Rebuying for more than max: did I overstep as host? (1 Viewer)

[Schmendr1ck]

I host a cash game about once every 4-5 weeks which is .25/.50 NLHE with a $100 max buy-in. In the past, some of us have talked about allowing a half-the-big-stack rebuy, and one time I did allow it with consent from those at the table. However, I've hesitated to make it a regular thing; I'm concerned about scaring off some of the players with shallower pockets.

Friday night I had a huge (by my standards) cash game: two tables most of the night, and fourteen players over the course of the evening. I wasn't running well or playing my best. By the time we were down to one table and about 7-8 players, I was in the game for four max buy-ins. I was also having fun, definitely drinking too much but not shit-faced, and in a great mood in spite of my poker results so far.

After I dusted off the last of my fourth buy-in, I pulled $200 out of my pocket, said, "I'm buying in for half the big stack," (which was about right) and gave myself two stacks of red. Nobody complained or even looked unhappy about it, and definitely no one said anything to me that night or after, but since then I've been wondering if I took advantage of my position as host/banker. Was I out of line?

 

[davin]

I host a cash game about once every 4-5 weeks which is .25/.50 NLHE with a $100 max buy-in. In the past, some of us have talked about allowing a half-the-big-stack rebuy, and one time in the past I did allow it with consent from those at the table. However, I've hesitated to make it a regular thing; I'm concerned about scaring off some of the players with shallower pockets.

Friday night I had a huge (by my standards) cash game: two tables most of the night, and fourteen players over the course of the evening. I wasn't running well or playing my best. By the time we were down to one table and about 7-8 players, I was in the game for four max buy-ins. I was also having fun, definitely drinking too much but not shit-faced, and in a great mood in spite of my poker results so far.

After I dusted off the last of my fourth buy-in, I pulled $200 out of my pocket, said, "I'm buying in for half the big stack," (which was about right) and gave myself two stacks of red. Nobody complained or even looked unhappy about it, and definitely no one said anything to me that night or after, but since then I've been wondering if I took advantage of my position as host/banker. Was I out of line?

5 min penalty, In the box!!!! No you didn’t but remember if this happens to someone else that you allow them to do the same

 

[Schmendr1ck]

5 min penalty, In the box!!!! No you didn’t but remember if this happens to someone else that you allow them to do the same

No! Don't take me out, ref!

I've thought about this too, and I'm willing to consider a limited form of the big rebuy. Either after a certain time (when the more casual players have usually left) or maybe a once-per-night option.

 

[detroitdad]

I don't see a problem with it. Honestly, if it feels dirty, it probably is.

 

[krafticus]

Depends on the chips in use.

 

[Schmendr1ck]

I don't see a problem with it. Honestly, if it feels dirty, it probably is.

Obviously I didn't feel bad about it at the time. And if someone had objected I wouldn't have done it.

It wasn't until the next day that I wondered whether it was okay or not.

 

[Schmendr1ck]

Depends on the chips in use.

 

[Saoliver]

If I was playing in a game where someone was stuck 4 buy-ins and still having fun, I would love to see them go deeper with 2 more buy-ins.

 

[Schmendr1ck]

I'm going to get an angry face from @Sprouty every time I post a picture of my Jack $5 GOs.

 

[Schmendr1ck]

If I was playing in a game where someone was drunk, stuck 4 buy-ins and still having fun, I would love to see them go deeper with 2 more buy-ins.

FTFY. Also for the record, I ran that $200 up to $530 and got myself almost unstuck for the night.

 

[honkydevil]

I've thought about this too, and I'm willing to consider a limited form of the big rebuy. Either after a certain time (when the more casual players have usually left) or maybe a once-per-night option.

Don’t you need to have a hard policy to be fair? Who determines who’s a casual needing protection and who’s not? Once per night to me seems odd, if I burn $100 then rebuy for $150 or so and proceed to burn that, I would hope I could buy in for more than $100 the 3rd time. I think you have to pick either max buy in or half the big stack always.

 

[Rhodeman77]

Just make it a rule that anyone can use. It realistically won’t be able to be used until late in the night anyways after there are a lot of buy-ins on the table already.

If a player is stuck (and not wasted drunk) let them buy in whatever they want.

Home games play much bigger the later they go, especially since all the money is staying on the table. I would guess the opening bets get bigger and more straddles start to happen so only having $100 makes a player feel very short stacked at that point.

 

[PlaidDragon]

I was also having fun, definitely drinking too much but not shit-faced, and in a great mood

If the above isn't true you're doing it wrong.

I personally would have no problem with it if I had been there; however, what you just did is set a precedent for others to potentially want to do the same thing in the future. Still... you're the host and if anyone is going to call an exception to a rule it's you. If none of your patrons had an issue, I wouldn't worry about it.

 

[Schmendr1ck]

Don’t you need to have a hard policy to be fair? Who determines who’s a casual needing protection and who’s not? Once per night to me seems odd, if I burn $100 then rebuy for $150 or so and proceed to burn that, I would hope I could buy in for more than $100 the 3rd time. I think you have to pick either max buy in or half the big stack always.

It would be a hard policy, e.g. "Max buy-in after 11:00pm is half the big stack."

I guess I wasn't clear, but the idea in my head was to give the more casual players a clear rule so they could decide if they wanted to keep playing once the big buy-ins became legal.

 

[honkydevil]

It would be a hard policy, e.g. "Max buy-in after 11:00pm is half the big stack."

That would be fair and consistent. I would do that and see how it goes from there.

 

[BGinGA]

Honestly, if it feels dirty, it probably is.

^ This. I think that the question was even posed sorta defines how you feel about it in retrospect. If you have a re-buy rule in effect, it should be honored.... even by the host.

Might have been different had you asked the crowd first, but not really. People have a tendency to not say 'no' to the host, so it's a bit unfair for you to even ask..... imo.

 

[Saoliver]

FTFY. Also for the record, I ran that $200 up to $530 and got myself almost unstuck for the night.

There is a difference between obnoxious drunk and fun drunk. I wouldn’t be upset if you ran it up after 6 buy-ins unless I thought that I had been hustled. I assume it is all regulars at your game.

 

[MatB]

half the big stack seems pretty common, so even if its not a general rule at your games, the other players probably have played at games where that was in play so not a big deal.

In fact, more than a few were probably watching you dust off the other buy-ins and would gladly have let you buy in for $400. Assuming you would dust that off too!

 

[Changster]

I wish we had this rule in effect when I lost 1500 bb’s once. DOH

(As in I wish we had a cap)

 

[DoubleEagle]

Was I out of line?

If you have to ask then it probably was.

 

[APatHand]

Do you want to play big or do you want to play small? You can't do both.

 

[APatHand]

I should add that when I've encountered the capped rebuy rule the game often turns into a shove fest since many players are now effectively (or relatively) short stacked. In fact, because of the rule they are relatively short stacked.

Talk to your players, either jointly or individually, and see what they want, then comprise.

 

[Payback]

I used to do a hard cap and later switched it to a half the big stack because as games got late into the night stacks got deeper and $100 didn't go very far sometimes. Even then most didn't go for half, but rather something like 200 or 300.

As a player if the host did this and I had asked before about it and got told I'd be a little upset. However, if this had never come up before and I was sitting at less than 200 when you did that I'd be reaching for money to get myself to 200 as well.

I'd just set a new rule, like half the big after midnight or something and go from there.

Edit: I'm not surprised no one objected either. If actually be more surprised if someone did.

 

[moose]

Personally if I'm new to a game that has one set of rules and then the host changes the rules to suit himself, I would be like WTF, I'm not coming back to this place. I wouldn't trust any ruling from the host to go my way after that.

 

[APatHand]

Personally if I'm new to a game that has one set of rules and then the host changes the rules to suit himself, I would be like WTF, I'm not coming back to this place. I wouldn't trust any ruling from the host to go my way after that.

I didn't mention the super-secret 11pm rule change? Funny. I must have been drunk.

 

[JustinInMN]

and one time I did allow it with consent from those at the table. However, I've hesitated to make it a regular thing; I'm concerned about scaring off some of the players with shallower pockets.

Yeah, you really probably should have asked if anyone objected, just like you did on behalf of the other player.

Now you really can't go back on this and say no to anyone going forward.

I do like the idea of waiting a few hours before raising the cap to half the big stack, but I think if you try to implement it now it looks like you are trying to further carve out an exception for yourself while still trying to restrict this. So I think you need to keep this in your back pocket for the next couple of games and bring it up only if your players raise a concern.

Depends on the chips in use.

View attachment 282295

Oh in this case you 100% did the right thing .

 

[Schmendr1ck]

Personally if I'm new to a game that has one set of rules and then the host changes the rules to suit himself, I would be like WTF, I'm not coming back to this place. I wouldn't trust any ruling from the host to go my way after that.

I feel 100% the same way, which is probably the reason I felt bad about this the next day. All the players at the table were regs, and nobody complained, and alcohol was involved, so I'm not going to beat myself up about it too badly.

That said, going forward I plan to have a clear rule on when half-the-big-stack rebuys are allowed, and I plan to enforce it.

I appreciate all the feedback from everyone.

 

[moose]

I feel 100% the same way, which is probably the reason I felt bad about this the next day. All the players at the table were regs, and nobody complained, and alcohol was involved, so I'm not going to beat myself up about it too badly.

That said, going forward I plan to have a clear rule on when half-the-big-stack rebuys are allowed, and I plan to enforce it.

I appreciate all the feedback from everyone.

I wouldn't complain about it either, it's not my game. I just wouldn't go back.

 

[Jimulacrum]

Personally if I'm new to a game that has one set of rules and then the host changes the rules to suit himself, I would be like WTF, I'm not coming back to this place. I wouldn't trust any ruling from the host to go my way after that.

It's a little different in this case because I know you, but yeah, this.

Buy-in limits are part of the key established rules that everyone implicitly agrees to by virtue of their attendance. If you want to change any of those rules mid-game, IMO, you need a unanimous vote. And "Does anyone object?" as the host is already reaching into the bank … that is not a fair way to take a vote. As mentioned above, people don't want to say no to the host.

"Let's take a vote: Rebuys to half the big stack (or $200 or whatever), or keep the $100 cap?" Ideally in a situation where it's not obvious you just want to do it for yourself. If even one person says no, then sorry, no go. You get a rules override switch as host, of course, but it's best to reserve it for times when the fairness of the game is in jeopardy, not just to grant your own wishes.

You can unilaterally make this a new rule for future games, as long as it's very clear in the invite that it's the rule. Then players can take it into consideration before attending. Notice that this is what makes your $200 rebuy unfair: however small an issue, it's not what they expected to be walking into, and they didn't really agree to it.

 

[APatHand]

I've always felt that capped rebuys, and buyins after the first couple hours, protects the big stacks more than anyone else.