Two hands, help (1 Viewer)

[Gunnar]

So I was playing 4 people 100/200 game.

Hand one.

Me, 20k
Player G 34k ( aggro shark played before, has deep pockets and a good player, likes to hero call )
Player A 17k ( Tight )
Player H 29K ( Loose aggro almost a fish)

Button on Player A,
H posts SB
I post BB
G straddle 700
A folds
H calls
I look down on bet 2100
G thinks a little bit and calls,
H flats again.

Flop is

H bets 4000
Action is on me with G behind me. What do you guy do ?


Hand nr two.
Me, 11k
Player G 40k ( aggro shark played before, has deep pockets and a good player, likes to hero call )
Player A 15k ( Tight )
Player H 34K ( Loose aggro almost a fish )

Button on me,
G SB
A BB
H Limps
I have raise 700
G calls
A calls
H calls

Flop

G bets 1200
A folds
H folds
Action on me ? what to do ?

 

[Josh Kifer]

Hand one.

I raise. Nothing scary on that board. I roll with my kings.

Hand two.

I fold. Not raise. Your asking to lose chips playing a weak Jack short stack.

 

[onerand]

Hand 1 is a raise and get it in. Reraised pot, overpair, small stack to pot ratio. Standard.

Hand 2 your are too short to open, and to such a small size. I prefer a limp along. As played call and evaluate on turn. You are in position with top pair.

 

[Jimulacrum]

Hand one: Shove. There's 10,500 in the pot, including H's bet, and you only have 17,900 left. The pot is too large and your stack too small for any nuanced decision-making (SPR is about 2.75 going into the flop). If you're behind, someone slowplayed aces or set-mined without proper implied odds to do so. Nothing you can really do to get away from it now.

Hand two: Raise to 4,000 or thereabouts. Looks like a weak stab, and your jack is likely ahead, especially against an aggressive player. Of course, a 4K raise means you're committing to shove the turn if he checks, but that's kinda the downside to raising with when you're only 55 BB deep. It would be helpful if you have been watching this player enough to gauge his strength when he donk-bets less than half the pot, but absent meaningful reads, you kinda have to commit when you flop top pair with an SPR of 3.68.

 

[Anthony Martino]

Hand one: Shove. There's 10,500 in the pot, including H's bet, and you only have 17,900 left. The pot is too large and your stack too small for any nuanced decision-making (SPR is about 2.75 going into the flop). If you're behind, someone slowplayed aces or set-mined without proper implied odds to do so. Nothing you can really do to get away from it now.

Hand two: Raise to 4,000 or thereabouts. Looks like a weak stab, and your jack is likely ahead, especially against an aggressive player. Of course, a 4K raise means you're committing to shove the turn if he checks, but that's kinda the downside to raising with when you're only 55 BB deep. It would be helpful if you have been watching this player enough to gauge his strength when he donk-bets less than half the pot, but absent meaningful reads, you kinda have to commit when you flop top pair with an SPR of 3.68.

I would echo a similar path as Jim in this spot.

The stack to pot ratio on the flop with your Kings doesn't really give you much wiggle room, I'm shoving the flop and expect we are ahead, no free cards or FPS here.

On the 2nd hand you've flopped top pair and there's 2800 in the pot on the flop and Villain is donking weakly for 1200. What does this mean from this particular Villain? Is it to induce a shove? Is it a stab with a hand like 9x or a gutshot straight draw? Outside of information on what that bet means from this Villain I'm expecting we are ahead enough of the time and like a raise as well.

 

[DrStrange]

First hand allowed Hero to create a "no lose" situation. Yes hero can lose any given hand, but over long periods of time the straddle plus preflop raise means Hero can not be outplayed. hero gets a dream bone dry flop AND he gets a bet from the LAG to juice the pot. Jam all-in understanding that sometimes the LAG is going to show up with some silly two pair, a legitimate set (which isn't going to pay him enough to compensate for the risk of making preflop call). oh, and on a bad day the LAG pops up with a slow played aces. Still this should be an automatic decision.

Second hand we have Hero playing 55BB and holding J7s on the button. The game is four handed, so a lot of our thinking should be highly villain dependent. I first note that everyone calls the preflop raise making me wonder why Hero thought that was a good idea, button or not. I think a preflop fold is better than raise. Hero is on the cusp of pot committed. If Hero continues with the hand it seems likely that he could be playing for stacks.

So Hero, do you want to play for stacks with top pair weak / no kicker? If so, maybe an overbet jam is in order. The pot would be 700*4 plus 1200 * 2 = 5,200 while Hero's remaining stack is 11,000 less 1,900 or 9,100. The jam is almost a 2x pot raise but how else does Hero play the hand if he doesn't fold? Perhaps Hero could min-raise making a 7,600 pot and then jam for 7,900. If hero makes a "normal" 2/3 pot raise then he castrates the turn bet.

As for me, I don't much care playing for stacks with such a marginal holding. Perhaps I am a TAGfish but I fold the hand and make a mental note not to raise preflop with J7s.

However, Hero's table reads and villain history trumps everything. Could be hero expects villain to make ambitious calls with hands worse than top pair thinking to catch Hero over playing a big ace that missed the flop. Four handed poker is a lot more about the social parts of the game relative to the math.

DrStrange

 

[Gunnar]

Hand one.

I have 17900 left and action is on me to call 4000 with G behind me.

my Kings are really strong on a dead flop, so I decide to slow play my kings *PCF screams in terror
I flat
G folds.

Hero has left 13900
Villain has left 22900

Pot 14300

We get the Turn!

Flop is

Villian snap shoves can we find a fold here ?


Hand nr two.
Me, 11k
Player G 40k ( aggro shark played before, has deep pockets and a good player, likes to hero call )
Player A 15k ( Tight )
Player H 34K ( Loose aggro almost a fish )


I have


Flop



My thoughts, I have a top pair against a villian that can be really aggro. I think about it for a minute and call 1200, if he would be strong he would have re-raised my pre flop.

Hero 9100
Villain 38100
Pot 5800

Turn

Villain checks to me

What do I do ?

 

[WedgeRock]

G straddle 700
A folds
H calls
I look down on bet 2100

1600 in the pot and you raise only 1900 on top of your 200 BB? I might go a little bigger.

G thinks a little bit and calls,
H flats again.

Flop is

H bets 4000
Action is on me with G behind me. What do you guy do ?

You have about 18k left. Are you ready to take your stand here? H does not have AA, but he could have hit that flop. He might have hit 2 pair, hit might have hit a set, or he might have just hit top pair (like AT suited).

Folding is not an option. If you flat, he's going to keep pushing the action and you're stack is going to end up in the middle. Shove now. If he outflopped you, so be it. GGNH. MY bet is loose, aggro almost fish is just being loose aggro, almost like a fish.

Hand nr two.
Me, 11k

Uh oh. Did we lose hand 1?

Player G 40k ( aggro shark played before, has deep pockets and a good player, likes to hero call )
Player A 15k ( Tight )
Player H 34K ( Loose aggro almost a fish )

Button on me,
G SB
A BB
H Limps
I have raise 700
G calls
A calls
H calls

Flop

G bets 1200
A folds
H folds
Action on me ? what to do ?

When you raise with J7dd, you want some very narrow flops: diamonds (big diamonds), straight cards, or pairing the board. He's aggro. You made top pair and are last to act. If he's weak and you call, you might see a check to you on the turn (and you bet). If he leads out the turn, re-evaluate, but you may be committed to playing for stacks...that's what happens when you raise with J7dd. There might be a better spot to play your 45 BBs, but overall, it feels like a bully move with his 200 BB's against one of the two small stacks.

 

[WedgeRock]

Hand one.

Hero has left 13900
Villain has left 22900

Pot 14300

We get the Turn!

Flop is

Villian snap shoves can we find a fold here ?

Nope.

You're flat told him you were drawing/weakish. You induced him to act. Isn't that what you wanted when you decided to slow play kings? I follow my line and call off my stack.

Hand nr two.
Me, 11k
Player G 40k ( aggro shark played before, has deep pockets and a good player, likes to hero call )
Player A 15k ( Tight )
Player H 34K ( Loose aggro almost a fish )


I have


Flop



My thoughts, I have a top pair against a villian that can be really aggro. I think about it for a minute and call 1200, if he would be strong he would have re-raised my pre flop.

Hero 9100
Villain 38100
Pot 5800

Turn

Villain checks to me

What do I do ?

Both of these hands depend on your image as well as the play of the villains, but hand 2 seems like a weak stab by someone trying to bully you.

 

[Josh Kifer]

Hand 1...... Why would you slow play kings with a board just asking to get stronger. Grab the chips when your good, don't let someone get the chance of catching up. If he has a ten, your giving him chances at two pair.

Hand 2

At this point, I would call it down within reason. Try to limit loss of chips and hope my top pair is okay.

 

[jemfernandez]

Hand 1: Perhaps I’m the only one who doesn’t like the shove? I’d flat and let G come along and look to play the turn. Jamming on the flop you have to think of what range of hands are calling and if you’re folding out some weak draws and possible gutshot combinations. Also jamming here allows your opponent to play his hand very well, calling when he has sets and two pairs ans potentially folding out a weak T.

 

[Jimulacrum]

On the turn:

Hand 1: No, you can't find a fold. Call all-in. You made the pot too big preflop to get away from kings post-flop on an undercard board. If you routinely fold in situations like this, you may as well put your buy-in in a gift box and donate it to the table.

Hand 2: Kinda awkward stack sizes. If you shove, I fear you're only getting called when you're beaten. Bet 2,500, and plan to fold to a check-raise or check back the river if Villain calls and then checks to you. You could also check back the turn to try to induce a bluff on the river, but it's a kinda wet board for that play.