I think my game is dying... (2 Viewers)

[Statesvegas]

I have hosted a game for about 6 years, generally playing every other week. Sometimes more frequently, rarely less frequently.

We had a group of about 10 regulars that I was always able to get at least 6 players from each game, but we usually had a full table of 8. I had read other threads about how if I wasn't growing the game, then it was dying but I did not think they applied to me. I fear I was mistaken.

The convergence of three events in the past two months have affected my player pool, and my efforts at getting new players that I would feel comfortable with have not yet been successful.

1. My son left to go to college last week. He had never missed a game since he started playing, and he was by far the best technical player at the game.
2. One of the older very regular players has recently stepped away from the game, feeling that his mental acuity is slipping (and he is correct);
3. A third regular had a serious health issue that has and will prevent him from playing cards for the foreseeable future, and perhaps permanently.

I have been unable to have a game the past two weekends because of lack of players, and I do not see the situation improving absent my adding some more to the group. As the game is hosted in my home and the type of work I do, I have to be very careful on who I will invite to the game.

Hopefully I can still salvage my game by finding some new players before my remaining, existing players find another game.

Anyway, this is my public service announcement - Always be looking to add players to your home game, or you may suddenly find yourself without a game.

 

[allforcharity]

Always be recruiting. If it's not growing, it's dying. I have realized this over 12 years of charitable fundraising.

 

[Ben8257]

Hey Charles,

I am sure you are aware of this… but from my experience growing a game has always revolved around tournaments. I know you’re a cash game player from the sets you acquire. But every single game I play in there are always 20 - 40 willing tournament players and then typically ONE cash table afterwards.

Soo many players I feel like are more comfortable with a “pre determined loss” and it’s a whole different story when you add in words like “no limit”… it can be scary or intimidating to less experienced players.

Not sure why but always seems true everywhere you go! The best cash game in our area is solid… but when the host @DarkHelmet55 decides to run a tourney league we get 3 tables… guess what we have a cash game time… 8 to 10 players which we will split to two tables of 5 because it is all mixed games. Now we all buy in for $200 on every single cash night and while we play $.25/$.50 it plays way bigger. On those tournament nights we try and recruit cash players and tell them “hey you can buy in for $20” sometimes we get a player or two… sometimes those players run it up and we get them hooked.

TL/DR hey if it’s dying sometimes throwing in the occasional tourney and lowering the stakes to draw in tourney players to help revitalize the game!

Wish I was closer brotha man!! Good Luck with recruiting.

Ben

 

[MrCatPants]

Hey Charles,

I am sure you are aware of this… but from my experience growing a game has always revolved around tournaments. I know you’re a cash game player from the sets you acquire. But every single game I play in there are always 20 - 40 willing tournament players and then typically ONE cash table afterwards.

Soo many players I feel like are more comfortable with a “pre determined loss” and it’s a whole different story when you add in words like “no limit”… it can be scary or intimidating to less experienced players.

Not sure why but always seems true everywhere you go! The best cash game in our area is solid… but when the host @DarkHelmet55 decides to run a tourney league we get 3 tables… guess what we have a cash game time… 8 to 10 players which we will split to two tables of 5 because it is all mixed games. Now we all buy in for $200 on every single cash night and while we play $.25/$.50 it plays way bigger. On those tournament nights we try and recruit cash players and tell them “hey you can buy in for $20” sometimes we get a player or two… sometimes those players run it up and we get them hooked.

TL/DR hey if it’s dying sometimes throwing in the occasional tourney and lowering the stakes to draw in tourney players to help revitalize the game!

Wish I was closer brotha man!! Good Luck with recruiting.

Ben

I agree that adding tourney players is easier than adding cash players. 7 year game here, and nearly complete turnover of the player base due to deaths, moves, financial issues, lost interest, etc.

Four things I suggest in order of ease/effectiveness:

1) Ask your players to each bring in a new player.
2) Post on PCF/reach out to any reasonably local PCFers (I'll give you my vetting techniques by PM if you are feeling unsure about this)
3) Talk it up with your neighbors, kids sports teams dads, church people, etc. Just slip it into conversations that you host a regular game. You'll know if you get a bite. It is hard to find a good game if you don't have one.
4) Find out if there is a game your players know of that died in the last two years- may be able to rope those into your game and "adopt" them.

And then make sure to step up your hosting when you get new players. I was getting growlers of craft beer and providing snacks, and tossing in lottery scratch offs to early pots as pot splashers. You have to get them interested in coming back.

Suggest you do these ASAP. One the game dies, it's dead. At least right now it's still on life support.

 

[doublebooyah85]

Summer is also the hardest time to add to your game. Don’t get discouraged.

 

[MrCatPants]

Summer is also the hardest to add to your game.

very good point. That and December.

 

[doublebooyah85]

very good point. That and December.

And NFL season is the easiest. Monday and Thursday night. People are going to be up late watching the game anyway.

 

[MrCatPants]

And NFL season is the easiest. Monday and Thursday night. People are going to be up late watching the game anyway.

Good additional point. Weekend games are actually pretty tough. Weekdays FTW

 

[doublebooyah85]

Good additional point. Weekend games are actually pretty tough. Weekdays FTW

Sunday, Friday, Saturday in that order if you must.

 

[Munchies11]

I can feel the revival football is back !!!

 

[bmacpoker]

Mine has been dying and I might have just killed it myself.

We have a core of like 5-6 players that almost do pick up games. The two main venues we use aren't consistent enough for a regularly timed game, but we used to play at least once a week.

Similar to you, my son is leaving for college and won't be available. He hasn't played as much for last year because he works and spends a lot of time with friends anyway. One of our core players has been up and down with her mood to play. She used to have a poker room, tore it down and said she wanted to sell everything, then changed her mind and plays more now.

We play a little too big now for most of our friends who would join. We still don't play huge, stacks rarely exceed $200, but I'm talking people who think budgeting more than $20 is a stretch. So we really have dwindled and often just play 4-5 people.

I used to get tilted a bit more and it was almost a part of my game. A few years ago I felt embarrassed about how I reacted to a situation, also realizing it wasn't enough money to be upset about, and I've been the calmest and most jovial since, even when I lose.

But two weeks ago, I got a bit fed up with how one if the husband and wife duos were approaching hands near the end of the night, and I think my reaction to a hand made things awkward. No one has asked to play since, when usually we talk about getting in hands almost daily. I would not be surprised if they are just done playing and my buddy is going to stick to casinos or other bigger home games. And if he's not in, effectively our 5 years running home games are done. I'm just sorta sad it was on life support to begin with, and my tilt pulled the plug.

 

[HiveKueen]

There is a Facebook group called Poker Players Looking for Local Games.

I have a website and I have a protocol for brining in new players to ensure they are a good fit ( ask for details). On the website you can see the names of the players (last initial only) - I think this helps people get over the hump of going someplace they don’t know.

I have Posted my game as an event on the calendar of the local city newspaper.

I don’t know what stakes you play for but if the buy in is more than $50 you could try lowering it to attract more people.

I strongly prefer tournaments to cash so the comment above about tourneys resonated .

For added security we have no cash in the house , strictly Venmo for exchanging cash. I think people appreciate this too.

Recently I had to ban a player- turns out he was really dampening the vibe and the regs are pretty happy.

Good luck rebuilding your game.

 

[Old State]

It’s about total invite numbers. If you want 8 you need 30 on the list.

We used to host 30-40 person tournaments 7-8 times a year back during the poker boom. Also cash games after and weekly. Lots of different factors though then. Most of us weren’t married with kids and in our late 20’s. Also, Cash poker was originally limit before around 2005. I hosted $2/4 or 3/6 limit then $1/2 200 max buyin after 2005 when the casinos first offered it

My regular cash game all but fizzled out from about 2008-2016..but then started again as people got a handle of adulting and wanted an excuse to get out of the house. I actually reduced the stakes to 25/50 $50 max then 50/1 $100 as many were cost conscious with kids and mortgages. In the past 3 years I jumped the stakes up to $1/1 $120 max buy in an it seems to be a good level to get a monthly game regularly.

The issue with tournaments is that most of the players that made every single tournament all complained they preferred cash! Cash is king in my opinion and also allows people to come and go as they please. The key is to not raise the stake too fast. I know I lost about 5 people from the player pool going from 25/50 to 1/1…but also probably gained a few newer people too.

I’m getting requests for $1/3 $300 max and even the occasional $2/5 but have resisted. These are from some of my old crew guys who play casino poker regularly. I plan to host those but will definitely make the group understand these are special games not to replace the regular one.

 

[ThrowBack]

My game died and I’m so bummed

 

[Poker Zombie]

One of the sad truisms of life is "the older you get, the fewer friends you have". When we are young and in school, you bond with many people struggling against a common cause, be it classes or shitty entry-level jobs. When we get older our bonding group shrinks to people in your career, or parents dealing with kids the same age as your own. Those people start to fragment (die or move away), and their replacements are younger than you now, and less likely to bond.

Always growing is a mantra, but it may not be enough. You need to keep youth in the game. This may require lower stakes, because they may not have the disposable income as a empty-nester. But what is more important, the stakes or the game?

 

[TheWhat]

Always tried to take heed to lessons from those before us, and this place, in addition to get samples, has always preached if it isn't growing, it's dying.

Hope you can resurrect it.

We are super happy with our game the past couple years. We have shifted from we'll play with 5 if we are itching, to we fill games in 5 minutes now, more times than not. Think some of the things that contributed to the shift, aside from the Table Topper - Chairs - Cards - Chips which people for sure enjoy:

Our own love of hosting, and the generosity that comes with. While it's standard practice that our players bring chips, or buns, or dogs. We also have dogs rolling always. And we also have drink(s) for those who need, run out, forget, or whatever. We also somewhat regularly seed Bomb Pots, or draw for people to get a bonus $20. When someone has a birthday around one of our games, we ask everyone to chip in $x to cover their 1st Buy In, and cover any shortage that may exist.

We switched from text messages, to a Facebook group page where our games get posted. Makes the managing easier on us, and puts the onus on those who want to attend. When it hits 8 marked as Going, it's full. After that mark yourself as Interested for effectively the cancellation list. If people are missing a chance to enter, they will message and we occasionally will expand to 9, or give them a heads up of when the next game is going to posted. It's easy to add people in, and remove when needed, and a way for people to follow along. We post winners, and pots, memes whatever; keeps people engaged in our game.

We added a High Hand, and Progressive Pot. So the initial Buy In is $50 + $5 ($2.50 to each). Qualifying High Hand (Boat) gets paid out nightly, if no qualifier it goes into the Progressive. The Progressive quickly builds to a decent amount, relative to our stakes, with $20 per session going in. People aren't missing the chance at a Buy In, and a couple times it has got to $100 - $150.

We also try to solicit feedback, whether it's music, special hands, ordering different food, we want our friends and acquaintances to be comfortable.

 

[bigblind]

Must always be recruiting

 

[grantcm05]

i agree with the sentiment of trying to host more tournaments. A lot of people want to play with a pre determined “loss” and cash can be overwhelming when stakes increase.

 

[bananapeel]

Big fight nights always a good time to host if that is your thing.

 

[foreverdev]

I find when I make even a minor adjustment to the game, like changing up the set I use, the base (t25/t100), the speed, it helps to make each game unique and generates FOMO. I’ll make a comedically lazy flyer for each game announcing the changes. Around this time of year I’ll ask everyone to dress up a bit and bring a nice bottle of wine and then it feels more like a special event and I get great attendance. Good luck

 

[joeyshin]

You can always attend other local homegames and just host on a different day and recruit players.. i find the players that want to play will play several times a week.

 

[MrCatPants]

You can always attend other local homegames and just host on a different day and recruit players.. i find the players that want to play will play several times a week.

Get the hosts permission before doing this. Raiding a game and cutting attendance is a very dick move.

 

[doublebooyah85]

Get the hosts permission before doing this. Raiding a game and cutting attendance is a very dick move.

Yeah has to be a fine line. I certainly do it, but I’m a great guest and I don’t rake while every other game I attend rakes, so fuck’em.

 

[doublebooyah85]

Also a few other tips,

Don’t allow button straddles, only hurts the game imho
Golfers are good for the game, they are looking something to do in the winter
Any type of sales person usually enjoys cards, especially car salesmen. Find 1 he will spread the word to co workers.
Weekdays are best
Planning weeks ahead won’t guarantee anymore success really, people won’t plan for poker games unless your including spouses
Low cost tourneys bring in players who may play cash in the future

 

[bananapeel]

Yeah has to be a fine line. I certainly do it, but I’m a great guest and I don’t rake while every other game I attend rakes, so fuck’em.

poaching from raked games - please be careful!

 

[bananapeel]

Also a few other tips,

Don’t allow button straddles, only hurts the game imho
Golfers are good for the game, they are looking something to do in the winter
Any type of sales person usually enjoys cards, especially car salesmen. Find 1 he will spread the word to co workers.
Weekdays are best
Planning weeks ahead won’t guarantee anymore success really, people won’t plan for poker games unless your including spouses
Low cost tourneys bring in players who may play cash in the future

Solid advice here, although these days I don't think there is much cross-over between tourney and proper cash degens. People who like to network for business are good (like anyone in sales as previously mentioned), and pick a stake where the straddle is the stakes most regulars will play. Pick a weekday and try to run consistently on that day/evening

 

[MrCatPants]

poaching from raked games - please be careful!

Can't emphasize this enough. Hurting the wrong raked game in this space is a risk.

 

[doublebooyah85]

Can't emphasize this enough. Hurting the wrong raked game in this space is a risk.

None of the raked games I’ve gone to have cared. And it’s been a dozen or so. I’ve made friends with players and it’s transpired it other things more than just poker. Sold them cars, broke bread, attended children’s grad parties and unfortunately funerals…

Everyone plays in each others games, and again, I’m a great guest and I don’t rake at my home. If I make friends it’s normal to interact with them elsewhere.

Anyway? What’s the risk? In all honesty. No one’s breaking legs over a $2-$5 poker game lol. I’m not saying run the same day the raked games run, but if your running a raked game imho you can piss off with any complaints lol

 

[MrCatPants]

None of the raked games I’ve gone to have cared. And it’s been a dozen or so. I’ve made friends with players and it’s transpired it other things more than just poker. Sold them cars, broke bread, attended children’s grad parties and unfortunately funerals…

Everyone plays in each others games, and again, I’m a great guest and I don’t rake at my home. If I make friends it’s normal to interact with them elsewhere.

Anyway? What’s the risk? In all honesty. No one’s breaking legs over a $2-$5 poker game lol. I’m not saying run the same day the raked games run, but if your running a raked game imho you can piss off with any complaints lol

If its just locals to pay for a dealer or snacks and drinks no biggie. But if its a for profit enterprise, at least in my local market, its a phyiscal risk.

 

[doublebooyah85]

If it’s just locals to pay for a dealer or snacks and drinks no biggie. But if it’s a for profit enterprise, at least in my local market, it’s a phyiscal risk.

That’s wild. We’re some friendly people here in Ohio. If I got any vibes at a raked game I’d get my ass beat for anything, I’m not going. We have some people in the red at poker games here that stopped showing up and never paid their debts, and they r still not getting threats or any physical harm.