Key West Resort & Casino Discussion Thread (2 Viewers)

[dennis63]

A fun future project for 2024 at the Key West: Adding slot hardware to our touchscreen slot machine (photos below)

I've been running the amazing AllJ Slot software on a laptop connected to a big touchscreen monitor for some time. A little tweaking of the background and reels and it turns the touch screen into a very realistic (and reasonably portable) slot machine for casino fun night parties, complete with custom background and our own reel images and sound effects.

The software displays images of IGT slot machine buttons on the screen, and you simply touch them to bet, spin the reels or cash out. You also have the option to shut those off and add real peripherals -- slot machine buttons, a jackpot light, even a coin slot, hopper, bill acceptor, and slot machine handle -- basically building your own functioning, real custom slot machine. The original post about the software is here:

https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/making-a-slot-machine-for-my-casino-parties.84686/

AllJ's target audience is the trade show sales people trying to attract clients, so your slot machine can have "fixed sequence," "random probability" and you can even trigger a jackpot with a small wireless remote. In random probability mode, it functions exactly like a casino slot machine.

Getting and using the software was a master class in how real slots at the casinos actually work.

I'm thinking it's time to build it out and just ordered some real IGT slot machine buttons and a controller board. They're several weeks out, so this project will get started some time in 2024.

Left: The current touchscreen running the slot machine software. Middle: Some real IGT slot machine buttons. Right: The
button controller board.
​

The controller board is preprogrammed for the AllJ software and IGT buttons. Connect the buttons to their corresponding wires and plug into a USB port. (I'm guessing it may be a bit more involved than it sounds.) I'll find out when the stuff arrives in four to six weeks. Buttons were just under $50 for the complete set. The controller board was $139.

And down the road? Building a slot cabinet with a jackpot light on top. Maybe even a handle. A bill acceptor might be pricey overkill. They cost $350 to $500 each. In the end, I might end up spending something close to the cost of a used slot. I just hope I don't run out of USB ports.

Can't wait to see those buttons light up and hit "spin reels" for the first time.

Look for more here and in a separate thread.

 

[dennis63]

We're quickly running low on several denominations as we anxiously await a shipping notice from Classic Poker Chips. We placed an order for some new Key Wests earlier this year. New chips should be on their way to us soon. (We're basically out of $1s and $5s, so I'm looking forward to a UPS notice from David at Classic whenever it arrives.)

Shipping for Christmas: Meanwhile, the shipping deadline to get anything by Christmas has passed for all the carriers. It's about time for a (brief) holiday break. I'll try to get any new orders out this week through Thursday. (They won't make it for Christmas.)

Holiday break: After that, we'll pause shipping from Thursday, 12/21 at noon through Tuesday, 12/26 at 8 a.m.

2024 Prices: I'll look into 2024 pricing during the break.

My sincere good wishes to all here for a happy, peaceful and safe holiday season, however you celebrate, and wherever you are in the world.

 

[dennis63]

I just posted new Key West chip prices for 2024. Here's the link and the chart.

https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/key-west-2024-prices.114303/​

For PCF members, denominated chips will increase $0.08 per chip to $2.19 each, or about 3 1/2 percent.

Each year, the chips are priced as the average price I paid for all chips in inventory. I can price them lower than Classic Poker Chips here because I have chips bought one, two or even three years ago, when prices were lower.

As my stock of chips dwindles down, as it did this year, restocking with newer, high-priced chips drives the "average" price of a chip up. The new price reflects this increase.

 

[TheYeti]

Dennis,

With the recently announced closure of CPC, what will become of Key West??

 

[Tonysquander]

Dennis,

With the recently announced closure of CPC, what will become of Key West??

I was wondering the same thing.

 

[FestiveKnight]

Dennis,

With the recently announced closure of CPC, what will become of Key West??

Notably, David did not announce the closure of CPC yet. He shared his intention to sell the business. While I am sure it gets harder with each transaction and with time, we have seen these particular assets and business change hands several times now and resume/continue business.

 

[JMC9389]

Notably, David did not announce the closure of CPC yet. He shared his intention to sell the business. While I am sure it gets harder with each transaction and with time, we have seen these particular assets and business change hands several times now and resume/continue business.

The issue is that we know CPC under Spragg has a good record of quality control. At least for me, I'll be hustling to get my last orders in before this deadline. If previous history is any indication with the Doc Ott days of ASM, I wouldn't guarantee that the quality of the product will be the same under new ownership.

 

[ekricket]

The issue is that we know CPC under Spragg has a good record of quality control. At least for me, I'll be hustling to get my last orders in before this deadline. If previous history is any indication with the Doc Ott days of ASM, I wouldn't guarantee that the quality of the product will be the same under new ownership.

C’mon, slamming my products already?

 

[JMC9389]

C’mon, slamming my products already?

Things would be in good hands with you, no doubt! Let's see what happens.

 

[Josh Kifer]

Notably, David did not announce the closure of CPC yet. He shared his intention to sell the business. While I am sure it gets harder with each transaction and with time, we have seen these particular assets and business change hands several times now and resume/continue business.

Cept with Red. He dun fucked it up.

 

[dennis63]

Dennis,

With the recently announced closure of CPC, what will become of Key West??

It's far too early to say with any certainty what will happen to Key West chips. It will depend on what happens in the next several months between now and when David takes his last orders. At some point, he will tell us if he is selling to someone who might keep the business open. That's my hope, of course, and it should be your hope if you want to see good clay chips being produced for the home market.

David has announced that he is selling the business, and has requested interest from his customers here on PFC first. He hasn't revealed exactly why he wants to sell or even if he has received any interest. He should keep that information to himself until the time is right.

Our members here on PCF talk a good game, but I don't see one member or a group of members buying CPC and making a serious go of keeping it open and running. There was a group of members here several years ago, when Red Ott put the equipment up for sale, who talked about buying the company. The members decided that even if they could raise the necessary cash to buy the business, they didn't know enough about how to make the chips. They decided not to take the chance. (I was not part of that group, so I don't know how serious they were, or if it was just talk.)

I can only say two things for certain: 1) If David sells to someone who wants to continue making quality chips, Key West will continue as it is; and 2) I will not be putting in a bid for Classic Poker Chips. (I'd love to, but I have many personal reasons I can't. Those reasons have nothing to do with Classic.)

Since David's announcement, I've gotten several inquiries from people who want to buy large quantities of Key Wests. I've never dealt with them before, so they're obviously looking to grab what they can to resell them at a large profit if / when David closes -- or even a year or two later.

I haven't decided what I will do with my inventory of Key West chips.

That's really all I can say right now. Too many unknowns to say anything with certainty. When things change, I will update everyone with a new post here. In the meantime, I wish David good luck at finding a buyer, perhaps one interested in continuing to make custom clay chips.

 

[FCCDAD]

It's far too early to say with any certainty what will happen to Key West chips. It will depend on what happens in the next several months between now and when David takes his last orders. At some point, he will tell us if he is selling to someone who might keep the business open. That's my hope, of course, and it should be your hope if you want to see good clay chips being produced for the home market.

David has announced that he is selling the business, and has requested interest from his customers here on PFC first. He hasn't revealed exactly why he wants to sell or even if he has received any interest. He should keep that information to himself until the time is right.

Our members here on PCF talk a good game, but I don't see one member or a group of members buying CPC and making a serious go of keeping it open and running. There was a group of members here several years ago, when Red Ott put the equipment up for sale, who talked about buying the company. The members decided that even if they could raise the necessary cash to buy the business, they didn't know enough about how to make the chips. They decided not to take the chance. (I was not part of that group, so I don't know how serious they were, or if it was just talk.)

I can only say two things for certain: 1) If David sells to someone who wants to continue making quality chips, Key West will continue as it is; and 2) I will not be putting in a bid for Classic Poker Chips. (I'd love to, but I have many personal reasons I can't. Those reasons have nothing to do with Classic.)

Since David's announcement, I've gotten several inquiries from people who want to buy large quantities of Key Wests. I've never dealt with them before, so they're obviously looking to grab what they can to resell them at a large profit if / when David closes -- or even a year or two later.

I haven't decided what I will do with my inventory of Key West chips.

That's really all I can say right now. Too many unknowns to say anything with certainty. When things change, I will update everyone with a new post here. In the meantime, I wish David good luck at finding a buyer, perhaps one interested in continuing to make custom clay chips.

If they do end up shutting down production, please give us current owners first rights to purchase any remaining inventory you are willing to sell, to add to our sets.

 

[dennis63]

If they do end up shutting down production, please give us current owners first rights to purchase any remaining inventory you are willing to sell, to add to our sets.

That's "Plan B."

Plan A right now is that the current owners of Classic Poker Chips find a buyer who will keep making chips after a flawless handoff.

 

[dennis63]

New chip prices for 2025 were announced this afternoon.

​

Prices for this year were delayed while we awaited the arrival of a new shipment of Key West chips. The chips actually arrived in February. They were counted and checked, then a new total inventory cost was calculated. The prices reflect the average price per chip I paid to get the chips. That way, buying Key Wests is similar to buying in a group buy.

 

[dennis63]

The issue is that we know CPC under Spragg has a good record of quality control. At least for me, I'll be hustling to get my last orders in before this deadline. If previous history is any indication with the Doc Ott days of ASM, I wouldn't guarantee that the quality of the product will be the same under new ownership.

I understand several people made legitimate offers to buy Classic Poker Chips, and several were invited to tour the factory. I've heard that five took the tour and were interviewed about their business experience and plans for the company. The current owners selected the person they thought best qualified to continue making high-quality chips.

I haven't had a chance to communicate directly with the new owner. I'm sure he is far too busy right now. But I think it's too early to write the company off based on the bad memories of a former owner who had control of the company for less than a year in its 113-year history.

Instead, I'm looking forward to great things from Classic in the future.

 

[ekricket]

I understand several people made legitimate offers to buy Classic Poker Chips, and several were invited to tour the factory. I've heard that five took the tour and were interviewed about their business experience and plans for the company. The current owners selected the person they thought best qualified to continue making high-quality chips.

I haven't had a chance to communicate directly with the new owner. I'm sure he is far too busy right now. But I think it's too early to write the company off based on the bad memories of a former owner who had control of the company for less than a year in its 113-year history.

Instead, I'm looking forward to great things from Classic in the future.

I’ll echo this. There are people standing in line if Mike decides he can’t make a go of it. But I’ve got confidence that David and David made a good choice, even if it wasn’t us!

 

[JMC9389]

I understand several people made legitimate offers to buy Classic Poker Chips, and several were invited to tour the factory. I've heard that five took the tour and were interviewed about their business experience and plans for the company. The current owners selected the person they thought best qualified to continue making high-quality chips.

I haven't had a chance to communicate directly with the new owner. I'm sure he is far too busy right now. But I think it's too early to write the company off based on the bad memories of a former owner who had control of the company for less than a year in its 113-year history.

Instead, I'm looking forward to great things from Classic in the future.

I'm with you there. Cautiously optimistic is my mindset.

 

[dennis63]

Key West vacation:

I will be traveling today through Sunday, July 27 and returning next week.

I'll be aaay from my office and the ability to pack and ship orders, so there will be a brief four-day pause in any outgoing orders.

Thanks!

Dennis

 

[Budha]

Key West vacation:

I will be traveling today through Sunday, July 27 and returning next week.

I'll be aaay from my office and the ability to pack and ship orders, so there will be a brief four-day pause in any outgoing orders.

Thanks!

Dennis

Enjoy the Vaca!!

 

[dennis63]

Sunday Spouting Off: "Less Expensive" v "Cheap:" Where is the line?

Lately, it seems I've been plagued with orders from people trying to work an angle to get Key West chips for less.

It's normal to get two or even three orders for every one that actually buys anything at all. (I spend a lot of time doing invoices, checking shipping rates and providing quotes to people who don't buy anything.) The average number of emails exchanged with a customer before they decide to buy is increasing, and can hit around 15.

Earlier this year, I got an email from a customer who asked, "No, seriously... What do they REALLY cost?" Another would-be customer asked how much I would refund "if" he found a flaw in one of the chips he received. I'm pretty sure he was planning to find some flaws. Probably lots of flaws.

This week, an international customer complained about prices and "reminded" me that his country charges a 36-percent tariff on all goods from the United States, and wanted me to reduce the price. (That's not a comment on current politics. His country has always charged a 36-percent tariff on U.S. goods.)

Another trick is the "conditional order." It says, "I'll buy if..." I hate this guy, but I kinda want to bring him with me the next time I buy a car.

So I'm asking myself several questions.

• Are Key West chips viewed as a "cheap" alternative? I always wanted them to be "less expensive" than custom chips, since they're not customs. They're semi-custom.
• Would eliminating the PCF discount actually sell more Key West chips to people? For some time here, the whales were buying the most expensive stuff they could find, after all.
• Should I just "close the doors,' and sell Key Wests to established customers who already own Key Wests? That would be infinitely easier, and would make the Key West name more exclusive and add value.

Just things I'm thinking about this week...

 

[suchj0sh]

I think people are obsessed with custom chips to a ridiculous extent, and don’t consider KW’s offerings or other “budget friendlier” casino offerings seriously enough.

I don’t think trying to target the “whales” is worth anything. They want their leaded Paulson’s and NAGB’s and that’s fine.

I hope a few sour apples don’t ruin the bunch. I think the overwhelming majority of forum members like and appreciate your products.

 

[LeLe]

It's normal to get two or even three orders for every one that actually buys anything at all. (I spend a lot of time doing invoices, checking shipping rates and providing quotes to people who don't buy anything.) The average number of emails exchanged with a customer before they decide to buy is increasing, and can hit around 15.

Earlier this year, I got an email from a customer who asked, "No, seriously... What do they REALLY cost?" Another would-be customer asked how much I would refund "if" he found a flaw in one of the chips he received. I'm pretty sure he was planning to find some flaws. Probably lots of flaws.

This week, an international customer complained about prices and "reminded" me that his country charges a 36 percent tariff on all goods from the United States, and wanted me to reduce the price.

Another trick is the "conditional order." It says, "I'll buy if..." I hate this guy, but I kinda want to bring him with me the next time I buy a car.

Low ballers gonna low ball, F those guys

Sometimes it better to just ignore those guys when such situations happen. It just not worth it

 

[Jacks]

Hi Dennis,

I’m really interested in getting some Key West chips, but before I even think about ordering, I need a few things clarified:

1. Can you tell me the real price? I mean, no offense, but the listed price can’t actually be what they really cost, right? Just between us.
2. If I do place an order, can you promise to refund me for any chips that aren’t absolutely flawless? Because honestly, I’m very picky and I’ll probably find something wrong with at least a few of them.
3. I live outside the U.S., and my government charges a 36% tariff on imports from you guys. That’s not fair to me, so I’m going to need you to lower your price to offset that.
4. I’m ready to order… but only if you can give me a better deal than what’s listed. Otherwise I’ll just hold off.

Also, before I decide, could you send me a detailed invoice with exact shipping costs to three different addresses (home, office, and my cousin’s place)? I might use one of them, not sure yet.

Thanks for your patience. Looking forward to working something out—if the numbers are right.

Best,
A Potential Customer

 

[FestiveKnight]

A thing to consider is what the form -> invoice -> cycles of back and forth -> purchase pipeline adds/detracts vs online shop -> purchase.

How many folks wouldn't order if they didn't get their hand held?
How many folks would order if they could just buy the chips like it was socks?
How much time (money) would you save if you didn't have to escort people through the process?

The hands-on sales approach might broaden your pool of potential customers but it also opens you up to having to massage every transaction and people trying these types of shenanigans. No one thinks they can get something on Amazon for less than it's listed price. If you lose X potential customers per month by having a less friendly/interactive approach, does the increased simplicity of the process on your end make up for it? Maybe you don't lose customers at all. A more straightforward approach creates an easier on ramp. Do you know from stats on your site how many people click around, visit a few times, then go to the form and never follow through?

 

[Budha]

Sunday Spouting Off: "Less Expensive" v "Cheap:" Where is the line?

Lately, it seems I've been plagued with orders from people trying to work an angle to get Key West chips for less.

It's normal to get two or even three orders for every one that actually buys anything at all. (I spend a lot of time doing invoices, checking shipping rates and providing quotes to people who don't buy anything.) The average number of emails exchanged with a customer before they decide to buy is increasing, and can hit around 15.

Earlier this year, I got an email from a customer who asked, "No, seriously... What do they REALLY cost?" Another would-be customer asked how much I would refund "if" he found a flaw in one of the chips he received. I'm pretty sure he was planning to find some flaws. Probably lots of flaws.

This week, an international customer complained about prices and "reminded" me that his country charges a 36-percent tariff on all goods from the United States, and wanted me to reduce the price. (That's not a comment on current politics. His country has always charged a 36-percent tariff on U.S. goods.)

Another trick is the "conditional order." It says, "I'll buy if..." I hate this guy, but I kinda want to bring him with me the next time I buy a car.

So I'm asking myself several questions.

• Are Key West chips viewed as a "cheap" alternative? I always wanted them to be "less expensive" than custom chips, since they're not customs. They're semi-custom.
• Would eliminating the PCF discount actually sell more Key West chips to people? For some time here, the whales were buying the most expensive stuff they could find, after all.
• Should I just "close the doors,' and sell Key Wests to established customers who already own Key Wests? That would be infinitely easier, and would make the Key West name more exclusive and add value.

Just things I'm thinking about this week...

Hey Dennis,

Sorry for your frustrations - people can be real PIA’s sometimes. I don’t think I’ve ever heard KW’s described as cheap, but rather the best value option compared to Paulson’s.

To some degree, there may be an element of IYKYK to the Key West’s. I suspect those people haven’t taken the time to explore and ask around. If they don’t know CPC, they probably don’t understand the quality of the KW’s. Honestly I didn’t until I got samples.

Once I received the sample set, the decision to buy was instant. The samples sell the product IMO.

You know I’m a huge fan of the KW’s, IMHO it would be a real shame for them to longer be offered b/c of some jack wagons.

Maybe tell them to ask around the forum and let us help - we’ve got your back!

-Mike

 

[dennis63]

A thing to consider is what the form -> invoice -> cycles of back and forth -> purchase pipeline adds/detracts vs online shop -> purchase.

How many folks wouldn't order if they didn't get their hand held?
How many folks would order if they could just buy the chips like it was socks?
How much time (money) would you save if you didn't have to escort people through the process?

The hands-on sales approach might broaden your pool of potential customers but it also opens you up to having to massage every transaction and people trying these types of shenanigans. No one thinks they can get something on Amazon for less than it's listed price. If you lose X potential customers per month by having a less friendly/interactive approach, does the increased simplicity of the process on your end make up for it? Maybe you don't lose customers at all. A more straightforward approach creates an easier on ramp. Do you know from stats on your site how many people click around, visit a few times, then go to the form and never follow through?

All good points.

Normally, interactions here are the reason to be here. @Tommy has created something really amazing here on PCF.

It's difficult to tell if someone is seriously considering buying a set of Key West chips, or just looking. In any given month, I have 3 or 4 orders sitting in boxes in my office, packed and ready to ship, but the people who ordered them stopped communicating after getting an invoice. (I can tell when the invoice has been viewed.)

Most of the orders are small. But I've got a shipping box sitting right now with 500 chips in it. That ties up the chips and influences what will be in my next Classic chip order, even though I'm not sure if those chips will sell or go back into inventory.

When I ran a few group buys in the Chiptalk days (before Poker Chip Forum existed), people would enthusiastically order chips. In every group, there were one or two who ghosted me when the chips were ready to ship and payment was due. I ended up holding about 3,000 chips ordered by other people who never paid -- and the idea to open it on a wider scale was born.

The chips are still sold like a group buy here. The price is (the total I paid for all the chips in the inventory) / (number of chips in the inventory).

When you're offering to continue that tradition and people walk in as new members and act like you're Amazon or Etsy selling cheap junk and getting rich, it kinda sucks.

I guess I've been wondering about the inherent value of scarcity, exclusivity and higher price equaling perceived "value." Making it easy makes people say, "I'll get some someday, but not today." Making it cheaper makes people think something that costs more is better.

Sadly, I know my comments here will piss people off. (It already has.)

 

[jdub]

Key Wests are great chips. You have a great product and the price is what it is. I bought your samples. I'm just not in that market... yet. You're the only guy selling compression mold clays off the shelf (that I recall) so don't be influenced by the competition or price sensitive buyers.

Don't let the turkey's get you down.

 

[TheYeti]

Key Wests are great chips. You have a great product and the price is what it is. I bought your samples. I'm just not in that market... yet. You're the only guy selling compression mold clays off the shelf (that I recall) so don't be influenced by the competition or price sensitive buyers.

Don't let the turkey's get you down.

There are other sources for off the shelf clays, but at nowhere near the price point of the Key Wests.

 

[Huskerchipper]

The older I get the more exhausting people become. Maybe I am changing. Maybe societally we are changing...or both. If there's one thing I have trouble tolerating is people wasting my time. How to handle it, I wish I could tell you. Only you can figure that out and I hope you do. You are an important and positive person in this hobby offering a unique product. Please know there are alot of us out here that value you and are hoping for your continued presence in the community. As far as anyone being upset with the words you've shared....... phfssssshhhh no words.