Chip Pricing (2 Viewers)

David O

David O

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Just out of curiosity....

What constitutes a "high" price for chips or price gouging/flipping? I have seen some sales for chips where people go on the offensive about the pricing but when others do it it is okay!

You see someone flip and people pull out the pitch forks. Others buy at a low price and sell at a low price and are given kudos. Then you see some that buy at a low price and then extract a huge margin. I get that people can sell for what they want but what constitutes a "flipper" or "Oh he is a good ole boy just selling them for the going market".

I do not sell very often but I am just trying to figure this stuff out. I for one can afford to buy and sell so I am not trying to make money when I sell. Now if I start selling some of my chips, am I a fool to sell them for what I paid for them or should I extract full value out of them?

The reason I ask is because I have seen many that have chastised members for flipping and after several months when the air has cleared they are the same ones selling chips at huge prices!

Just a personal observation and I am not representing any views expressed by PCF, its admins or moderators. I am speaking as a sole individual who enjoys collecting chips!

Also, if we can keep this thread civil it wold be great! We are all adults and should be able to discuss this with tact!

Thanks,
David O
 
Some would say buying chips exclusively with the intention of selling for a profit is flipping. In this scenario, I am a huge flipper as I have had many online finds that I've sold for big profit (even if at below market pricing).

My personal view on flipping is specifically taking advantage of the kindness/generosity of other PCF members and using it to generate a big profit for yourself.

In the end, I try not to think of things in terms of flipping/not-flipping. Chips will exchange hands at market prices. Some people will be overly generous while others will maximize profit.

You're a good dude, David. Just sell your damn chips for as much as people will pay (that will still allow you to sleep at night) and buy yourself something nice.
 
If you buy chips solely for the purchase of reselling at profit that is flipping.

If you buy chips, put them in play or later decide to go a different direction etc then go ahead and sell them for market prices. Some let them back into the community at cost but that is up to the seller.

Taking chips that were sold to you below market from another member and later selling them at a markup is also not cool. IMHO they should be offered back to the original owner first and they give the go ahead to sell at market, that is now cool.
 
What does a person do when they buy chips for a low-ish price, and then the market goes way up on those chips? Does one sell for the purchase price and watch someone else turn around and sell them further for market? Here's some approximate numbers on my ES cash set:

$0.25 x 100 ($300)
$1 x 200 ($600)
$5 x 200 ($600)
$20 x 60 ($600, $480 for the chips and $120 for inlay replacement)
$100 x 20 ($140, $100 for the chips and $40 for inlay replacement)

I'm into that set for around $2250

Here's some approximate prices I've seen on the chips in recent weeks:

$0.25 x 100 ($800)
$1 x 200 ($800)
$5 x 200 ($800)
$20 x 60 ($600) gonna leave this price the same, mine are unique
$100 x 20 ($140) gonna leave this price the same, mine are unique

That would be around $3150 if all chips sold by the rack for peak or close to peak prices

I have that set advertised for $2550 right now. The question is, am I a flipper? I'm not trying to come across as inflammatory either, so please don't read that into this reply. I'm being open and honestly want to know how I'm perceived with an ad like this. I've turned down multiple offers for less than I'm into the set for, keeping in mind I got these for an outstanding price to begin with.

All that said, I think a lot of times what separates the "flippers" from the "good ole boys selling for market" is purely reputation/standing in the community.
 
moose said:
If you buy chips solely for the purchase of reselling at profit that is flipping.

If you buy chips, put them in play or later decide to go a different direction etc then go ahead and sell them for market prices. Some let them back into the community at cost but that is up to the seller.

Taking chips that were sold to you below market from another member and later selling them at a markup is also not cool. IMHO they should be offered back to the original owner first and they give the go ahead to sell at market, that is now cool.
Click to expand...
I agree with this but what about chips not purchased from another member at low prices and then selling them for a decent profit?
 
hdgeno said:
What does a person do when they buy chips for a low-ish price, and then the market goes way up on those chips? Does one sell for the purchase price and watch someone else turn around and sell them further for market? Here's some approximate numbers on my ES cash set:

$0.25 x 100 ($300)
$1 x 200 ($600)
$5 x 200 ($600)
$20 x 60 ($600, $480 for the chips and $120 for inlay replacement)
$100 x 20 ($140, $100 for the chips and $40 for inlay replacement)

I'm into that set for around $2250

Here's some approximate prices I've seen on the chips in recent weeks:

$0.25 x 100 ($800)
$1 x 200 ($800)
$5 x 200 ($800)
$20 x 60 ($600) gonna leave this price the same, mine are unique
$100 x 20 ($140) gonna leave this price the same, mine are unique

That would be around $3150 if all chips sold by the rack for peak or close to peak prices

I have that set advertised for $2550 right now. The question is, am I a flipper? I'm not trying to come across as inflammatory either, so please don't read that into this reply. I'm being open and honestly want to know how I'm perceived with an ad like this. I've turned down multiple offers for less than I'm into the set for, keeping in mind I got these for an outstanding price to begin with.

All that said, I think a lot of times what separates the "flippers" from the "good ole boys selling for market" is purely reputation/standing in the community.
Click to expand...
Great post. I personally think you should ask for more. I think my OP was to point out that many make judgement on folks by reputation but then again some reputations are messed up because someone is not in the "in" group calls them out.
 
David O said:
Great post. I personally think you should ask for more. I think my OP was to point out that many make judgement on folks by reputation but then again some reputations are messed up because someone is not in the "in" group calls them out.
Click to expand...

I can't ask for more, they're not selling at the listed price;)
 
A price is too high when there is no one willing to pay that price today. It might not be the same way tomorrow.

In general, high prices help insure the people who want the chips the most will be the ones who get them. I appreciate that keeping prices "in reach" of many members is also a good thing. But I have to observe having prices so low that demand >> supply seems to lead to hard feelings.

There are a couple of times I get cranky about prices:

First is when someone offers a great deal to some member(s) and then the beneficiary of the generosity flips the chips in short order. Waiting months and then selling is not the same problem as flipping in a week or two.

Second is when I publicly step aside from a good deal and let someone else get the chips only to have them turn around and offer to sell the same chips back to me at a higher price. No kidding - I have had two deals I publicly passed upon offered back to me in a week or less for significant mark-ups. One of the times was even worse - the buyer had cherry picked the chips and then offered me the remainder for more than the whole set sold for that week.

DrStrange
 
MegaTon44 said:
Some would say buying chips exclusively with the intention of selling for a profit is flipping. In this scenario, I am a huge flipper as I have had many online finds that I've sold for big profit (even if at below market pricing).

My personal view on flipping is specifically taking advantage of the kindness/generosity of other PCF members and using it to generate a big profit for yourself.

In the end, I try not to think of things in terms of flipping/not-flipping. Chips will exchange hands at market prices. Some people will be overly generous while others will maximize profit.

You're a good dude, David. Just sell your damn chips for as much as people will pay (that will still allow you to sleep at night) and buy yourself something nice.
Click to expand...
Thanks Dan! Not in the selling mode. I am in the buying mode. Looking at actually buying another house and possibly a weekend car. Thank God I do not have to sell chips! Not sure what I would do if that was the case!
 
I view "flippers" - the villainous type of flipper - as those that buy and sell chips for a profit, with no intent to use said chips, and without doing a service to the community.

Megaton may make a profit, but he scours Craigslist, Letgo, et al... and in doing so finds chips that others would miss. He deals with unknown variables, like people that think a cardboard box is all the padding needed for shipping. He takes the risk for the community - that is a community service, and deserves a mark-up.

Jim (Chiproom) is the same. He hunts down casinos, and buys up chips that may otherwise find their way to the landfill. Service to us, profit for Jim.

The ones that get slammed are those that buy up chips - because they are faster with the fingers, or have better connection speeds, or simply won a no-risk lottery. They're profiting, not doing anything for the community, and never appeared to have any use (other than profit) for the chips.
 
David O said:
How much you wanna pay?
Click to expand...

Live chips.....face value obvious :);)

Great OP
I like to pay it forward when I offer direct deal to chippers i like.
Sometimes it's hard to find the right aswer...glas half empty / half full.

Same with auctions & raffles

Auctions CAN be a way to maximize profits (looking at you @bluegill ;) ) but also a great way to determin market prices.
Raffles in the old days were a great way to sell a set that has plenty of buyers or to make very expensive set affordable.
Only after what happend with the star raffles (pure money printing imho) that raffles left a bad taste and got banned.

I paid $300 for a rack of live $1 chips with a BIG smile while for some chips I would feel robbed if they would even been upcharged only 5%.
It's a strange thing the chipmarket....

Just one more thing...the relations I was able to build with numerous members got the most incredible chips for awsome prices (yeah, looking at you @liftapint...but there are more). This only works in 2 ways...so before I sell public, I'll make SURE I can't return the favour to some of the great sellers/members on this forum.

The only thing I really despise where the Silks way of working...and all those that played faul play during previous @TheChipRoom sales
 
Last edited:
Poker Zombie said:
I view "flippers" - the villainous type of flipper - as those that buy and sell chips for a profit, with no intent to use said chips, and without doing a service to the community.

Megaton may make a profit, but he scours Craigslist, Letgo, et al... and in doing so finds chips that others would miss. He deals with unknown variables, like people that think a cardboard box is all the padding needed for shipping. He takes the risk for the community - that is a community service, and deserves a mark-up.

Jim (Chiproom) is the same. He hunts down casinos, and buys up chips that may otherwise find their way to the landfill. Service to us, profit for Jim.

The ones that get slammed are those that buy up chips - because they are faster with the fingers, or have better connection speeds, or simply won a no-risk lottery. They're profiting, not doing anything for the community, and never appeared to have any use (other than profit) for the chips.
Click to expand...

To echo this, I don't mind paying a premium, within reason, to sellers who took the time and effort to build coveted cash sets, tourney sets, racks or even barrels of chips that would take a long time for me to scour the market and build myself. Some folks would rather just have a readily available and playable set.
 
David O said:
What constitutes a "high" price for chips or price gouging/flipping? I have seen some sales for chips where people go on the offensive about the pricing but when others do it it is okay!

You see someone flip and people pull out the pitch forks. Others buy at a low price and sell at a low price and are given kudos. Then you see some that buy at a low price and then extract a huge margin. I get that people can sell for what they want but what constitutes a "flipper" or "Oh he is a good ole boy just selling them for the going market".
Click to expand...
David O said:
I agree with this but what about chips not purchased from another member at low prices and then selling them for a decent profit?
Click to expand...

I know I've seen a lot of people call others out as flippers over the last 6+ years and many times it's the pot calling the kettle black. I've sold chips at a profit. I've also sold chips at cost, I've sold chips at a loss, I've run contests and given chips away for free to members as well. I've even put my own chips and items up for charity auctions to help members out recently.

I feel like you are referring to is a recent event... Good on them for taking a risk and getting rewarded. This isn't a socialist economy yet so they are free to make a profit and do what they want with their property. What makes them selling their chips at 10 to 20 times what they paid different then when someone bought chips and a few months or even years down the road decides to unload them and sells them for a profit but is then labeled a flipper (rhetorical question)? There is no difference imo. They both owned something and sold it for a profit. It just depends on who it is and whether or not they are in the "in" group. If people like the seller they can do no wrong, but if they don't like them they are flippers.

If a person doesn't like the person or the price they have the option of not buying them. There are people I don't like and I avoid their listings and mind my own business.
 
Mr. Cheese said:
I know I've seen a lot of people call others out as flippers over the last 6+ years and many times it's the pot calling the kettle black. I've sold chips at a profit. I've also sold chips at cost, I've sold chips at a loss, I've run contests and given chips away for free to members as well. I've even put my own chips and items up for charity auctions to help members out recently.

I feel like you are referring to is a recent event... Good on them for taking a risk and getting rewarded. This isn't a socialist economy yet so they are free to make a profit and do what they want with their property. What makes them selling their chips at 10 to 20 times what they paid different then when someone bought chips and a few months or even years down the road decides to unload them and sells them for a profit but is then labeled a flipper (rhetorical question)? There is no difference imo. They both owned something and sold it for a profit. It just depends on who it is and whether or not they are in the "in" group. If people like the seller they can do no wrong, but if they don't like them they are flippers.

If a person doesn't like the person or the price they have the option of not buying them. There are people I don't like and I avoid their listings and mind my own business.
Click to expand...

Flipping is subjective....but some shameless shit happend with the boat chips (and this made people angry/sad on both sides).
I see the same with the 2 Big Top sets that were sold....
If you already hit it out of the park with being lucky to acquire these awsome chips, why would you buy a few 1000 extra chips to sell them a huge profits to a community that you are a part of ?
 
Thomacetti said:
Flipping is subjective....but some shameless shit happend with the boat chips (and this made people angry/sad on both sides).
I see the same with the 2 Big Top sets that were sold....
If you already hit it out of the park with being lucky to acquire these awsome chips, why would you buy a few 1000 extra chips to sell them a huge profits to a community that you are a part of ?
Click to expand...
I understood why limited numbers were purchased with the boat chips. There was a significant perceived risk with out of the country entities. With the BTP chips, there was apparently no risk - it was all done above board, through local channels. However, a number of the BTP buyers quit PCF because there was a profit made, and/or not enough chips for everybody.

The big difference between the two: The whiny-babies were part of the BTP buy.
 
Thomacetti said:
Flipping is subjective....but some shameless shit happend with the boat chips (and this made people angry/sad on both sides).
I see the same with the 2 Big Top sets that were sold....
If you already hit it out of the park with being lucky to acquire these awsome chips, why would you buy a few 1000 extra chips to sell them a huge profits to a community that you are a part of ?
Click to expand...
I dont understand this one. Buy as many as Paulson will let you. More chips in the community is better

And for things where demand far exceed supply, auctions feel fair. Something this rare going to go for a lot. What do you expect them to do?

I mean I get the jealousy bc it’s like they hit the lottery twice, but hard to get mad. Without them, the chips wouldn’t exist in the wild. Value was added
 
Frogzilla said:
I dont understand this one. Buy as many as Paulson will let you. More chips in the community is better

And for things where demand far exceed supply, auctions feel fair. Something this rare going to go for a lot. What do you expect them to do?

I mean I get the jealousy bc it’s like they hit the lottery twice, but hard to get mad. Without them, the chips wouldn’t exist in the wild. Value was added
Click to expand...

You are mixing stuff...
I agree that more chips is better but would it hurt to create a contest where you sell the excess at cost or minimal upcharge ?
This community can be soooooo supportive & generous when a member is in troubles or just because it's your birthday (yeah..looking at you @PAZ).
Still, not ONE set of all recent Paulson buys was sold for cost (in public sale) but the members that made 5-10K on their boat sales can not be counted with one hand
 
Poker Zombie said:
I understood why limited numbers were purchased with the boat chips. There was a significant perceived risk with out of the country entities. With the BTP chips, there was apparently no risk - it was all done above board, through local channels. However, a number of the BTP buyers quit PCF because there was a profit made, and/or not enough chips for everybody.

The big difference between the two: The whiny-babies were part of the BTP buy.
Click to expand...

I don't think anyone in the BTP buy quit because of any profit that was made on the boat chips. Most of the people who no longer post here (whether voluntary or otherwise) were much more upset at the inconsistent and overzealous moderation that was happening at the time (and still does, albeit to a lesser extent). But yes, you're right. The BTP buyers are all "whiny babies" and the boat chip buyers are all paragons of virtue.
 
Chippy McChiperson said:
Most of the people who no longer post here (whether voluntary or otherwise) were much more upset at the inconsistent and overzealous moderation that was happening at the time (and still does, albeit to a lesser extent).
Click to expand...

But these members had no issues what so ever with using a hidden sub forum restricted for those with a golden ticket...
Life is great if you are on the good side....and sucks when your not (anymore)
 
Poker Zombie said:
I understood why limited numbers were purchased with the boat chips. There was a significant perceived risk with out of the country entities. With the BTP chips, there was apparently no risk - it was all done above board, through local channels. However, a number of the BTP buyers quit PCF because there was a profit made, and/or not enough chips for everybody.

The big difference between the two: The whiny-babies were part of the BTP buy.
Click to expand...

If you want to compare the star buy to the BTP buy, one big difference was that the Organizer of the BTP buy is banned from pcf, so the concept of a group buy was a little different.
 
David O said:
Just out of curiosity....

What constitutes a "high" price for chips or price gouging/flipping? I have seen some sales for chips where people go on the offensive about the pricing but when others do it it is okay!

You see someone flip and people pull out the pitch forks. Others buy at a low price and sell at a low price and are given kudos. Then you see some that buy at a low price and then extract a huge margin. I get that people can sell for what they want but what constitutes a "flipper" or "Oh he is a good ole boy just selling them for the going market".

I do not sell very often but I am just trying to figure this stuff out. I for one can afford to buy and sell so I am not trying to make money when I sell. Now if I start selling some of my chips, am I a fool to sell them for what I paid for them or should I extract full value out of them?

The reason I ask is because I have seen many that have chastised members for flipping and after several months when the air has cleared they are the same ones selling chips at huge prices!

Just a personal observation and I am not representing any views expressed by PCF, its admins or moderators. I am speaking as a sole individual who enjoys collecting chips!

Also, if we can keep this thread civil it wold be great! We are all adults and should be able to discuss this with tact!

Thanks,
David O
Click to expand...
I may not be the best person to answer this because I will generally pay asking price for chips I really really want, and I am appreciative to get the opportunity to buy the chips. Especially with how fast good chips get snatched up these days.

Honestly....IMHO...the market is what it is. I would never expect somebody who stumbled upon a great deal to pass that savings on to me simply because we are acquaintances or friends. I personally view that as me benefitting at the detriment of a friend.

When I'm unsure about a fair price, I let the market decide via an auction.
 
I recall @Jason sold all his extra Star chips, and got flamed for it... despite his selling price being WELL under $3/chip,

He actually approached me and said he felt bad that people were upset that these weren’t available to the masses, and he thought he’d let some go into the wild (the ones he didn’t absolutely need)..

I can tell you he wasn’t doing this for the money.. and was genuinely trying to be a nice guy and pay it forward to the community (whom were clammoring for these chips to be released at reasonable prices), so he listed an auction with a starting price at his cost. When they sold (for half of what they’re going for now), he got excoriated and ridiculed on the donkey site..

So despite Jason selling some star chips (for a profit), I don’t consider him a flipper.

@DrStrange ive had that same thing happen to me (and Jason).. crazy. Someone selling so many chips, they forgot who they’d talked into backing off some chips (to complete a prized set) only to have them offer those same chips back at an inflated price a few weeks later....
 
Let the buyers that want to pay $10 a chip do it. Eventually this bubble is going to burst and some of us will feel pretty silly :)

I have sold chips for a profit, break even, and a loss.

As long as there is demand and limited supply, the prices will be high. This is basic economics. I don’t get upset when I see people selling Paulsons for $3-$8 a chip. I DO wish I was in some of the epic heists, only because I want those chips for MYSELF, not for sale.

But eventually, we all get bored of everything, even unicorns.

I just try to remember karma. If I give someone a good deal, maybe I will get one in the future for myself.

But we shouldn’t be mad about prices. There are always good chips out there for good prices.

The ONE exception to this rule would be price fixing. If two or more people advertise competitive high prices to create artificial inflation. This would be a very negative thing. I don’t know that anyone is doing that, I am just saying. Evil is evil :p
 
All my personal opinion but I think it’s a mix of effort, time past, and profit %. Sure intention is probably the biggest but near impossible to prove indefinitely.

Lower the effort to get the chips, shorter the time the owner has had the chips, and higher the profit the owner is recognizing, the worse it is. Less so if the chips were bought outside our chipping community (eBay, fb marketplace, OfferUp etc) as more free market less “community”.

Grinding out at a pai gow table for quarters and flipping right away for a big profit (hard to measure profit I know but for arguements sale) not a flipper. Buying Paulson fantasy chips in 2005, selling them once 2018 for 300% markup not a flipper (even if never played with). Chips purchased on eBay for say $100, sold the next day at market for $130, could be considered flipping but I don’t see it as a bad flipping as it’s bringing chips into our community. Same scenario except sold for $300 (300% markup) on here or bought on here instead of eBay, or I’d say anytime it’s a say... +600% markup I’d say it’s verified flipping. Plenty of other mixed scenarios but you get the point.
 

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