Accidentally showed cards (1 Viewer)

[valleychips]

Hey all,

I'll lay out something that happened at my home game. The game is fun and friendly with varying levels of experience (the upper end is quite knowledgeable and skilled, others are newish), and people are also actually trying to win, but no angles/dickish behavior. It's a great game.

Last weekend, two players were in a pot. On the flop, Player A checked, and Player B mistook it as a fold and showed their cards (A-T on an ace high flop, no real draws). We tried to cover up the cards, but Player A saw them. Anyway, Player B ended up checking the flop. The turn comes, a seemingly innocuous card, and Player A now bets big. Player B says "You saw my cards and you're still betting? You have me beat", and folds. Then Player A reveals a bluff, chuckling while collecting the pot.

Later, Player B told me that the behavior of Player A was a bit out of step with the spirit of the game (Player B wasn't pissed or anything, more curious about my opinion and a little annoyed). While we all agree that Player A did nothing wrong/nefarious to gain the info, Player B thought a checkdown would have been more in line with the game's camaraderie. After Player B left, the rest of discussed the hand. Overall, we felt that Player A made a clever play because of info gained, and bluffing is part of the game, and kind of a penalty for accidentally showing cards. While it's not fun to show your cards early and pay the price (and I've been there BTW), there's no remedy or even friendly requirement to check down. And actually, if that became the norm, then showing cards "accidentally" could become an angle.

Anyway, overall not a big deal and I think everyone will be fine moving forward. Player A did try to give Player B money back after the pot, but Player B declined. Later, Player B expressed being miffed to me.

I'm curious as to what you all think.

Thanks!

 

[Josh Kifer]

If he showed his cards but wants to continue play, that's fine, but the other individual gets to continue play also, which includes betting rounds.

It might be a dick move, but hey, were playing poker here. It's literally apart of the game.

This is how it would play out at my game, with maybe the winner tossing a rebate to the loser as a "sorry, not sorry".

 

[GamingWithChips]

I think Player B was a little annoyed at themselves and the whole situation, then directed that to Player A. Unless the check from Player A was really weird/angle-y (ie enough to be confused as a fold), Player B shouldn't be upset with them, a mistake happened and that's it.

This to me is like when you are dealt cards and your second card is an Ace that flips up, you're just annoyed in general.

 

[upNdown]

there's no remedy or even friendly requirement to check down. And actually, if that became the norm, then showing cards "accidentally" could become an angle.

You nailed it here. A player always has the option to bluff. You can't take that option away from him because his opponent screwed up.

 

[bmacpoker]

If he showed his cards but wants to continue play, that's fine, but the other individual gets to continue play also, which includes betting rounds.

It might be a dick move, but hey, were playing poker here. It's literally apart of the game.

This is how it would play out at my game, with maybe the winner tossing a rebate to the loser as a "sorry, not sorry".

I don't even think it's a dick move. It's not their fault they gained information.

I am curious how a check gets interpreted as a fold. If there was an angle at that point, then I understand being annoyed, but I'd be more than just miffed if someone pulled something. Otherwise I'm not sure how that happens unless you weren't paying attention and somehow any movement or verbal statement was taken as fold?

 

[valleychips]

I don't even think it's a dick move. It's not their fault they gained information.

I am curious how a check gets interpreted as a fold. If there was an angle at that point, then I understand being annoyed, but I'd be more than just miffed if someone pulled something. Otherwise I'm not sure how that happens unless you weren't paying attention and somehow any movement or verbal statement was taken as fold?

I frankly don't remember how it got interpreted that way either. I was handling something else. I only really started paying attention after the cards were accidentally exposed. That said, while the exact steps to get here might not be perfectly laid out, the interesting parts + intent and effect are accurate.

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

Complaining about betting after you mess up is a sign of a weak bloodline. Rough way to learn you've got bad genes though, reach out and make sure they're okay.

 

[chippitydoodah]

I think that even though you prefaced your story by saying nobody is a dick, we still wonder if he wasn't angling in the first place. Too bad we don't know the board, the winner's hole cards and the loser's other card.

 

[chippitydoodah]

Complaining about betting after you mess up is a sign of a weak bloodline. Rough way to learn you've got bad genes though, reach out and make sure they're okay.

Oh thats right, your great great great great granddaddy was Mel Gibson or something.

 

[UniLover]

A did nothing wrong.

B should STFU, it's not like someone else showed his cards. He did it himself. Pay attention to the game.

How big was the pot anyway?

 

[Josh Kifer]

I don't even think it's a dick move. It's not their fault they gained information.

I am curious how a check gets interpreted as a fold. If there was an angle at that point, then I understand being annoyed, but I'd be more than just miffed if someone pulled something. Otherwise I'm not sure how that happens unless you weren't paying attention and somehow any movement or verbal statement was taken as fold?

I'm not saying it is or it isnt. But let's say it's the biggest dick move in poker.

It's poker. Literally part of the game. That was my point.

 

[toothpic]

This happens once in a blue moon at our game too. We mostly know each other and are drinking during the game so it's a fun social thing. What happens next is pretty split between folding since they have top pair to feeling like it's your duty to bluff them out of the hand. Depending on who is bluffing or who is the one who exposed the cards, it can totally differently each time. LIke Josh said, it's poker and it's part of the game. Pay attention next time

We don't call it angling but the bragging rights when they do fold incorrectly is pretty hilarious.

 

[BPTDirector]

Player B has no gripe coming. Grow up, poker is for those wearing big boy pants.

 

[mdt11]

Player A was perfectly in line (as long as his checking motion or verbalizing wasn’t out of the ordinary, which you haven’t given any indication that it was). You can’t enforce a check down or chop at that point because as others have said then exposing your cards is itself an angle.

Player B was probably just pissed at the situation in general and was taking it out on A indirectly a little bit. It doesn’t seem like either player crossed an obvious line. I would just chalk it up to “that’s poker.”

- -

Similar situation at my game one time. Player A checked on a flushing turn. Player B checked back. Player A flips over his cards, two pair, not realizing there was one more street. (Player A was flustered but otherwise in good spirits. The table was smiling and laughing going to the river.)

River pairs the board and player A… leads out for 25! This got everyone laughing even more. Player B raised to 150, and A eventually folded. B was kind enough to show the flush.

It was a funny moment that we all still talk about. Photo evidence:

 

[MeridianFC]

I wish every time I screwed up in poker the other players would have to fold to me or check it down.

Player B got nothing to cry about.

 

[joeyshin]

I can’t find it now, but I saw a clip where one player exposed his cards and continue the hand face up, and the other player kept trying to bluff him. I’ll keep looking for the clip.

 

[Rakrul]

Just because you messed up doesn't mean you get a free pass to realize your equity. Just wait for the angle shooting if this becomes your new norm.

 

[Jimulacrum]

Player A did nothing wrong. Player B is whining about etiquette that only exists in a small number of old-timey home games.

If you've played a lot, I'm sure you've encountered the type of player who expects that any kind of irregularity will be resolved by players agreeing to just not bet and let the rest of the cards fall. "It's a gentlemen's game" and all that.

It's one of my biggest pet peeves because it turns the game into ripe pickings for angle shooters and cheats. Think about how shamelessly someone could take advantage of it being standard etiquette to check down when someone's cards have been exposed. "Oh, whoops!" and now he gets to draw to a flush for free.

Tell Player B to protect his hand. If he doesn't, it's no one else's problem.

 

[ScallyWagers]

In 20 years of playing - from penny candy pots to 7-figure tournaments, I've never see a scenario where A isn't maxing his value based on all the information he can gather. B should be mentored to see it as a learning opportunity and be more careful.