In Search of an Optimal Default Cash Breakdown (2 Viewers)

[FestiveKnight]

I propose the following: There is a 500-chip breakdown default for cash games that fits the vast majority of games.

This default functions to cover most game/stake combinations, agnostic to dollar amounts and can be pushed down the throats of noobs without needing to re-litigate the merits of different breakdowns each time.

I propose the Optimal Breakdown is 100/200/180/20 for every stake for all default cash games (e.g. if you play 500bb deep stacks for 50 hours straight and your whales never stop rebuying, this isn't for you, but please invite me)

One Thing I am Ignoring: Starting stacks don't matter that much, as they become irrelevant the moment cards actually start flying. Sorry folks, focus on your food, drink, and music selection before worrying about 8/8/6/3 vs 8/6/7/4 or whatever

Some Assumptions about Denoms:

The smallest denom always = 1 Big Blind. We always (rightfully) encourage folks that 10¢/10¢ is better than 5¢/10¢ anyways and I am ignoring $2/$5 because well people playing those stakes can afford more chips and don't need my slick tidy breakdown.

On to the rigorous math that proves me right beyond all shadow of a doubt:

Assume: we care only that the floor is above a necessary threshold, any larger bank is just upside.

So the floor equals 100BB + 800BB + 2880BB + 1280BB = 5060BB

Is that enough? I think a default "enough" is for each player to be able to rebuy at least 3 times at a reasonable number of BB. The table below shows, at the intersection of each Player Count and BB per Buy-in, how many times the entire table can rebuy, rounded down, using 5060 total BB.

Overall, I think this chart proves the hypothesis of the breakdown. 3 full rebuys of 150BB for up to 9 players feels good enough to be a "default." Uses cases that need above that deviate from the norm (IMO). This is also with the 5060 floor, and some denominations using 100/200/180/20 will actually have more.

So there. Search complete. 5 gold stars to Festive. 100/200/180/20 is the way. Send noobs here

 

[upNdown]

This is fine. I'd say it's the minimum numbers to be comfortably playable for a 9-10 player big bet game.

 

[BarrieJ3]

So for a $1/$1 game, the bank is $5060?

I don’t play big boy stakes or tables, but don’t people super duper regularly have stacks on the table of $6-1200?

Like first hand 3 way all in, someone has 12%+ of the entire bank in front of them

Idk if I’m reading it right, but feels low. I get the minimalist approach, but if the point is ease and standardization, feels like adding another rack is much easier than never k king if your chips will cover if it’s a “big” night.

 

[caballo993]

So for a $1/$1 game, the bank is $5060?

I don’t play big boy stakes or tables, but don’t people super duper regularly have stacks on the table of $6-1200?

Like first hand 3 way all in, someone has 12%+ of the entire bank in front of them

Idk if I’m reading it right, but feels low. I get the minimalist approach, but if the point is ease and standardization, feels like adding another rack is much easier than never k king if your chips will cover if it’s a “big” night.

$6,700 or $7,500, depending on $20s or $25s. Which comes out to 8-9% in your scenario, which I'm sure would bomb most banks.

A 600 BB pot would need 12K BB just to stay under 5%, which is twice as much as the standard recommendation. So the only way to get around that is to avoid playing with maniacs, buy moar chips, or accept that it's bound to happen once in a while.

 

[FestiveKnight]

So for a $1/$1 game, the bank is $5060?

I don’t play big boy stakes or tables, but don’t people super duper regularly have stacks on the table of $6-1200?

Like first hand 3 way all in, someone has 12%+ of the entire bank in front of them

Idk if I’m reading it right, but feels low. I get the minimalist approach, but if the point is ease and standardization, feels like adding another rack is much easier than never k king if your chips will cover if it’s a “big” night.

if you play 500bb deep stacks for 50 hours straight and your whales never stop rebuying

^ sure, even if two players have $1k stacks your other 6 players have enough bank for $500 each. I don’t see the “default” game getting there. How many folks who regularly host with a “regular” meta are seeing more than 5k blinds in play

 

[MC_CPA]

This one works for $0.01/$0.02 up to $0.25/$0.25 I think. $100 bills play.

 

[BarrieJ3]

$6,700 or $7,500, depending on $20s or $25s. Which comes out to 8-9% in your scenario, which I'm sure would bomb most banks.

A 600 BB pot would need 12K BB just to stay under 5%, which is twice as much as the standard recommendation. So the only way to get around that is to avoid playing with maniacs, buy moar chips, or accept that it's bound to happen once in a while.

^ sure, even if two players have $1k stacks your other 6 players have enough bank for $500 each. I don’t see the “default” game getting there. How many folks who regularly host with a “regular” meta are seeing more than 5k blinds in play

Heard! It’s prob just a super small sample size on my end, I don’t play a ton.

From the different games I’ve been able to get to since joining PCF, that was kinda the default.

For a couple year period, games always had someone jamming all in pre no look until they at least got rid of first buy in, so without even any big pots you might be around 1500+ big blinds across 8 people to “start” the night 20 mins in.