

You can argue, "it doesn't matter what class of person you are, the value is determined by what someone is willing to pay for the product" all you want, but when you have people literally trying to suck every cent out of their chips, from THE ONLY group of people who is (likely) even interested in buying these chips (it's embarassing) (if they're interested in buying these chips, they're likely on PCF), then you get nothing but an inflated price, and overall, an expectation from the buyer that they could themselves sell these chips for the same price at a future time.

I do not think this is a realistic expectation for judging "market value".
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The market value of just about everything out there is based on an auction somewhere. If somebody's willing to pay $3.12 million for a Honus Wagner baseball card, that is the current value of that explicit baseball card. Does that mean the next Honus Wagner card will sell for that? Nope. It's going to sell for what the next buyer is willing to pay for it and that's going to be the value of THAT card. Whether or not the buyer will then sell for a loss is the problem of that buyer, not the original seller. In fact, look at the current market of sports trading cards. It's in the tank. Believe it or not someday the chip market may tank, also. It happens all the time.

It's up to the buyer to determine what the current value of something is. The seller can make an educated guess by putting a reserve on it, but they are risking that it may not sell.

The entire POINT of selling something is to maximize a profit. To fault a seller for such a thing reeks of nothing but sour grapes and is completely unfair. If somebody wants to overpay for something, that's completely up to them.
 
I am not sure where I stand on auctions. I do find it bizarre when sales go higher than other active for sale ads for the same chips (I have seen that several times with AS $25 and $100 chips).

Keep in mind auction sales can also go for less than previous sales and there is some risk if the reserve is set low.

Lately it seems like the timing of Chiproom sales can really effect how quickly things sell and for what price (availability of mint chips and expectation of sales).
 
Because these are a niche item. A collectors item. It makes sense that an auction is the fairest way to sell them

A one of a kind rack, never to be duplicated shouldn't fall into the 'list your price and just sell it" category.

If i saw a rack of chips that i was looking for get sold because i wasn't checking the classifieds every 5 minutes (yup, has happened to us all :() I'd be upset i missed the sale, knowing i would have been more than happy to pay over what the selling price was.

An auction gives people the chance to find chips/ sets they were looking for, it also gives them time to think about buying sets that they hadn't considered.

Just like eBay, you should approach any auction with an idea of what you are willing to pay. The MAX you are willing to pay. You hope to get it cheaper but at least you know your ceiling. And if you dont win the auction, then i guess someone else was willing to pay more than you.
It's simple and it's fair.

Long live the auction !
 
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And......

I never took an economics class but i understand that anything and everything is only worth its use to the person, or what anyone is willing to pay for it.
 
abby99 said:
I think that many/most members want a fair price for their chips and don't want to either gouge an unsuspecting member or practically give the chips away because he/she underestimates the market. When buying, I prefer seeing an ad with a fixed price.

I remember seeing a sale where a price was set and the seller conducted a raffle to determine which interested members could buy the chips at an attractive price.
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I'm not a fan of raffles (artificially inflated prices), auctions (buyer-inflated prices / deep pockets), 'PM offer' sales (not transparent), or even dibs sales (pure luck of right place/right time).

Instead, I've long been a proponent of fixed-price sales ads with a subsequent raffle to determine the actual buyer from a list of those who wish to purchase the chips at the listed price.

Imo, it is by far the fairest way to sell. It is no harder or longer than an auction without the drawbacks, and also gives all interested parties a chance at purchase.

An auction with a stated BIN price is a lesser-of-two-evils alternative, although it too is much better if allowing more than one buyer to claim BIN and subsequently run a drawing to select the purchaser.

I'd like to see PCF restrict all Classified sales ads to those two types only, each with a mandatory fixed-time window (3-5 days seems reasonable).
 
Labrat said:
The entire POINT of selling something is to maximize a profit. To fault a seller for such a thing reeks of nothing but sour grapes and is completely unfair. If somebody wants to overpay for something, that's completely up to them.
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Sorry, but that's simply not true -- not everybody sells with the intent to maximize profits (and screw your neighbor).

One of the wonderful aspects of the chip community behavior of old was that desireable chips could -- and did -- move around within to various places while rarely or barely increasing in price at all. People would resell at their actual cost once no longer using them, releasing them back into the wild to be enjoyed by others (as had been done with them). Paying it forward, in a sense.

Only by the addition of a few profit-driven people (some call them flippers) did this start to change to a 'me-first' environment, although many private deals are still conducted among those chippers who still respect the old ideals.
 
BGinGA said:
Sorry, but that's simply not true -- not everybody sells with the intent to maximize profits (and screw your neighbor).

One of the wonderful aspects of the chip community behavior of old was that desireable chips could -- and did -- move around within to various places while rarely or barely increasing in price at all. People would resell at their actual cost once no longer using them, releasing them back into the wild to be enjoyed by others (as had been done with them). Paying it forward, in a sense.

Only by the addition of a few profit-driven people (some call them flippers) did this start to change to a 'me-first' environment, although many private deals are still conducted among those chippers who still respect the old ideals.
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I wish I could like this more than once.
 
BGinGA said:
Sorry, but that's simply not true -- not everybody sells with the intent to maximize profits (and screw your neighbor).

One of the wonderful aspects of the chip community behavior of old was that desireable chips could -- and did -- move around within to various places while rarely or barely increasing in price at all. People would resell at their actual cost once no longer using them, releasing them back into the wild to be enjoyed by others (as had been done with them). Paying it forward, in a sense.

Only by the addition of a few profit-driven people (some call them flippers) did this start to change to a 'me-first' environment, although many private deals are still conducted among those chippers who still respect the old ideals.
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Preach. Amen.
 
@davin The part about selling my jacks was a joke

@slisk250 you should ask the buyer from my kings auction what I offered him after that auction before you judge me based on those auctions. I had more of those chips (4x as many I think?) and let them go for much less than the auction price even after "finding their market value" instead of gouging for every dollar that I could have and probably SHOULD have considering the shenanigans that go on here.

Any others wanna take a personal shot at me regarding the OP?
 
GIANTDustySquid said:
@davin The part about selling my jacks was a joke

@slisk250 you should ask the buyer from my kings auction what I offered him after that auction before you judge me based on those auctions. I had more of those chips (4x as many I think?) and let them go for much less than the auction price even after "finding their market value" instead of gouging for every dollar that I could have and probably SHOULD have considering the shenanigans that go on here.

Any others wanna take a personal shot at me regarding the OP?
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I don’t have a dog in this fight, but it seems like you could have eliminated any criticism of hypocrisy by stating this in the OP, and maybe how holding those auctions and other recent situations have helped to form your opinion that auctions are greasy.
 
Beakertwang said:
I don’t have a dog in this fight, but it seems like you could have eliminated any criticism of hypocrisy by stating this in the OP, and maybe how holding those auctions and other recent situations have helped to form your opinion that auctions are greasy.
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Beakertwang is playing 4D chess here....
 
cpac54 said:
For the record, I think the comparison to bread is off here. Bread is common. Heck, I can make bread myself (and regularly do). Paulson chips? Not so common and I sure as heck can't make them myself (wouldn't that be nice).
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I agree... I think a better comparison would be fine art.

Another niche market, with a tiny audience, who have some disposable income, to spend on their private collectibles/collection.
 

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