Lead test for Lake Elsinore $4 chip (5 Viewers)

[TripleRangeMerger]

RESULTS:

The summary is that I could not demonstrate a positive swab-style lead test after cleaning the chip thoroughly and testing the yellow edge spot.

ORIGINAL POST:
------

I did as much digging as I could and came up with this post that says they are unleaded. I'm not sure how to verify it.

If no one has slam dunk evidence (verified lead test or definite proof of manufacture/issue date well after the Paulson lead deadline) I will buy a lead test kit, but I'd prefer to avoid sanding one of mine if someone else already has this figured out.

Chip in question:

Thanks.

 

[dizzyChipper]

I did as much digging as I could and came up with this post that says they are unleaded. I'm not sure how to verify it.

If no one has slam dunk evidence (verified lead test or definite proof of manufacture/issue date well after the Paulson lead deadline) I will buy a lead test kit, but I'd prefer to avoid sanding one of mine if someone else already has this figured out.

Chip in question:

View attachment 1694320


Thanks.

Sanding!!! Unnecessary.

 

[DirtyTIVA]

They weigh 8.9g

Doesn’t really matter if it contains lead or not. Like gold that floats.

 

[BKisback]

I've read that there are leaded, unleaded, and semi-leaded, and that Cali chips from this era are often the latter. I checked on $5s that weigh in the low 9g range.

 

[TripleRangeMerger]

The problem is that I need to make sure they’re completely unleaded before I commit to them.

I’ll post the lead test kit result in this thread.

 

[BarrieJ3]

The problem is that I need to make sure they’re completely unleaded before I commit to them.

I’ll post the lead test kit result in this thread.

Dibs.

 

[RocAFella1]

The problem is that I need to make sure they’re completely unleaded before I commit to them.

If I had a billion dollars every time @Gorbash said this I’d be very very poor.

 

[AlbinoDragon]

The problem is that I need to make sure they’re completely unleaded before I commit to them.

I’ll post the lead test kit result in this thread.

What is the concern? Unless you are eating them, or grinding them up any lead isn't going to magically wind up in your system. There are countless posts and a handful of threads here that hash this out ad nauseum.

 

[TripleRangeMerger]

What is the concern? Unless you are eating them, or grinding them up any lead isn't going to magically wind up in your system. There are countless posts and a handful of threads here that hash this out ad nauseum.

I did my research on this and didn't think there was enough actual information to say. To me, it mostly looked like speculation/opinion on both sides. If I did overlook decisive evidence, please let me know. It's not much fun trying to build a playable set and excluding a gigantic portion of the chip pool over something like this.

My chain of reasoning goes something like this:

• We know lead is toxic and absorbed almost entirely through ingestion.
• We know that compression clay chips lose volume with handling over time, which must mean they are grinding off fragments, particles, fine dust etc. Presumably this is ending up on tables, in racks, cases, and on other nearby surfaces.
• Not everyone will exercise the same degree of diligence in cleaning their hands (or use the proper soap) after touching a contaminated surface. People eat at my game and afterwards, and this is a clear, possible ingestion route.

My overall assessment is not that I know for fact that this is dangerous. It's that I don't know the risk I am exposing players (or my family) to, and am taking a measured precaution because at the end of the day the risk/reward is very asymmetric. Especially for non-chipper friends, this is more easily avoided than explained.

If anyone who is a long time leaded chip enthusiast/player (and especially if they have milled leaded chips) has ever shared their own heavy metal bloodwork I would be extremely interested in seeing that post. I'd also be interested in reading about what lead Paulson/GPI to change the formula.

Again, apologies if I overlooked something that clearly settled this in the old posts/threads on the topic.

 

[grandmeme]

It's mandatory for me to do heavy metal blood tests every year for work. I have no issues. Speaking anecdotally, obviously. If I did test high for lead, it wouldn't necessarily be due to lead in poker chips.

 

[DirtyTIVA]

It's mandatory for me to do heavy metal blood tests every year for work. I have no issues. Speaking anecdotally, obviously. If I did test high for lead, it wouldn't necessarily be due to lead in poker chips.

Do you work as a guard for an imprisoned Magneto?

Opal miner?

 

[grandmeme]

Do you work as a guard for an imprisoned Magneto?

Opal miner?

Close... I'm a chemist who does a lot of cadmium and lead catalysis...

 

[Jacks]

Close... I'm a chemist who does a lot of cadmium and lead catalysis...

I have a close friend who is a chemist who synthesizes things (or something, I’m dumb). When I brought up this controversy he goes “I’ve handled way scarier stuff than lead lol”

 

[LowerBama1714]

I did my research on this and didn't think there was enough actual information to say. To me, it mostly looked like speculation/opinion on both sides. If I did overlook decisive evidence, please let me know. It's not much fun trying to build a playable set and excluding a gigantic portion of the chip pool over something like this.

My chain of reasoning goes something like this:

• We know lead is toxic and absorbed almost entirely through ingestion.
• We know that compression clay chips lose volume with handling over time, which must mean they are grinding off fragments, particles, fine dust etc. Presumably this is ending up on tables, in racks, cases, and on other nearby surfaces.
• Not everyone will exercise the same degree of diligence in cleaning their hands (or use the proper soap) after touching a contaminated surface. People eat at my game and afterwards, and this is a clear, possible ingestion route.

My overall assessment is not that I know for fact that this is dangerous. It's that I don't know the risk I am exposing players (or my family) to, and am taking a measured precaution because at the end of the day the risk/reward is very asymmetric. Especially for non-chipper friends, this is more easily avoided than explained.

If anyone who is a long time leaded chip enthusiast/player (and especially if they have milled leaded chips) has ever shared their own heavy metal bloodwork I would be extremely interested in seeing that post. I'd also be interested in reading about what lead Paulson/GPI to change the formula.

Again, apologies if I overlooked something that clearly settled this in the old posts/threads on the topic.

Were you on a flight to Seattle today?…dude next to me used hand sanitizer 4 times before they closed the boarding doors. I offered him some of my beef jerky…he didn’t take it.

Was it you?

Jk…long flight.

 

[grandmeme]

I have a close friend who is a chemist who synthesizes things (or something, I’m dumb). When I brought up this controversy he goes “I’ve handled way scarier stuff than lead lol”

Scary stuff depends on what specialisation of chemistry you do, but the typical rite of passage for all chemistry grad students is to shake uncontrollably while using t-buLi as your PI watches you like a hawk

 

[Tonysquander]

I'd also be interested in reading about what lead Paulson/GPI to change the formula.

They changed the formula because they got sued by some people and lawyers looking for a payday. They made a business decision to avoid future legal actions.

https://oag.ca.gov/system/files/prop65/settlements/2006-00549S692.pdf

 

[inca911]

*steps up on soapbox*
If you are also a chemist, you might or might not recall the days when we used to rinse glassware with carcinogenic and highly volatile benzene to get the glass really clean. Or construct a heavy metal spewing volcano as a demo. Those are a few orders of magnitude more dangerous than theoretical dermal adsorption from compounds containing fractional lead concentrations. We aren’t talking about lead ingots here. Touching metallic lead or bathing in lead-contaminated water is generally not absorbed through the skin. More complex organic lead compounds or fine lead dust/powders do present a real skin adsorption risk. Without cuts on the skin or other more accessible routes of introduction (e.g., particulate inhalation) driving to a poker game is far more dangerous than the risk from leaded chips unless they are being ingested. Kids shouldn’t eat poker chips, leaded or otherwise. Remember, life has a 100% mortality rate.
*steps down from soapbox*

 

[grandmeme]

Duplicate

 

[grandmeme]

If you are also a chemist, you might or might not recall the days when we used to rinse glassware with carcinogenic and highly volatile benzene to get the glass really clean. Or construct a heavy metal spewing volcano as a demo. Those are a few orders of magnitude more dangerous than theoretical dermal adsorption from compounds containing fractional lead concentrations. We aren’t talking about lead ingots here. Touching metallic lead or bathing in lead-contaminated water is generally not absorbed. More complex organic lead or fine lead dust/powders do present a real skin adsorption risk. Without cuts on the skin or other more accessible routes of introduction (e.g., particulate inhalation) driving to a poker game is far more dangerous than the risk from leaded chips unless they are being ingested. Kids shouldn’t eat poker chips, leaded or otherwise. Remember, life has a 100% mortality rate.

I remember my old supervisor telling me that in the 1930s they used to dump chemical waste straight in the forest. That forest no longer exists. They also used to smoke cigarettes in the lab when working with cyanides - a precaution as tobacco tasted different when combined with cyanide gas, a more pronounced almond-like smell

Back to the topic, I personally wouldn't worry about lead poisoning in poker chips. But I do understand your worry. I hope someone has a definitive answer to your question about LE $4s.

 

[LowerBama1714]

I remember my old supervisor telling me that in the 1930s they used to dump chemical waste straight in the forest. That forest no longer exists. They also used to smoke cigarettes in the lab when working with cyanides - a precaution as tobacco tasted different when combined with cyanide gas, a more pronounced almond-like smell

Back to the topic, I personally wouldn't worry about lead poisoning in poker chips. But I do understand your worry. I hope someone has a definitive answer to your question about LE $4s.

I have your answer…

Not enough lead.

 

[TripleRangeMerger]

Were you on a flight to Seattle today?…dude next to me used hand sanitizer 4 times before they closed the boarding doors. I offered him some of my beef jerky…he didn’t take it.

Was it you?

Sorry man the beef jerky looked amazing but I couldn't figure out how to get it around my N95

If you are also a chemist, you might or might not recall the days when we used to rinse glassware with carcinogenic and highly volatile benzene to get the glass really clean.

I remember my old supervisor telling me that in the 1930s they used to dump chemical waste straight in the forest. That forest no longer exists. They also used to smoke cigarettes in the lab when working with cyanides - a precaution as tobacco tasted different when combined with cyanide gas, a more pronounced almond-like smell

Guys I promise I'm not some biohazard prude, I was mouth pipetting stuff you wouldn't believe not that long ago.

It's really just the responsibility I feel to my less conscientious, non-chipper guests and family members. I will own and play lead sets eventually, I'm just trying to get my first home game THC set off the ground.

 

[LowerBama1714]

Sorry man the beef jerky looked amazing but I couldn't figure out how to get it around my N95



Guys I promise I'm not some biohazard prude, I was mouth pipetting stuff you wouldn't believe not that long ago.

It's really just the responsibility I feel to my less conscientious, non-chipper guests and family members. I will own and play lead sets eventually, I'm just trying to get my first home game THC set off the ground.

Bucc-ees Korean BBQ…from the case.

It’s the best.

Unleaded.

 

[Gunnar]

@MrCatPants has players that lick and probably bite chips so I understand your concern.

 

[TripleRangeMerger]

They look like two different colours to me honestly, but it's not a flagrant reaction.

I didn't scrape/sand the chip, but I'm leaning colour bleed on the LE $4.

What's the verdict team?

 

[JeepologyOffroad]

These tests are pretty unreliable iirc

 

[joeyshin]

They look like two different colours to me honestly, but it's not a flagrant reaction. What's the verdict team?

View attachment 1695236

dude you got shrek ears or something??

 

[Rockrash]

They look like two different colours to me honestly, but it's not a flagrant reaction.

I didn't scrape/sand the chip, but I'm leaning colour bleed on the LE $4.

What's the verdict team?

View attachment 1695236

Doesn't look like anything to worry about its darker but no where near the detected purple color.

Besides the only leaded chip id wash my hands after playing with is this one.

 

[Minus]

I would wash the chip thoroughly and retest. When these were live, they were constantly in contact with a bunch of other chips that we know were leaded.
And maybe only swab the yellow wedges if you're worried about color bleed giving false positive.

 

[TripleRangeMerger]

I would wash the chip thoroughly and retest. When these were live, they were constantly in contact with a bunch of other chips that we know were leaded.
And maybe only swab the yellow wedges if you're worried about color bleed giving false positive.

Both great suggestions, thanks. I just updated the OP with the test results after doing this.

Going by the responses above this should crash the market price of these chips.

 

[BarrieJ3]

Going by the responses above this should crash the market price of these chips.

Dibs.