Is this a misdeal? (1 Viewer)

[jazzV3]

This happened during a game this weekend and there was some debate about whether it should have been considered a misdeal.

Game is 7 card stud - there are 5 chairs at the table, but only 4 players in the hand.
One player got up before the deal began and said he had to take a business call, and "don't deal me in".

Dealer starts pitching cards and deals 3 cards to each of the 5 seats. One player notices the extra hand dealt just as the dealer is giving himself his up card and verbally declares a misdeal.
One player has looked at his hand. The other 3 have not looked at their hole cards. The player who looked objects that it's a misdeal. Ultimately, the cards were tossed in and the hand re-dealt.

Thoughts?

 

[colter ripton]

It's a misdeal

Especially since there was no action yet.

 

[FordPickup92]

Seems like a misdeal to me. Was the objecting player overly upset?

 

[toothpic]

Definitely a misdeal.

 

[1A25R]

Misdeal because
" One or more players receive more or fewer than the proper number of cards."
Player was sit out and declared "don't deal me in" however cards were dealt to him.


Now, another interesting point in the history above is that "poker etiquette" where not followed, the player look at his cards while the dealt was still going on.
Where it leads?
To avoid UTG folding his cards before all cards are dealt and throwing his card over UTG+3 player that did not yet collected his cards and avoid the "which are my cards" / "your hand is dead" debate

 

[jazzV3]

Seems like a misdeal to me. Was the objecting player overly upset?

He was, but he got over it...

 

[FordPickup92]

He was, but he got over it...

Well that's a positive, I've always wondered how people in home games handle someone who gets excessive.... too many beers and some he said she said and someone doesn't come back to that game ever again. Glad he had some common sense

 

[Imaduck]

I think because it's Stud this is always a misdeal. For NLHE, the rules vary by location, but usually they'll just kill the extra hand.

 

[1A25R]

For NLHE, the rules vary by location, but usually they'll just kill the extra hand.

Anyone can, of course, made his own house rules and therefore state that's this misdeal is not.
But based in one of the most popular rules used the “Robert’s Rules Of Poker” by Robert Ciaffone, it's a misdeal (page 8, point i)

http://www.pokercoach.us/robspkrrules4.htm

 

[Cougar300]

Misdeal - that is correct

 

[JustinInMN]

It's a misdeal so long as there hasn't been substantial action. If someone actually got to the point where someone acted on their hand after the force, then you would have to kill the extra hand and play to completion.

(Edit, two players action after the force constitute substantial action. http://www.pokercoach.us/robspkrrules4.htm )

Player shouldn't be upset about the misdeal. Obviously the "sacred order of the cards" would have been different if not for the mistake.

 

[WedgeRock]

Mr. Quick-to-declare-a-misdeal ought to ask the house for a ruling.

He cannot substitute his ruling for the house and needs at least a warning. If he doesn't like how the house rules, he can stop playing there.

 

[JustinInMN]

Mr. Quick-to-declare-a-misdeal ought to ask the house for a ruling.

He cannot substitute his ruling for the house and needs at least a warning. If he doesn't like how the house rules, he can stop playing there.

This is an important point. You don't want to open to door to players releasing their hands just because one player says "misdeal" (I get the feeling this was another thread at some point and I would wager @WedgeRock made the same observation there.) Players need to get in the habit of deferring to the house for ruling questions like this.

 

[jazzV3]

Mr. Quick-to-declare-a-misdeal ought to ask the house for a ruling.

He cannot substitute his ruling for the house and needs at least a warning. If he doesn't like how the house rules, he can stop playing there.

Player declaring misdeal did not throw in his hand on declaration. There was a consensus from all players before tossing in the cards with the exception of the one player who looked at his hand.

 

[WedgeRock]

Had he looked at his hand, it would have underscored my point. But declaring a misdeal can induce discards... The house should be the one to declare the misdeal. Announcing as way way of asking for a ruling is fine, but announcing and discarding is a no-no.

Although not by the book, the games I usually play in will just make a deal right rather than declare a misdeal (unless it really gets jacked up). For consistency sake, it's important to defer to the house. If you don't like the house rule because it varies from RRoP, fold the hand or find a new game.

 

[slacker]

I ran into a similar situation in the last game I hosted. A player lost all his chips and was not buying back in and was accidentally dealt in in the next hand. I called a misdeal and threw my cards away as the deal was finishing up. The cards did not come out in the proper order and there had not been any action yet. Only one dude had looked at his cards and he completely disagreed with me. His argument was that it was "a waste if time".

 

[1A25R]

"a waste if time".

Pretty solid argument while you are gambling, smoking and drinking ...



Hey, keep playing ! Don't waste my wasted time !