Transaction feedback? (3 Viewers)

[Sparkynutz]

I've seen these types of posts in poker chip general and in here. off topic.
Mods- Should there maybe be a subsection for feedback besides leaving bad feedback? Or good feedback?

At what point do you leave bad feedback for a transaction?

June 17th posted dibs and sent PM to buy items and asked for total with shipping.
June 18th received paypal info but no shipping total.
June 19th asked for total again with response shortly after. I paid within the hour and received message saying it would be shipped next morning.

Chips haven't arrived so I sent message Wed July 3rd asking if they were sent out.

@Justchipin profile. Hasn't been online since Monday July 1st.
Anybody know how to get ahold of him?

I'm hesitant to leave bad feedback just yet. Hope everything is ok with him.

I've had a few other questionable transactions in the past with terrible communication or poor quality products and nothing done to make it right. Some with people online daily yet take weeks and repeated messages to finally respond or pay or I just give up and stop asking. I have no problem with them canceling a transaction if needed or even telling me tough luck on a broken or poor quality product but ghosting someone just sucks.
I've added them to my own transaction notes but curious what others thoughts are on the subject? Especially when all of these members have 100% feedback scores and I'm curious how.

 

[Antrooper]

Huh, I think I saw some post from @Timmah with similar descriptions. You guys should check with each other.

 

[BarrieJ3]

The only negative feedback you’ll ever see is if you straight up get in an argument with someone or someone is extremely unscrupulous or similar.

It’s essentially a huge scarlet letter, but even then doesn’t mean much (see my own feedback).

No one will leave negative feedback since most people sit at 100% positive, and if you leave negative, chances are the other person in the transaction will leave retaliatory negative feedback.

I almost always have a pending payment or two. Currently only one for about $1500ish from a well known chipper. When I asked for the money, they went from logging in and posting everyday to suddenly disappearing offline. Will I describe this in any way via feedback? Nope, cause there would be significant backlash and there’s no value to doing so. And these stories appear to be pretty commonplace.

Ymmv.

 

[Timmah]

Huh, I think I saw some post from @Timmah with similar descriptions. You guys should check with each other.

My chips finally came through. The tracking number was changed and the new info wasn’t sent to me.

 

[Timmah]

The only negative feedback you’ll ever see is if you straight up get in an argument with someone or someone is extremely unscrupulous or similar.

It’s essentially a huge scarlet letter, but even then doesn’t mean much (see my own feedback).

No one will leave negative feedback since most people sit at 100% positive, and if you leave negative, chances are the other person in the transaction will leave retaliatory negative feedback.

I have a $2k and a $1500ish pending payment that’s been out there for quite some time by well known chippers. When I asked for the money, they went from logging in and posting everyday to suddenly disappearing offline. It’s been a couple weeks for one, months for the other. Will I describe this in any way via feedback? Nope, cause there would be significant backlash and there’s no value to doing so. And these stories appear to be pretty commonplace.

Ymmv.

For $2000 and $1500 transactions, I would expect immediate shipping. That’s a lot of money. If I got to the point I believed I wasn’t getting them, I would have to go public so others didn’t have the same fate.

 

[BarrieJ3]

For $2000 and $1500 transactions, I would expect immediate shipping. That’s a lot of money. If I got to the point I believed I wasn’t getting them, I would have to go public so others didn’t have the same fate.

Ah sorry, I shipped the chips and am awaiting payment.

I’ve never been overly concerned on timing, knowing eventually it comes in or evens out. Over what’s probably been 750ish transactions I think I’ve only had chips straight up stolen once.

 

[LeLe]

Mods- Should there maybe be a subsection for feedback besides leaving bad feedback? Or good feedback?

I don't think it really matters as most people don't take the feedback into consideration when buying / selling chips.

Personally, I do see the seller/buyer past messages to check if there are any red flags instead.

Currently only one for about $1500ish from a well known chipper. When I asked for the money, they went from logging in and posting everyday to suddenly disappearing offline

That chipper deserved to be named (if you haven do so)

 

[Sparkynutz]

I don't think it really matters as most people don't take the feedback into consideration when buying / selling chips.

Personally, I do see the seller/buyer past messages to see if there is any red flags.


That chipper deserved to be named (if you haven do so)

Exactly why a buyer beware subforum would be quicker.

I look at feedback before sending funds.
Backlash and bad feedback in return is a risk but hopefully for bigger transaction issues people would take the chance and step up to protect the rest of us from these bad apples.

 

[Eriks]

I think it could make sense with a subforum dedicated to this. It’s obvious that people (myself included) are more likely to start threads about poor ongoing transactions rather than giving honest feedback using the feedback system to conclude a closed but poorly managed deal.

 

[Sparkynutz]

I think it could make sense with a subforum dedicated to this. It’s obvious that people (myself included) are more likely to start threads about poor ongoing transactions rather than giving honest feedback using the feedback system to conclude a closed but poorly managed deal.

It also gives more room to show both sides of the story.

 

[Sparkynutz]

Ah sorry, I shipped the chips and am awaiting payment.

I’ve never been overly concerned on timing, knowing eventually it comes in or evens out. Over what’s probably been 750ish transactions I think I’ve only had chips straight up stolen once.

I've shipped items twice before being paid but both were small transactions I had no reason to question if they'd pay. They did pay before the items arrived so they didn't know they were on the way. I usually ship AFTER payment. That's on the seller tho.

Unless trading which gets grey. All of my trading transactions went very smooth so far. Knock on wood.

My main issue is poor communication.
It's funny that a few very highly regarded sellers on here are on my poor communication list.

One is on here nonstop beating everyone to the good deals then usually picking what they want of the lots and selling for more later. I called them out on that privately and I must be on their do not respond to list because I've still tried buying their leftovers a few times I wanted anyways. Oh well.

The few others on my own list either ended acceptably in the end or transaction amount was so minor that I just chalked it up as a loss and just won't buy from them again.

Mods- Somewhere dedicated to post a buyer beware could be of value to the community.
Heck. Many here with 100% feedback could be in that subforum, myself included but atleast everyone would have a chance to either put their foot in their mouth in the open or make things right.
The still honorable members would most likely stay that way and hopefully the sideways transactions will be made whole instead of being ignored as has been in the past.

 

[FrankBlack]

I've shipped items twice before being paid but both were small transactions I had no reason to question if they'd pay. They did pay before the items arrived so they didn't know they were on the way. I usually ship AFTER payment. That's on the seller tho.

Unless trading which gets grey. All of my trading transactions went very smooth so far. Knock on wood.

My main issue is poor communication.
It's funny that a few very highly regarded sellers on here are on my poor communication list.

One is on here nonstop beating everyone to the good deals then usually picking what they want of the lots and selling for more later. I called them out on that privately and I must be on their do not respond to list because I've still tried buying their leftovers a few times I wanted anyways. Oh well.

The few others on my own list either ended acceptably in the end or transaction amount was so minor that I just chalked it up as a loss and just won't buy from them again.

Mods- Somewhere dedicated to post a buyer beware could be of value to the community.
Heck. Many here with 100% feedback could be in that subforum, myself included but atleast everyone would have a chance to either put their foot in their mouth in the open or make things right.
The still honorable members would most likely stay that way and hopefully the sideways transactions will be made whole instead of being ignored as has been in the past.

Why call someone out for scooping good chips and selling off the unwanted ones for profit? I don't see any issue with this.

 

[DirtyTIVA]

Why call someone out for scooping good chips and selling off the unwanted ones for profit? I don't see any issue with this.

Nah. They’ll scoop any chips if they think there’s profit to be made. Everything is always mint unplayed and marked up later.

There’s not a whole lot of it visibly going on these days as the market is soft as hell and their offers tend to come through DM.

About as savory as the Asian auntie cutting their way through line… until I elbow them in the face.

 

[Sparkynutz]

Why call someone out for scooping good chips and selling off the unwanted ones for profit? I don't see any issue with this.

I got a sample set of chips from a member here that said he'd sell the set in the future. Shortly after that member posted his set for sale without letting me know for a smoking deal and was immediately scooped up. I didnt have a chance to buy it. I offered to buy the set for original listing price plus additional shipping. New buyer wanted significantly more for them than he bought them for. A few months later it was posted for sale or trade for double what he paid and I found out from original seller about the box being damaged in shipping with a few lost chips and $100 credit going to buyer.
The pictures new owner posted were the original owners pictures which they never removed from listing even after asked from original seller.
Fast forward many months they still wouldn't sell the chips for even close to what original price was not even accounting the $100 credit they got.
I've been watching many of their posts in the years since and often see them buying things then selling later for more.
Wouldn't be an issue but frustrating that they are on like 24-7 buying up all the good deals to resell with no supporter account until very recently being called out by someone else.
A few items they were reselling I wanted bad enough to pay their inflated price and they haven't responded to messages in the 3x I tried.
Ignoring me is their choice and I wouldn't publicly blast them for that but their actions kinda goes against most of what PCF is to me and many others. Isnt it about helping others out and sharing this hobby? Not blatantly taking advantage of others or giving new members or others the chance to buy any of the good deals before being snapped up for resale.

Again oh well. That's how the world is and crying about it won't change anything.
I just can't buy anything I want from them for giving them a hard time for their practices. My own fault not keeping my mouth shut. That's not who I am and I'll deal lol.

 

[BarrieJ3]

Interestingly, this short thread compares the two narratives.

1. This place is first and foremost a marketplace. Buyer/seller beware, get to know the market, get to know the people, or get wrecked. There is no regulation, no unspoken rules, and members are not allowed to directly speak on or impact others’ sales negatively - they can only stan.

2. On the flip side, there is no meaningful feedback or tracking.

Try your best to marry those two things, shrug.

So instead, just keep in mind most meaningful deals are done via pm/offline, yes most people are aware of the jackwagons and commiserate about them privately, and almost all transactions are easy and great until that one or two aren’t.

 

[KHarp1]

Maybe we could start a new BS thread and place all of these transaction ratings there since they would mostly be of the negative persuasion. As mentioned, most of the transaction ratings are usually good. BS bad. What's the worst that could happen, mods shut it down?

 

[ovo]

Over 13,000 members. They can't all know proper etiquette. Look at all the dumb people in the world. Plus, people's lives get disrupted with everyday life issue and chips take a back seat. The people that are serious about the hobby want to have good communication, that's all it takes. If the shit hits the fan on your side of the world, just let the buyer know. The chips are still coming, but I'm a lazy fuck, or my cat just died, whatever the reason, communicate .

 

[upNdown]

Why call someone out for scooping good chips and selling off the unwanted ones for profit? I don't see any issue with this.

Opinions vary and there are strong opinions on each side, but there’s a long history of anti-flipping sentiment here on PCF. If you’re a vendor bringing new product to the forum and making a profit - no complaints. But if you buy chips from one member only to flip them to another member for a profit, a lot of us think that you suck.

 

[Eriks]

communicate

This!

Lack of communication is mostly the issue. It takes the seller 1 minute to get on here and send a quick pm if something has happened. If you can’t show the buyer even that tiniest bit of respect, you shouldn’t be selling on here period.

 

[FrankBlack]

Opinions vary and there are strong opinions on each side, but there’s a long history of anti-flipping sentiment here on PCF. If you’re a vendor bringing new product to the forum and making a profit - no complaints. But if you buy chips from one member only to flip them to another member for a profit, a lot of us thing that you suck.

My experience with buying and selling used stereo equipment was always driven by perceived value and market demand. If done right (and a bit lucky), small profits made from transactions sustain my enjoyment and engagement in the hobby. It surprises me to sense that losses are expected in chipping.

 

[Sparkynutz]

Opinions vary and there are strong opinions on each side, but there’s a long history of anti-flipping sentiment here on PCF. If you’re a vendor bringing new product to the forum and making a profit - no complaints. But if you buy chips from one member only to flip them to another member for a profit, a lot of us thing that you suck.

Then there's a few guys that I've seen buy lots for a certain chip then sell for drastically less. Or buy and resell after not liking or using at a loss. I try and give those kinda guys a better deal or freebies if I have the chance.

Some of those guys could be highlighted in that subforum for their excellent actions and support to our community.
@iLogik @Chris Manzoni and a few others come to mind not that the rest don't already know that but may be helpful for new members.

 

[Eriks]

My experience with buying and selling used stereo equipment was always driven by perceived value and market demand. If done right (and a bit lucky), small profits made from transactions sustain my enjoyment and engagement in the hobby. It surprises me to sense that losses are expected in chipping.

A lot of the folks have been here a long time and have formed strong friendships. They travel across the world to various meet-ups to hang out, play poker and make even more friends. They don’t primarily view PCF as a market place and certainly not a place where you go out of your way to make money off of your friends (unless playing poker )

 

[DirtyTIVA]

My experience with buying and selling used stereo equipment was always driven by perceived value and market demand. If done right (and a bit lucky), small profits made from transactions sustain my enjoyment and engagement in the hobby. It surprises me to sense that losses are expected in chipping.

Lol. More like losses are expected in life with rare exceptions.

The price boom happened 3 years ago. I’m sure some people cling to the idea that it might happen again. I’m not holding my breath.

Spend some more time here and have some things you want snapped up in 1 minute because you didn’t refresh pcf often enough and then listed later for more and you’ll see what some posters here are on about.

 

[demonnic]

I'm a fairly new member and don't know who anybody is, really. So maybe it's a perspective that could be helpful, but also maybe I just don't know what I'm talking about. But I'ma say it anyway.

So far, this has been one of the most welcoming and friendly communities I have had the pleasure of joining, and I'm in some really fairly niche ones (ask me about my MUD client some time). There seem to be a lot of fairly good deals here from the research I've been doing, and clearly like any other collectable some things which to my eye looks waaaay expensive but I am sure are worth it to the right person who's looking to finally complete their dream set. That's all well and good and honestly a sign of a healthy collector's market, in my opinion. I swear I didn't even join this board with the intention of buying anything but I've already joined a group buy and purchased some other chips which I'm super excited to receive in a way I could not have honestly imagined before I made the decision. And part of that is that the enthusiasm of the community ultimately shines through.

You would need to be careful that a name-and-shame board or thread for things like this did not turn into a back biting popularity contest, as that can ruin a community. I was pleasantly surprised to see a feedback system in place and am saddened to hear it's not really used for negative feedback so much. Negative transactions happen, not every buyer or seller is on top of everything every time, and even otherwise reliable people make mistakes. So a few negative reviews don't necessarily mean much, but a trend of recent ones may. Shame not to use the feature built in to the board for its intended purpose, you know?

As to the other, there's a world of difference between opportunistically snapping up the good deals presented to a community of like minded individuals solely to turn around and sell them at a nice profit and managing to get a good deal on something you need to complete your set and selling off the remainder even if it winds up being at a small profit per chip/break even for the project. Not saying there's anything necessarily morally wrong about the first, but it's the kind of thing that discourages people from giving as many of those good deals after a while when they realize they're just getting flipped for a profit. The deals get worse for everybody, at least those presented to the community as a whole, and the really great deals wind up being circulated between groups of friends.

Trying to be savvy with your trading so you can collect on a budget is also vastly different from trying to run a small side hustle in flipping collectibles, in my opinion.

But also what do I know? I'm super new to this hobby. A lot of my opinions come from having been involved in other hobbies and watching what happened with them, and it may be most of that doesn't apply here. But I thought maybe I could add a slightly different perspective from what seems to be a lot of established folks tossing around some established ... I don't want to say arguments, but perhaps hotly contested philosophies.

Either way, I can say the community as a whole seems awesome and I've been treated super nicely especially for someone so new, so either I'm really just super lucky, super gullible, or the community as a whole is pretty good and healthy.

Wow, that was a lot. I'm gonna spend like a week lurking to balance the scales now. And recover from the potentially incoming scorchers.

 

[Sparkynutz]

I'm a fairly new member and don't know who anybody is, really. So maybe it's a perspective that could be helpful, but also maybe I just don't know what I'm talking about. But I'ma say it anyway.

So far, this has been one of the most welcoming and friendly communities I have had the pleasure of joining, and I'm in some really fairly niche ones (ask me about my MUD client some time). There seem to be a lot of fairly good deals here from the research I've been doing, and clearly like any other collectable some things which to my eye looks waaaay expensive but I am sure are worth it to the right person who's looking to finally complete their dream set. That's all well and good and honestly a sign of a healthy collector's market, in my opinion. I swear I didn't even join this board with the intention of buying anything but I've already joined a group buy and purchased some other chips which I'm super excited to receive in a way I could not have honestly imagined before I made the decision. And part of that is that the enthusiasm of the community ultimately shines through.

You would need to be careful that a name-and-shame board or thread for things like this did not turn into a back biting popularity contest, as that can ruin a community. I was pleasantly surprised to see a feedback system in place and am saddened to hear it's not really used for negative feedback so much. Negative transactions happen, not every buyer or seller is on top of everything every time, and even otherwise reliable people make mistakes. So a few negative reviews don't necessarily mean much, but a trend of recent ones may. Shame not to use the feature built in to the board for its intended purpose, you know?

As to the other, there's a world of difference between opportunistically snapping up the good deals presented to a community of like minded individuals solely to turn around and sell them at a nice profit and managing to get a good deal on something you need to complete your set and selling off the remainder even if it winds up being at a small profit per chip/break even for the project. Not saying there's anything necessarily morally wrong about the first, but it's the kind of thing that discourages people from giving as many of those good deals after a while when they realize they're just getting flipped for a profit. The deals get worse for everybody, at least those presented to the community as a whole, and the really great deals wind up being circulated between groups of friends.

Trying to be savvy with your trading so you can collect on a budget is also vastly different from trying to run a small side hustle in flipping collectibles, in my opinion.

But also what do I know? I'm super new to this hobby. A lot of my opinions come from having been involved in other hobbies and watching what happened with them, and it may be most of that doesn't apply here. But I thought maybe I could add a slightly different perspective from what seems to be a lot of established folks tossing around some established ... I don't want to say arguments, but perhaps hotly contested philosophies.

Either way, I can say the community as a whole seems awesome and I've been treated super nicely especially for someone so new, so either I'm really just super lucky, super gullible, or the community as a whole is pretty good and healthy.

Wow, that was a lot. I'm gonna spend like a week lurking to balance the scales now. And recover from the potentially incoming scorchers.

I think you're right. The vast majority of this community are superior to most forums ethically. Unfortunately it does only take a few bad apples to ruin things like frequent good deals. Fortunately theres giveaways etc that tip the scales a little.
Sooner or later we all get bit by these bad apples in one way or another.
If you haven't then leave now or try and be prepared to deal with it when it happens.

 

[FrankBlack]

A lot of the folks have been here a long time and have formed strong friendships. They travel across the world to various meet-ups to hang out, play poker and make even more friends. They don’t primarily view PCF as a market place and certainly not a place where you go out of your way to make money off of your friends (unless playing poker )

This makes sense, and got me to thinking. I approached this site first as a source of information and was warmly greeted. Many members have gone out of their way to share experiences and offer help. I do recognize the differences between a budget conscious hobbyist and a profiteer. I can also live with the vast grey area in between. Thank you for reminding me that PCF supports community too.

 

[Timmah]

There was a thread that blew up about a deal gone south. There was an agreement for a trade. User A was to send chips, and User B was to send chips and money. User B sent the money but not the chips, and User A sent the chips. Now User B had both sets of chips and decided to back out of the deal. User B demanded payment of his money back before sending back User A’s chips. They ended up needing a third user to mediate.

Bad feedback doesn’t matter, especially in this case. Apparently there is a setting somewhere to limit the info that you can see, including feedback. This is the message you get:

 

[Eriks]

There was a thread that blew up about a deal gone south. There was an agreement for a trade. User A was to send chips, and User B was to send chips and money. User B sent the money but not the chips, and User A sent the chips. Now User B had both sets of chips and decided to back out of the deal. User B demanded payment of his money back before sending back User A’s chips. They ended up needing a third user to mediate.

Bad feedback doesn’t matter, especially in this case. Apparently there is a setting somewhere to limit the info that you can see, including feedback. This is the message you get:

View attachment 1354075

Prob put that one on the do-not-deal-with-list then

 

[Sparkynutz]

Anybody have contact info from @Justchipin?

 

[Tonysquander]

There was a thread that blew up about a deal gone south. There was an agreement for a trade. User A was to send chips, and User B was to send chips and money. User B sent the money but not the chips, and User A sent the chips. Now User B had both sets of chips and decided to back out of the deal. User B demanded payment of his money back before sending back User A’s chips. They ended up needing a third user to mediate.

Bad feedback doesn’t matter, especially in this case. Apparently there is a setting somewhere to limit the info that you can see, including feedback. This is the message you get:

View attachment 1354075

The feedback is still accesible. Touch the name and you will see the percentage in the small pop up window and then if you touch the percentage it will pull up the feedback transactions page. Privacy restrictions do not block it.