Help me decide on 2 "training sets" / head's up sets (1 Viewer)

[GreekRedEye]

Okay. When I host a game, I offer a lesson for newbies if they come early. I don't like using my actual chipsets for training for 2 reasons: 1) I usually have it organized for gameplay and don't want to disorder them and 2) I don't want a stray training trip to make it to the actual game table. Additionally, I think it is good for the newbies to see different chip styles and it is an excuse for me to own more chips!

I am thinking of a rack of a training cash set (20 each of $0.25, $1, $5, $25, $100 and a couple $500s) and a training rack of tournament (20 each of T5, T25, T100, T1000, and 10 of T500 and T5000).

I have 2 rules the sets must abide by:

1. They must be standard Vegas casino colors (white $1, red $5, green $25, black $100). I don't want to confuse the newbies with CA colors or non-traditional colors.
2. They must not be easily confused for my play sets (micro-stakes is DDLM, low-stakes is Horseshoe Cleveland, and tournament is custom Tina design here).

I could take this a few ways:

• Go super cheap. This is for training purposes after all. Just get some china clays. I would do Milanos for the cash set (those have a special place in my heart).
• Go super nice. E.g. Rounders for the cash set. It is an "affordable" way to own nice chips that I can't justify spending the cash for a full set. Could also double as a "heads up" set. If I can find someone selling extras at a discount, even better.
• Go eclectic with a mixed set. Could do 1's from one casino and 5's from another. Or even mix within a denom (e.g. 20 different 1's from different casinos) but they would have to work together enough to not confuse newbies.

Help me decide.

 

[LowerBama1714]

Go super nice. FTW.

 

[allforcharity]

I think stock CPC would be great here.

 

[andrebttx]

Yeah, I also like the idea of doing Rounders / a stock CPC set for something like this. Just like you, those are sets I like, but a full one is just a little too much for me to justify spending. So this sounds like a great way to get to check off box for ownership without breaking the bank.

 

[SteveEH]

Yes a rounders set that uses the same denominations as the heads up scene with Mike and KGB. If you're training for cash games, just tell them to pretend the dollar sign is cents.

 

[GreekRedEye]

For the tourney training set I could go with the Atlantic hotstamps for a relative deal for 1 rack. Or keep the Rounders theme going with Chesterfields.

Key Wests (the other CPC stock set we sometimes forget about) is nice too. They are all cash denom though, right? No tourney option?

 

[Chris Flynn]

Rounders CPC set:

160 x 25
160 x 100
80 x 500

 

[BGinGA]

T5 heads-up set:
40 x T5
40 x T25
20 x T100
T1500 stacks (20/20/9) with 2 x T100 for T5 color-ups

T25 heads-up set:
40 x T25
40 x T100
10 x T500
10 x T000
T7500 stacks (20/20/5) with 10 x T1000 for T25/T100 color-ups

Either can serve as a tourney training set.

For a cash training set, I'd go with something that is similar to a standard cash set breakdown, only smaller -- and set it up for 3 players:

24 x 25c
48 x $1
24 x $5
4 x $25
$50 stacks (8/16/3/1) for 25c/50c stakes
$75 stacks (8/16/8/1) for 50c/$1 stakes

 

[GreekRedEye]

T5 heads-up set:
40 x T5
40 x T25
20 x T100
T1500 stacks (20/20/9) with 2 x T100 for T5 color-ups

T25 heads-up set:
40 x T25
40 x T100
10 x T500
10 x T000
T7500 stacks (20/20/5) with 10 x T1000 for T25/T100 color-ups

Thanks! This looks like a great breakdown for head's up. I am surprised by the volume of low-denom chips - 20 starting versus say 10 or 12. Is that because with only 2 players there just aren't enough chips on the felt otherwise? I have never played a head's up tournament, only single table of 8 minimum and multi tables.

Primary objective of these racks is to be able to show people completely new to poker what a starting stack looks like and then play a few practice hands. Secondarily, if I can get the balance of chips right to double for head's up play as well, that seems like money better (smarter) spent.

I would love to get be able to somehow get the range of T5 to T1000 in one rack (for teaching purposes) but still make it useful for head's up. Would this work for 200 BB starting? (could also do 150 BBs by reducing the highest chip in each stack)

T2k starting with 10/10/7/2 of T5/T25/T100/T500 with 6 T100s for color ups?
T10k starting with 12/12/3/7 of T25/T100/T500/T1000 with 12 T1000s for color ups?

If it does, I could have a rack of:
20 x T5
24 x T25
24 x T100
6 x T500
26 x T1000

I think math works (someone tell me if my arithmetic is wrong) but I don't know if it would make for good game play.

 

[improviseallday]

You could buy two more full sets for better resale value

 

[Budha]

Take a look at the “Key West” chips in the vender section. Super nice CPC chips, readily available, and reasonably priced.

 

[BGinGA]

This looks like a great breakdown for head's up. I am surprised by the volume of low-denom chips - 20 starting versus say 10 or 12. Is that because with only 2 players there just aren't enough chips on the felt otherwise? I have never played a head's up tournament

Virtually no change-making during play, and color-ups are super easy.

T2k starting with 10/10/7/2 of T5/T25/T100/T500 with 6 T100s for color ups?
T10k starting with 12/12/3/7 of T25/T100/T500/T1000 with 12 T1000s for color ups?

If it does, I could have a rack of:
20 x T5
24 x T25
24 x T100
6 x T500
26 x T1000

I think math works (someone tell me if my arithmetic is wrong) but I don't know if it would make for good game play.

20/20/20/4 checks out for T2000 heads-up.

But 12/12/3/7 for T10k stacks feels short on T500 chips for heads-up play (all chips, really), plus coloring up T25s with a T1000 will also pull scarce T100s from play (and coloring up the T100s will pull another T500 from play, when there are only six total to start with).

I think you are better off with 16/11/5/6 = T10k stacks, coloring up both the T25 and T100 chips together with three T1000s (you could also do this using the other set).

0/24/24/6/14+4(or 2) vs 0/32/22/10/12+3

That makes your joint T5 /T25 set:
20/32/22/10/15 = 99 chips

 

[GreekRedEye]

Virtually no change-making during play, and color-ups are super easy.


20/20/20/4 checks out for T2000 heads-up.

But 12/12/3/7 for T10k stacks feels short on T500 chips for heads-up play (all chips, really), plus coloring up T25s with a T1000 will also pull scarce T100s from play (and coloring up the T100s will pull another T500 from play, when there are only six total to start with).

I think you are better off with 16/11/5/6 = T10k stacks, coloring up both the T25 and T100 chips together with three T1000s (you could also do this using the other set).

0/24/24/6/14+4(or 2) vs 0/32/22/10/12+3

That makes your joint T5 /T25 set:
20/32/22/10/15 = 99 chips

Thanks! That is hyper efficient. It even gives me one slot for a T5000 chip just for show.

I recognize it is less than ideal, requires change making, will make color up tight, and of course no add-ons, but I like that it can do triple duty: a general show and tell lesson, a tourney with 5 as low chip, and a tourney with 25 as low chip. Makes me willing to spend a bit more money on it.

I imagine you are also helping others who want an excuse to buy another rack of chips could use a "trainer set."

I will have to write down the starting stacks on a notecard and store in the case with the chips.

 

[GreekRedEye]

You could buy two more full sets for better resale value

Get thee behind me!

Internal monologue over the course of today:

I can just teach folks using the chips we already plan to play with ->
maybe I won't mix...I will use some extra samples I have laying around ->
maybe I should buy a handful of chips just to make sure I have what I need ->
let's make it a full rack of cheap chips for completeness sake ->
well, if I make it a playable head's up rack I can make them nice chips ->
ah, just buy a full 1000 piece set of custom, inlaid CPCs to protect future resale value FULL STOP

I mean the chipping madness has to stop somewhere, doesn't it? DOESN'T IT?!

(someone please tell me it does)

 

[GreekRedEye]

Take a look at the “Key West” chips in the vender section. Super nice CPC chips, readily available, and reasonably priced.

Yes. I bought a sample set (@dennis63 was great to work with). I love them. They are a contender with the Rounders for the cash rack. Or maybe...with that handsome NCV chip and the snappy $20 chip, maybe Key West would make for a good "head's up limit set" (is that even a thing? I need to stop).

 

[improviseallday]

Get thee behind me!

Internal monologue over the course of today:

I can just teach folks using the chips we already plan to play with ->
maybe I won't mix...I will use some extra samples I have laying around ->
maybe I should buy a handful of chips just to make sure I have what I need ->
let's make it a full rack of cheap chips for completeness sake ->
well, if I make it a playable head's up rack I can make them nice chips ->
ah, just buy a full 1000 piece set of custom, inlaid CPCs to protect future resale value FULL STOP

I mean the chipping madness has to stop somewhere, doesn't it? DOESN'T IT?!

(someone please tell me it does)

I mean, new custom CPCs won't protect resale but used Rounders would

The cycle will repeat once you realize some of your beginners are clumsy, and you'll want a sturdier set for them in addition to your first new set...

 

[Budha]

Yes. I bought a sample set (@dennis63 was great to work with). I love them. They are a contender with the Rounders for the cash rack. Or maybe...with that handsome NCV chip and the snappy $20 chip, maybe Key West would make for a good "head's up limit set" (is that even a thing? I need to stop).

Can’t go wrong!!

 

[GreekRedEye]

All right. Thanks to @BGinGA , I have my breakdown for my tourney rack.

Working on the breakdown for a cash rack. I want 0.25, $1, $5, $25, and $100 represented. But, like the tourney set, want to be able to use it for head's up play. This should be easier to break down than a one-rack tourney set, right?

How does this look to folks? It does not allow for more than 250 BB ($500) per player when playing $1/$2, but I never roll that high. Are there enough $1's on the table with this set up?

Chipset
24 x 0.25
30 x $1
24 x $5
18 x $25
4 x $100

For 0.25/0.25 or 0.25/0.50 with $50 starting stack:
12 x 0.25
12 x $1
7 x $5
Use 10 x $5 and 18 x $25 for add-ons

For 0.50/$1 with $100 starting stack:
12 x 0.25
12 x $1
7 x $5
2 x $25
Use 10 x $5 and 16 x $25 for add-ons

For $1/$2, $200 starting stack:
15 x $1
12 x $5
5 x $25
Use 8 x $25 and 4 x $100 for add-ons

 

[BGinGA]

All right. Thanks to @BGinGA , I have my breakdown for my tourney rack.

Working on the breakdown for a cash rack. I want 0.25, $1, $5, $25, and $100 represented. But, like the tourney set, want to be able to use it for head's up play. This should be easier to break down than a one-rack tourney set, right?

How does this look to folks? It does not allow for more than 250 BB ($500) per player when playing $1/$2, but I never roll that high. Are there enough $1's on the table with this set up?

Chipset
24 x 0.25
30 x $1
24 x $5
18 x $25
4 x $100

For 0.25/0.25 or 0.25/0.50 with $50 starting stack:
12 x 0.25
12 x $1
7 x $5
Use 10 x $5 and 18 x $25 for add-ons

For 0.50/$1 with $100 starting stack:
12 x 0.25
12 x $1
7 x $5
2 x $25
Use 10 x $5 and 16 x $25 for add-ons

For $1/$2, $200 starting stack:
15 x $1
12 x $5
5 x $25
Use 8 x $25 and 4 x $100 for add-ons

You don't need 12 quarters for heads-up, nor do you need 15 $1s for heads-up 1/2.

I still think setting it up for 3 players is better (post #8); you can still always use it heads-up if desired.

 

[GreekRedEye]

Thanks. I missed that part of your post previously

 

[GreekRedEye]

Closing the loop on this. Here is what my "training" / "head's up" set looks like right now. To recap, the goal was to build a small case with NL, Tourney, and Limit sets made of 4 racks to train newbies before a game without having to risk handing out real chips.

This is also a nice project to pick up chips in small quantities that you want but can't justify buying a full set. As it is for training, you don't have to worry about security...so it's a great use of stock chips! I may eventually upgrade to Rounders for NL set, Chesterfield or Atlantic for Tourney, and Key West for Limit, but for now, I went with chips I already had.

Big thanks to @BGinGA for the help devising the breakdowns. Re posting them here to make it easier for others who might want to do something similar:

• NL Cash (Milanos in left-most rack)
  • 24 x 25c, 48 x $1, 24 x $5, 4 x $25
  • $50 stacks (8/16/3/1) for 25c/50c stakes for 3 people
  • $75 stacks (8/16/8/1) for 50c/$1 stakes for 3 people
• Limit Cash (A-molds in center 2 racks)
  • 200 x $5
  • 8 x $100
• Tourney joint T5 and T25 (Tina Greek Mold with @Colquhoun 's Pioneer design) - you can do joint T25 and T100 instead
  • 20 x T5, 32 x T25, 22 x T100, 10 x T500, 15 x T1000 = 99 chips
  • T5 starting stacks for 2 players: 10/10/7/2
  • T25 starting stacks for 2 players: 16/11/5/6

Note on the case: this is a vintage "Lowes" poker chip case. You can find these with 2, 3, and 4 racks frequently on eBay. I like it, but be warned: 1) it opened up on me once already and 2) it only fits 24 chips per row comfortably - I had to force 25 in there. I may add an additional clasp, as I otherwise like the compactness and ability to store decks, dealer buttons, and spare chips below.