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Have Chinese cards mold replica sets gone too far? (6 Viewers)

I feel like this has to be said somewhere in all the negativity

Talking crap about budget chips that some folks can only afford just isn't cool
 
https://www.wmur.com/article/salem-new-hampshire-poker-room-fake-poker-chips/64945151
More counterfeit chips. The article says “home made” but I’d be surprised if they weren’t Chinese imports. I’ve never actually played there (no tournaments) so I’m not sure if they’re using ceramics or plastics.
IMG_3282.png
 
upNdown said:
https://www.wmur.com/article/salem-new-hampshire-poker-room-fake-poker-chips/64945151
More counterfeit chips. The article says “home made” but I’d be surprised if they weren’t Chinese imports. I’ve never actually played there (no tournaments) so I’m not sure if they’re using ceramics or plastics.
View attachment 1517612
Click to expand...
They appear to be high-end plastics. click image on this reddit post for the high-res view:
https://www.reddit.com/r/chipporn/comments/ptmlzn/25_chasers_poker_room_salem_nh_in_for_500_out_for
 
Colquhoun said:
They appear to be high-end plastics. click image on this reddit post for the high-res view:
https://www.reddit.com/r/chipporn/comments/ptmlzn/25_chasers_poker_room_salem_nh_in_for_500_out_for
Click to expand...
I’m not sure I’d say high end. Zoom in and look at the edge corners. They have varying degrees of bevel. (Or possibly some are beveled and some aren’t.) I don’t have enough experience with high end plastics to know if that’s common. But I’ve seen it in China clays.
 
Colquhoun said:
They appear to be high-end plastics. click image on this reddit post for the high-res view:
https://www.reddit.com/r/chipporn/comments/ptmlzn/25_chasers_poker_room_salem_nh_in_for_500_out_for
Click to expand...

upNdown said:
I’m not sure I’d say high end. Zoom in and look at the edge corners. They have varying degrees of bevel. (Or possibly some are beveled and some aren’t.) I don’t have enough experience with high end plastics to know if that’s common. But I’ve seen it in China clays.
Click to expand...
They are Matsui chips.
 
davislane said:
They are Matsui chips.
Click to expand...
IMG_3285.jpeg

So what’s the deal with the difference in beveled edges? I don’t think I’ve ever even handled matsui samples, but I’ve always believed them to be high end.

I have owned matsui plaques and they were stunning. Chasers’ $100 plaques don’t look like those, but maybe they offer different kinds of plaques?
 
upNdown said:
View attachment 1517661
So what’s the deal with the difference in beveled edges? I don’t think I’ve ever even handled matsui samples, but I’ve always believed them to be high end.
Click to expand...
There isnt a difference. Its a lighting issue. My local casino used this exact same mold for many years.
https://chipguide.themogh.org/cg_chip2.php?id=AUPNTS&sort=type
upNdown said:
I have owned matsui plaques and they were stunning. Chasers’ $100 plaques don’t look like those, but maybe they offer different kinds of plaques?
Click to expand...
Those are a more economical plaque option availble. I have some manufacturing samples of this type. @Pinball made a set with these also.

https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/100x-matsui-marble-plaques.124106/
 
The newer Matsui plaques are like this. I have seen Matsui-type knockoffs on Alibaba though.
 
The answer is still yes.

As a collectors/fan/hobbyist site I’m shocked @Tommy allows vendors to sell direct rip offs of historical and live chip sets using the same inlays and colors. Unless that’s a violation of TOS?

Can people do it? Sure, but why offer a marketplace for it and allow for it on pcf. Not good for the hobby imho. Way more egregious than thread crapping.

I’m a fan of tributes. Change the inlay up at minimal and have fun with it. But a direct inlay and chip edge spot is BS.
 
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doublebooyah85 said:
The answer is still yes.

As a collectors/fan/hobbyist site I’m shocked @Tommy allows vendors to sell direct rip offs of historical and live chip sets using the same inlays and colors. Unless that’s a violation of TOS?

Can people do it? Sure, but why offer a marketplace for it and allow for it on pcf. Not good for the hobby imho. Way more egregious than thread crapping.

I’m a fan of tributes. Change the inlay up at minimal and have fun with it. But a direct inlay and chip edge spot is BS.
Click to expand...
1750200255209.gif
 
doublebooyah85 said:
The answer is still yes.

As a collectors/fan/hobbyist site I’m shocked @Tommy allows vendors to sell direct rip offs of historical and live chip sets using the same inlays and colors. Unless that’s a violation of TOS?

Can people do it? Sure, but why offer a marketplace for it and allow for it on pcf. Not good for the hobby imho. Way more egregious than thread crapping.

I’m a fan of tributes. Change the inlay up at minimal and have fun with it. But a direct inlay and chip edge spot is BS.
Click to expand...
1750202592747.gif
 
doublebooyah85 said:
The answer is still yes.

As a collectors/fan/hobbyist site I’m shocked @Tommy allows vendors to sell direct rip offs of historical and live chip sets using the same inlays and colors. Unless that’s a violation of TOS?

Can people do it? Sure, but why offer a marketplace for it and allow for it on pcf. Not good for the hobby imho. Way more egregious than thread crapping.

I’m a fan of tributes. Change the inlay up at minimal and have fun with it. But a direct inlay and chip edge spot is BS.
Click to expand...

It's not his responsibility to filter content when everyone here can tell the difference. If someone on this site was trying to sell the replicas as 'real', that would obviously not be allowed, and where Tommy's responsibility becomes a factor.

I do realize from past experience that when these change hands, they may end up with a seller that claims they are real and will be asking 'real' prices. So someone could get scammed if they don't know better.

The closest example I can think of: I was part of a TR King GB for Kings Crown chips around 20 years ago. An eBay seller got a hold of a few racks and was claiming they were real. I emailed him advising I was part of the GB and they weren't real. Of course, he insisted they were and that I was incorrect. Just have to shake your head and move on. At least they were real TR King.

So sure, buyer beware. China doesn't care if you get scammed. I do think it's a bit over the line copying a chip appearance exactly. Though if the MFG is allowing it, I just cringe and move on. Is it illegal? 100%. If you don't like it, get a lawyer and try to file a lawsuit. Meanwhile, thinking of getting some custom Tina chips made. They will not be replicas.

Side note: My jaw did drop when the fake molds started appearing. Wouldn't stop me from using them though. Cap dash is one of the molds I'm considering, though I'll probably go with the Greek Key mold.
 
warewulf said:
It's not his responsibility to filter content when everyone here can tell the difference. If someone on this site was trying to sell the replicas as 'real', that would obviously not be allowed, and where Tommy's responsibility becomes a factor.

I do realize from past experience that when these change hands, they may end up with a seller that claims they are real and will be asking 'real' prices. So someone could get scammed if they don't know better.

The closest example I can think of: I was part of a TR King GB for Kings Crown chips around 20 years ago. An eBay seller got a hold of a few racks and was claiming they were real. I emailed him advising I was part of the GB and they weren't real. Of course, he insisted they were and that I was incorrect. Just have to shake your head and move on. At least they were real TR King.

So sure, buyer beware. China doesn't care if you get scammed. I do think it's a bit over the line copying a chip appearance exactly. Though if the MFG is allowing it, I just cringe and move on. If you don't like it, get a lawyer and try to file a lawsuit. Meanwhile, thinking of getting some custom Tina chips made. They will not be replicas.
Click to expand...
I personally don't care at all, but I see the point. Not from a Tommy/admin/mod legality aspect, but just common sense.

This is still a small group/hobby. A very, very, tiny % of humans own 99% of all collectible worth chip sets in existence.

This place exists because (I don't have first hand experience) the other place sucked and people wanted a new place to attend. This was created and here we are.

There are a handful of chippers who have well over $100k in chip sets. There are people buying/selling $10k+ chipsets to eachother every week. We are inviting online acquaintances to our house.

These are facts. It's a small, small hobby with extremely active people who have invested in their hobby an extreme amount of money, time, etc.

Also facts are that we cannot discuss publicly any moderation. There are no set rules in place, outside of an extremely murky TOS that is utilized as a reference point at will. I'm not necessarily against it personally, but it's an extreme laissez faire form of oversight, unless you make it on to the watch list as it were.

Asking for some form of protection isn't crazy. I don't think anyone is in the wrong in any party, but I do think there's 2 sides. Obviously mods will never make everyone happy, it's a thankless job. But chippers can still make note of things they think are noteworthy and should be considered on a common sense basis.

This site is attended to, ran well in objective measurements, and not dumb in their give aways, branding, etc. The one thing it doesn't seem to do well is any form of transparency at all, and building a relationship between moderation and members. Is that enough to one day spell doom for PCF? I highly doubt it. But doesn't mean folks won't clamor for it.

(I mean we have vendors who are selling the same things as other vendors at $0.01 less to claim they have the lowest prices on site. So...are we really concerned about the value/issues vendors are bringing? https://www.pokerchipforum.com/forums/burn-card-shop.195/)
 
Last edited:
BarrieJ3 said:
I personally don't care at all, but I see the point. Not from a Tommy/admin/mod legality aspect, but just common sense.

This is still a small group/hobby. A very, very, tiny % of humans own 99% of all collectible worth chip sets in existence.

This place exists because (I don't have first hand experience) the other place sucked and people wanted a new place to attend. This was created and here we are.

There are a handful of chippers who have well over $100k in chip sets. There are people buying/selling $10k+ chipsets to eachother every week. We are inviting online acquaintances to our house.

These are facts. It's a small, small hobby with extremely active people who have invested in their hobby an extreme amount of money, time, etc.

Also facts are that we cannot discuss publicly any moderation. There are no set rules in place, outside of an extremely murky TOS that is utilized as a reference point at will. I'm not necessarily against it personally, but it's an extreme laissez faire form of oversight, unless you make it on to the watch list as it were.

Asking for some form of protection isn't crazy. I don't think anyone is in the wrong in any party, but I do think there's 2 sides. Obviously mods will never make everyone happy, it's a thankless job. But chippers can still make note of things they think are noteworthy and should be considered on a common sense basis.

This site is attended to, ran well in objective measurements, and not dumb in their give aways, branding, etc. The one thing it doesn't seem to do well is any form of transparency at all, and building a relationship between moderation and members. Is that enough to one day spell doom for PCF? I highly doubt it. But doesn't mean folks won't clamor for it.

(I mean we have vendors who are selling the same things as other vendors at $0.01 less to claim they have the lowest prices on site. So...are we really concerned about the value/issues vendors are bringing? https://www.pokerchipforum.com/forums/burn-card-shop.195/)
Click to expand...
 
Last edited by a moderator:
BarrieJ3 said:
I personally don't care at all, but I see the point. Not from a Tommy/admin/mod legality aspect, but just common sense.

This is still a small group/hobby. A very, very, tiny % of humans own 99% of all collectible worth chip sets in existence.

This place exists because (I don't have first hand experience) the other place sucked and people wanted a new place to attend. This was created and here we are.

There are a handful of chippers who have well over $100k in chip sets. There are people buying/selling $10k+ chipsets to eachother every week. We are inviting online acquaintances to our house.

These are facts. It's a small, small hobby with extremely active people who have invested in their hobby an extreme amount of money, time, etc.

Also facts are that we cannot discuss publicly any moderation. There are no set rules in place, outside of an extremely murky TOS that is utilized as a reference point at will. I'm not necessarily against it personally, but it's an extreme laissez faire form of oversight, unless you make it on to the watch list as it were.

Asking for some form of protection isn't crazy. I don't think anyone is in the wrong in any party, but I do think there's 2 sides. Obviously mods will never make everyone happy, it's a thankless job. But chippers can still make note of things they think are noteworthy and should be considered on a common sense basis.

This site is attended to, ran well in objective measurements, and not dumb in their give aways, branding, etc. The one thing it doesn't seem to do well is any form of transparency at all, and building a relationship between moderation and members. Is that enough to one day spell doom for PCF? I highly doubt it. But doesn't mean folks won't clamor for it.

(I mean we have vendors who are selling the same things as other vendors at $0.01 less to claim they have the lowest prices on site. So...are we really concerned about the value/issues vendors are bringing? https://www.pokerchipforum.com/forums/burn-card-shop.195/)
Click to expand...
It was unfortunate @Tommy kicked out the dude selling the real Rio wsop chips for violating TOS…my guess was he wouldn’t register as vendor status? But we allow other people to sell fake Rio chips lol
 
doublebooyah85 said:
It was unfortunate @Tommy kicked out the dude selling the real Rio wsop chips for violating TOS…my guess was he wouldn’t register as vendor status? But we allow other people to sell fake Rio chips lol
Click to expand...
I know nothing of this. That would've been dope to have them here. I don't know anything regarding the Rio's except some guy selling them online somewhere and diff people working diff information out of them. Will have to wait til a local game or meetup to get the deets.

But crazy to know that he was even here as a member!
 
Zmasterben said:
Chipthechipguy

A.K.A. my chipping best friend for two months

View attachment 1523971

/Pours one out for chipthchipguy
Click to expand...
So cool to finally know how these came about. Appreciate you sharing that messaging.

If that's the majority of the truth, that's pretty crazy. I mean we're talking about acquanitences/friends making 10s of thousands of dollars (hundred? I have no clue who has what sets and such) off eachother. Plus 2 guys that would hand all those chips off without googling? Phew, who knows maybe he told them and did a solid deal for all parties.

Transparency is amazing, thanks again.
 
Are tournament chips subject to the same procedures of destruction/dispensation as cash chips under Nevada Gaming law?
If so, wouldn't these chips need to be accounted for by someone?
 
It's the ultimate NIMBY that cares and complains about other people buying replica poker chips as an alternative to spending hundreds of dollars for a single barrel of some used casino chips. Talk about first world problems.
 
Colquhoun said:
Are tournament chips subject to the same procedures of destruction/dispensation as cash chips under Nevada Gaming law?
If so, wouldn't these chips need to be accounted for by someone?
Click to expand...

The general consensus among the 'amateur Nevada Gaming law but actually have no clue what they are actually talking about' lawyers is probably no but casinos still destroy them to be safe or because they don't understand the rules.

But even if they are, how would they do a full verification? The RIO WSOP chips released (so far) to the public probably make up around 1% of the total numbers.

People walk out of casinos with cash chips and never return them every day. I doubt they verify or ask for audits on every single cash chip ever ordered. I'm sure even if they were involved the Vegas Gaming Commission was satisfied with the numbers destroyed.
 
Zmasterben said:
The general consensus among the 'amateur Nevada Gaming law but actually have no clue what they are actually talking about' lawyers is probably no but casinos still destroy them to be safe or because they don't understand the rules.

But even if they are, how would they do a full verification? The RIO WSOP chips released (so far) to the public probably make up around 1% of the total numbers.

People walk out of casinos with cash chips and never return them every day. I doubt they verify or ask for audits on every single cash chip ever ordered. I'm sure even if they were involved the Vegas Gaming Commission was satisfied with the numbers destroyed.
Click to expand...
We know several thousand of them made it out, but it just isn’t easy transporting chips. Unless a seasoned vet like @TheChipRoom @The Chip Exchange acquired them, how many totes can you really fill up and carry without opening yourself up to theft etc and getting caught.
 

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