HHR Historic Wolford Longhorn Set - opinions on breakdown and relabel (1 Viewer)

[GreekRedEye]

I picked up this set:
https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/historic-hhr-set-now-1500-obo.110812/

Would love opinions on:

1. My proposed color and denom breakdown
2. My relabel design (for the non-historic chips)
3. Should I relabel both sides or one side?
4. Whether you think I should clean the historic chips
5. I am looking for racks of used whites and yellows and small numbers of orange and black. Please PM if you have some to sell.

Breakdown
This will be a two table cash set ranging from 5c/5c to $1/$2. Limit options with 25c and $1 workhorses. What do you think of:
black=5c, orange=25c, white=$1, yellow=$5, green=$20, red=$100, blue=probably will not use.

Note that I think the orange and red look pretty similar in real life, so I am trying to assign values that are unlikely to be on the table together.

Relabel
I want printed denoms. About half the set are already relabels, so I have no qualms replacing those. The original/historic will be preserved (except for about 5% or so that are popping off already). If I can find used whites and yellows, I can avoid murdering the green label Arlington Racecourse.

I already relabeled a sample below. What do you think of the design? Should I relabel one side or both sides? Do you prefer the smaller longhorn (same as the original label) or the bigger one you see on $5 and $100 chips?

 

[GreekRedEye]

I have made some decisions:

• Aside from a handful of samples, I am going to clean the historic chips. Convince me otherwise.
• I will relabel one side only (on the non-historic chips).
• I am using the smaller longhorn logo (like the 5c and 25c)
• I sold off the Arlington Racecourse chips to someone who will love them without murdering them (although that puts me in a harder spot).

If I can't get more whites and yellows, I may rethink the break down. Here is my current wanted ad:
https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/hhr-with-labels-on-or-removed-yellow-and-white-mostly.113334/

 

[GreekRedEye]

The original purchase is this breakdown:

Original chips (historic)

• 97 x red
• 297 x white
• 791 x orange

Add-ons chips (not historic)

• 37 x red
• 132 x white
• 0 x orange
• 283 x Green
• 195 x Black
• 48 x Yellow

I have a few barrels of hotstamped white and yellow that I might mill and add if I can't find already labeled.

 

[GreekRedEye]

I am thinking about taking this in a new direction. Probably where I should have gone first. And probably closer to how this set was originally used. What do you think about splitting this into 2 sets like so?

NL
yellow = 25c (100 count)
white = $1 (300 or 400 count)
red = $5 (120 currently, but I am acquiring more)
green = $25 or $20 (200)
black = $100 (100 count)

Limit
orange = workhorse (800 count)
solid blues and/or spotted HHRs for value chips

Other option is to split these into 2 NL sets, using the oranges as $5. I would probably keep one set and sell off the other if I did this.

 

[GreekRedEye]

I should have mentioned I don't have the Arlington Racecourse chips you see in the photo any more.

 

[Machine]

depending on how large your game is, you would get more mileage out of swapping the yellow and orange chips, and if you're going to do that I would also swap the black and red denoms.

I am however a fan of yellow 5s

a second look at it, I would swap the orange to be a 5, the yellow to be a 20, and the green to be the .25, black to 100, and red to .05

 

[GreekRedEye]

depending on how large your game is, you would get more mileage out of swapping the yellow and orange chips, and if you're going to do that I would also swap the black and red denoms.

I am however a fan of yellow 5s

a second look at it, I would swap the orange to be a 5, the yellow to be a 20, and the green to be the .25, black to 100, and red to .05

Thanks. This arrangement would work. I had not considered the greens as anything other than $20/$25.

I don't want the oranges and reds seeing a lot of felt time together, since they are hard to distinguish. But I can't toss the reds as they are originals. Making reds the 5c and oranges the $5 would work, since in a 5c/10c game very few if any $5s would make it to the table.

 

[GreekRedEye]

Okay, I think I FINALLY figured out how to organize this and give 3 people the chance to own playable sets with original/historic chips.

I will definitely sell the tourney set. Not sure if I'm keeping the limit or NL set (leaning limit). I may also split off a couple sample sets of originals. Might even frame them. If anyone is interested, give me a PM.

Also...I could use more solid reds! Preferably worn with a label (on or removed).

Set 1 - Base T25 STT (12/12/3/7/x)
120 Green = T25
140 Black = T100
40 Orange = T500 (all historic)
120 White = T1000 (mix of historic and add-ons)
40 Blue = T5000
10 Red = T25k (all historic)
20 spotted = bounties

Set 2 - Cash NL
100 Yellow = 25c
300 white = $1 (mix of historic and add-ons)
300 red = $5 (mix of historic and add-ons)
160 green = $25
40 black = $100
10 orange = $500 (all historic)

Set 3B - Limit (if split from NL, colored to give owner historic chips of all colors)
720 Orange = workhorse (all historic)
70 white = 20x value chip (all historic)
10 red = 100x value chip (all historic)

 

[GreekRedEye]

I am continuing to make progress on this set.

I was just about to start cleaning the historic chips when I started to get second thoughts. I need some other opinions. Is it a bad idea to clean the original, authentic chips? Note that I intend to keep a set of 10 chips of each color untouched and uncleaned.

A little background on the person whose chips these are.
https://lasvegassun.com/news/2003/may/15/colorful-poker-player-wolford-dies/
https://www.pokernews.com/news/2016/03/history-and-high-stakes-in-big-d-24074.htm

Here are examples of dirty and then clean after using Simple Green + toothbrush + vinegar/salt bath. Visually and tactilely, the clean are better.

 

[Coyote]

Clean them all and keep them all without any attempt of altering them. In ANY fuckin way.
Solved.

 

[GreekRedEye]

Clean them all and keep them all without any attempt of altering them. In ANY fuckin way.
Solved.

I am not altering originals. But I am adding on some chips I milled and considering relabeling the existing infills.

I go back and forth. Right now I am thinking of dropping tourney idea keeping it as one cash NL set and one limit set:

NL
100 x yellow 25c
500 x white $1
320 x red $5
280 x green $25
160 x black $100
40 x dark blue $500

Limit
780 x orange - workhorse nondenom
20 x light blue with orange spots - value non denom

 

[Coyote]

Bravo. Touch the poor chips as little as possible with your dirty Greek mind

 

[GreekRedEye]

I cleaned 4 racks of newly milled chips and then started in on the historic oranges using simple green. One rack done and, holy cow, the cleaning really faded some of them. I have not seen this level of color change for other HHRs.

Here is a highly bleached one next to an untreated one:

Same chips, but after oiling the one on the right. Much better, but the one on the right is still a shade lighter.

There is some color variation that already exists. Based on texture differences on the labels, I think there are at least 2 if not 3 batches of the originals. It could be that once oiled, I am seeing the natural, batch color differences, but I am also worried I may be damaging these chips. Going to hit pause, let the current batch fully dry, sort them into groups based on labels to see if there is color consistency. Then oil them and see how they look. Afterwards, I will determine how I am going to proceed.

 

[ekricket]

You can’t clean CPC/asm exactly the same way as Paulsons.

 

[GreekRedEye]

You can’t clean CPC/asm exactly the same way as Paulsons.

I used simple green and a vinegar+salt bath successfully before on ASM HHRs:
https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/not-mildew-its-oxidation.110294/

This was simple green only. No vinegar.

 

[GreekRedEye]

I still have a few more barrels to mill. I laid out the chips to make sure the math in my head is working out. I think I will keep this set together, as a giant NL set and an accompanying limit set.

I don't know whether to use the blues as nickels or take the best two barrels and make them $500s (where the two white barrels are nestled among the $25s and $100s). I also have a line on a barrel or two of HHR pinks that I might buy and mill for $500s.

It will look even better once cleaning is finished, labels done, and oil applied. But I am running a bit out of steam. Not sure if I will keep it or list it. I love this set and it is one of a kind, but it is for a much bigger cash game than I expect I will ever run.

A few leftovers:

I also have this set of framed originals (photo from the sale - I can't easily get to the frame right now to photograph it):

 

[GreekRedEye]

After oiling and letting the faded chips set, the color looks good. Whew! That said, if I do clean more, I will stick to dish soap.

I am working on some labels. I'm going to replace the labels on this spotted light blue barrel that are the value chips for the limit set:

Rather than repeat the longhorn silhouette that exists across the set, I thought I might pay tribute to Wolford with the silhouette of a cowboy, and a nod to his roping records he set. What do you all think of these options? (apologies for the jagged look of some of the images, it's a copy paste thing - real labels would be smooth).

Option 1:

Option 2:

Option 3:
(note, this is a silhouette of Wolford himself, from the cover of his book)

Option 4:
Just stick with the longhorn.

 

[Coyote]

option 4. Longhorns are an icon