Automatic card shuffler (2 Viewers)

[Poker Zombie]

For me, if it only does 1 deck at a time it's too slow to be worth the downside of having it in the way on the table, unless you have a non-playing, dedicated dealer.

That said, a dedicated non-playing dealer can probably collect and shuffle the cards faster than they could run it through a shuffle-tech anyway.

 

[alpine0000]

Some DeckMate 1 eye candy.

One of the things I like about having a DeckMate is that it counts the cards each time it shuffles, and lets you know if there are too few (or even too many).

I added the Joker in before this shuffle:

I've had a few card shufflers since I started playing poker 17 years ago, and all of them ended up being garbage and tossed aside, only to go back to hand shuffling. This DeckMate is definitely not in that category. It's the only shuffler that is worth having, IMO, regardless of price. The shuffletech is the only thing on the market to have been successful in competing at a lower price, but they are so hit or miss. There needs to be a shuffler on the market between the shuffletech $500 price point and the DeckMate $15,500 (new) price point. It really is an untapped market for mid-range shufflers. If somebody could make a reliable *good* shuffler for home games, with a casino quality, at an MSRP of about $2500, they would have a huge market.

 

[alpine0000]

I'll shoot and post a video of the shuffler if any of you care to see it.

 

[namsupak]

For me, if it only does 1 deck at a time it's too slow to be worth the downside of having it in the way on the table, unless you have a non-playing, dedicated dealer.

That said, a dedicated non-playing dealer can probably collect and shuffle the cards faster than they could run it through a shuffle-tech anyway.

I built two carts for the shufflers and we play with a dedicated dealer. The cart contains chips and the shuffler and the dealer uses two decks. We are playing a deck and then one is shuffling. It is definitely faster than the dealer shuffling as he is already dealing out a 2nd deck in our scenario. Additionally it helps with hand fatigue.

In our situation I would say that the shuffle tech is similar to a human dealer. We use the 3 riffle most of the time, but then occasionally we hit the 7 riffle. Additionally we may just hand shuffle a deck quickly in the case of a misdeal or if the blinds chop. And generally a few times a night we wash the cards too. Everyone seems pretty content with regards to the "randomness".

A few times people were unsure about the shuffler so we would present a sorted deck and hit the 7 riffle, they have been generally pleased with the result.

Sometimes people are upset with the shuffler and blame it for a bad beat but usually this is better than berating the dealer.

 

[upNdown]

If somebody could make a reliable *good* shuffler for home games, with a casino quality, at an MSRP of about $2500, they would have a huge market.

I think the reason that product doesn't exist is because there wouldn't be a huge market. Some of US would definitely appreciate it, but the majority of home game players won't even spend over $100 on decent chips; I don't think they're gonna spend 4 digits on a shuffler.

 

[alpine0000]

I think the reason that product doesn't exist is because there wouldn't be a huge market. Some of US would definitely appreciate it, but the majority of home game players won't even spend over $100 on decent chips; I don't think they're gonna spend 4 digits on a shuffler.

Yea, I think we are thinking of two different types of home games though. I'm talking about the more serious games with dedicated dealers and such (and some of them even being raked). I've been to a ton of them and all of them hand-shuffle. They have custom chips and tables and spend decent money on their set-ups. They just don't want to shell out money for a DeckMate.

Obviously though, I agree that the smaller home games that go once a month with just a few buddies and cheap chips would never spring for any sort of shuffler

Even though I think it's an untapped market, you may be right though, that those sort of games aren't plentiful enough for somebody to market a mid-tech shuffler in the $2500 range.

 

[namsupak]

If somebody could make a reliable *good* shuffler for home games, with a casino quality, at an MSRP of about $2500, they would have a huge market.

Even though I have had fairly good luck with shuffle tech I understand that once they break or I can no longer do little fixes to them then the shufflers are trashed because I haven't been able to get any response from customer service.

I agree though I would be willing to pay 2-3k for a reliable consumer grade machine. I don't know how huge the market would be since you are daily targeting some clubs or leagues, as well as some games that play high enough to support that investment. But there would be a niche in there I could see this working in, the problem is that some of the casino level companies like shuffle master can try and put a stop to your business. I believe something like that happened to the shuffle tech guy.

 

[David O]

On the marketing and investing side this market would be viewed as too small to get an acceptable ROI.

 

[alpine0000]

I have about 15 different set-ups (sets of cards), and I've run all of them through the shuffler 10x each to make sure that this thing likes all different brands of cards without any issues (since they're not all the exact same size... For example, Modiano's are about 1/16th of an inch wider than KEM's, and different brands radius their corners at different sizes). I tested KEM (Alpha, Arrow, and Circleback's that came from an actual casino), Modiano, and Copag. We use mostly KEM Circleback and Alpha's though, and occasionally something different (shown below).

So far, it's been flawless. Not a single jam or error. I've only tested bridge-sized cards. I may try to put a deck of poker-sized cards in here, but the manufacturer says this thing only does bridge-sized, so I wouldn't expect it to work (the DeckMate 2 can do both sizes, though).

 

[mashoo]

@alpine0000 I just wanted to say I appreciate all your posts on the deckmate. I'd love to have one in the future.

 

[alpine0000]

I hosted a game today for the first time with the DeckMate. We played from 2pm-345am and ran the deckmate nonstop. It was flawless. Not a single hiccup/error/jam. My dealer needed less breaks, stayed sharp longer, dealt faster late into the night than previously (usually they slow down a lot after 8 hours, which is understandable), and we got out more hands per hour. We also didnt have to count down the stub every so often. 100% reliable and speeds up the game. Worth every dollar paid. Forgot to take pics, but I try to remember next time.

 

[Poker Zombie]

I guess you have made a solid point. If you play 14 hour stints, and you still aren't getting in enough hands, you need a DeckMate.

If you are playing 4-5 hour games, and everybody is happy with the number of hands dealt, the DeckMate is a waste of time, money, and table space.

 

[namsupak]

I'd say that a shuffler helps with hand fatigue regardless. And I think a lot of people are somewhat comforted by a 3rd party shuffling the deck, plus they can just blame the machine for their bad beats. We tend to play 8-10 hour games.

 

[kk405]

I think the reason that product doesn't exist is because there wouldn't be a huge market. Some of US would definitely appreciate it, but the majority of home game players won't even spend over $100 on decent chips; I don't think they're gonna spend 4 digits on a shuffler.

I agree with this. We use a dedicated dealer in each game and players prefer it to a card shuffler that is likely to breakdown frequently.

 

[alpine0000]

If you are playing 4-5 hour games, and everybody is happy with the number of hands dealt, the DeckMate is a waste of time, money, and table space.

I'd be intrigued to hear your argument on how something that saves time is a waste of time. And with how it's a waste of table space when it's flushed into the table in a space that isn't being used for anything else.

Waste of money is debatable, though, and certainly not "fact".

I guess you have made a solid point. If you play 14 hour stints, and you still aren't getting in enough hands, you need a DeckMate.

:::eye roll:::

 

[WedgeRock]

I guess you have made a solid point. If you play 14 hour stints, and you still aren't getting in enough hands, you need a DeckMate.

If you are playing 4-5 hour games, and everybody is happy with the number of hands dealt, the DeckMate is a waste of time, money, and table space.

 

[Blaster]

There needs to be a shuffler on the market between the shuffletech $500 price point and the DeckMate $15,500 (new) price point. It really is an untapped market for mid-range shufflers. If somebody could make a reliable *good* shuffler for home games, with a casino quality, at an MSRP of about $2500, they would have a huge market.

Having a quality "consumer" version of a Deckmate would be great, But I think , price wise, it would have to be under $500 to appeal to enough people to be commercially viable ...
Keep in mind that, while not a $500 item, I wouldn't be surprised if the deckmate's price , as is now , is very "inflated" , since it doesn't have the discount price pressure & scale of Mfgr that it would have if carried on Amazon, Walmart, eBay & other retailers ( nor any competition) ..
I wonder how low $$ they can get it, with little change in performance ... For example, that green florescent Alphanumeric display part, & the associated driver electronics, could probably be replaced by a simpler system with a single led "idiot indicator" ( Illuminates Red if this, green if that, Slow blink if this, fast blink if that) ... The housing body, instead of painted or powder coated steel, could be substituted with a suitable injection molded plastic ... There's more than likely internal parts than can be made from different materials as well ......
I doubt the company would want to do this if they do not focus on the consumer now ...

 

[Jambine]

I'm gonna say.......... FACT !

 

[Poker Zombie]

I'd be intrigued to hear your argument on how something that saves time is a waste of time. And with how it's a waste of table space when it's flushed into the table in a space that isn't being used for anything else.

Waste of money is debatable, though, and certainly not "fact".



:::eye roll:::

I've played self-dealt games on a professionally built (BBO) poker table with a flush-mount shuffler. It was an awful addition to the table. The owner eventually pulled it out, patched the hole, and resurfaced the table, all at great expense.

That, is fact. Pics are somewhere on the forum of the shuffler as it was being removed. Also fact. The owner has 4 (maybe 5) other tables bought since getting the table with a shuffler, all without it because it was useless. That too, is factual.

But I really did intend to be supportive of your situation. You indicated that you played for just shy of 14 hours, and "...we got out more hands per hour. We also didnt have to count down the stub every so often. 100% reliable and speeds up the game. Worth every dollar paid." Three statements which seems to indicate you were not getting in enough hands in your typical 14 hour game.

For a casual 4-5 hour game, the biggest slowdown in most social games isn't how long it takes to shuffle. Most use 2 decks, and the shuffling is complete before another hand is dealt. Our slowdown is drinking and chatting when the action is on a tipsy/chatty player. In those cases, it would actually take longer to pass the deck to the player sitting at the DeckMate, have them exchange the decks and then pass them back to the dealer, rather than just dealing the deck that is already in your hands.

 

[Poker Zombie]

Fact: A 14 hour game will likely result in shuffling fatigue. Hell, even pitching cards for 14 hours would be tiresome, even without the shuffling.

I'm surprised that you wouldn't be aware of this.

 

[namsupak]

Okay well I think it has all been said, the shuffler is good for some situations and the investment is worth it for some people. For others, it is not.

 

[alpine0000]

I've played self-dealt games on a professionally built (BBO) poker table with a flush-mount shuffler. It was an awful addition to the table. The owner eventually pulled it out, patched the hole, and resurfaced the table, all at great expense.

OK? Who cares. Self-dealt, pass-the-deal games aren't sped up by a shuffler because somebody is able to shuffle the second deck during the current hand. I'm talking about my game with a dealer. If a shuffler didn't speed up games that have a dedicated dealer, casinos wouldn't spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on them for their room. And I never said I didn't get in enough hands, I said that we got in *more* hands... Regardless of whether you play 1 hour or 14 hours, isn't it nice to get in more hands per hour and have to wait less for a dealer shuffling by hand? I can't even believe I'm entertaining your argument. LOL.

Anyways, here are pics of the shuffler in the table, if anybody cares to take a look:

 

[mashoo]

Dumb question possibly, but did you ask your dealer where they would prefer the machine, to their left or right and the orientation? I understand the current layout if the dealer is left handed. Just curious.

 

[alpine0000]

Dumb question possibly, but did you ask your dealer where they would prefer the machine, to their left or right and the orientation? I understand the current layout if the dealer is left handed. Just curious.

No, as that is the only place it'll fit and be compatible with folding legs and a pedestal if I want to swap. Also, it's better for right hand, as you just press the green button with your left hand, and with your right hand place the deck into the back of the shuffler. May not be as clear without seeing it, but the dealers (I have 6 of them) all love it. With your left hand, it would be a hassle to reach over the elevated shuffled deck to put the unshuffled deck down in the hole behind it. With the right hand, that's not and issue.

 

[mashoo]

No, as that is the only place it'll fit and be compatible with folding legs and a pedestal if I want to swap. Also, it's better for right hand, as you just press the green button with your left hand, and with your right hand place the deck into the back of the shuffler. May not be as clear without seeing it, but the dealers (I have 6 of them) all love it. With your left hand, it would be a hassle to reach over the elevated shuffled deck to put the unshuffled deck down in the hole behind it. With the right hand, that's not and issue.

Right on. I'm imagining your explanation and makes sense. Plus who am I to say different when you've six dealers who love it haha. Very very cool to have a quality shuffler in the table. I also like the simplicity of it!

 

[alpine0000]

I'm imagining your explanation and makes sense.

Pictures may show it a bit better... Although the shuffler is right in front of your left arm, your wrist has to bend over the already-shuffled-deck awkwardly to put the next deck into the shuffler behind it. With the right hand, you naturally just reach around the already-shuffled-deck. IMO, this is natural and perfect to do with your right hand, while using the left fingers to press the green button.

 

[Poker Zombie]

What if the shuffler were rotated 90 degrees? Then you wouldn't have to reach over a deck or across your body.

 

[alpine0000]

What if the shuffler were rotated 90 degrees? Then you wouldn't have to reach over a deck or across your body.

That was my initial request, to have it right in front of the chip tray. But as I said earlier, the legs on the table get in the way of that

 

[Poker Zombie]

It is a great looking table, and If I had a dedicated dealer (and enough games/year to make it reasonable), I'd snap one of these up too.

Not for everyone though.

Now, pics of the table with the Bee Room chips!

 

[alpine0000]

Now, pics of the table with the Bee Room chips!

Here ya go. I'll try to remember to get pics on the next game night.