Home Game And Hyper Competitive Friends (2 Viewers)

[UncleMilty]

Hi friends- My home game is for friends and friends of friends only. Buy in is only $35 per week with 10 to 15 players per week. Am I wrong to insist that it’s a home game that consist of friends annd friends of friends, and that casino rules belong in the casino? I’m not a believer in taking someone’s money for making a simple mistake, or betting out of turn. I do believe that intent and common sense should come in to play, and that keeping it fun for inexperienced players that are intimidated by casino action will keep our weekly game alive. BTW- we’re talking about petty bullshit that I see happen in casinos all the time.

 

[OfficerLovejoy]

Your house, your rules.

That being said, most casino rules came to be because of someone trying to take advantage of another player in a way that seemed unfair.

Personally, I always look for intent in my players actions.
If a total noob makes a mistake, I'll educate them on the rules and why that rule was implemented. Then I ask him what he intended to do and that's what will stand as his action this time.

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

Good questions! Ive seen the pictures and stories, you run a great game.

The strict rules are in place to defend the newer players. It may not feel like that, but they are helpful. I'm not saying you have to be incredibly strict, but it helps to define what one chip means, or limiting string bets.

What are the rules you/your players are worried are too stringent?

 

[BPTDirector]

First infraction is a teaching/learning moment. Second - a little more of a stern reminder. Third - you’re getting a private talk from me. Rules. Without them we’d live with the animals…..

 

[dizzyChipper]

I play private games for not insignificant money. Misclicks are un-wound all the time. Probably once every few weeks.

Usually intent goes a long way"

E.g. at $5-10 limp limp limp raise to $60. Next to act puts out $110 being helpful for change. "Raise" "I just meant to call." Ok...

E.g. player A calls $20. B announces all in and maybe puts in a chip. C is in his phone looks up and throws in $20. "B is all in" "Oh then I fold." At a home game he gets his $20 back and there's no drama.

This happened recently and I started looking for FHC chips to make all in buttons this morning.

The biggest difference in a home game is that its the same people all the time. If its exploitative you can figure it out by who and how often.

I'd say the misclicks are fairly well distibuted. If action passes and depending on money at stake is when its more likely a "Sorry. Your mistake. Other players acted. Live with it."

--DC

 

[Taghkanic]

Some rules exist not just to prevent angling/cheating but for the overall flow and good of the game.

The example of not acting out of turn is one. It can be either an angle, or an innocent mistake that just screws up the action and slows the game down, if it occurs regularly.

So a reason to use many “casino” rules is just to make the game less janky and more enjoyable.

Remembering and adhering to basic rules does not make the game less friendly. If I went to a casual game where a lot of players were acting out of turn, string betting, holding their cards off the table, raising less than the minimum, splashing the pot, hiding their big chips, going south, etc. I would not find it fun… Not because I love pedantic adherence to rules, but because the gameplay would suck.

If players are never reminded of (reasonable) rules and repeat offenders never face consequences, no one is ever going to learn. If the rules are taught and (reasonably) enforced, the game gets better. Over time you don’t have to waste as much energy sorting out messes created by infractions which are ruled out for sensible reasons.

 

[Natskule]

Hi friends- My home game is for friends and friends of friends only. Buy in is only $35 per week with 10 to 15 players per week. Am I wrong to insist that it’s a home game that consist of friends annd friends of friends, and that casino rules belong in the casino? I’m not a believer in taking someone’s money for making a simple mistake, or betting out of turn. I do believe that intent and common sense should come in to play, and that keeping it fun for inexperienced players that are intimidated by casino action will keep our weekly game alive. BTW- we’re talking about petty bullshit that I see happen in casinos all the time.

yes and no.

We do casino rules, but allow exceptions as mistakes happen, nobody in my group wants to win a pot and take some one down for a mistake, we want to outplay them, so things get rewound a bit sometimes when a raise or something gets misheard or missed or whatever.

 

[upNdown]

I'm not sure how you can be hyper-competitive and not be interested in following the rules.
I understand the desire to have some leniency or casualness with friends - nobody wants to be the rules nazi, calling out every perceived string bet. But rules are important, as others have pointed out. It would be one thing if you had an impartial floor person deciding which rules to follow when (and who has the ability to know the intent behind every action.) But if the person making those calls is playing, and happens to be in the hand in question, its not a matter of IF the shit will hit the fan, it's when.

 

[KHarp1]

IF it's friendly, and, IF it's hyper competitive, then the rules are very important. If they haven't come into play yet, they will. When that happens you, and your guests will likely be thankful that you've conveyed what you expect from them (through the rules) and what they can expect from you.

Like most have stated, you don't have to be a rules bully to put good guardrails in place. The friendly home game is a perfect place to kindly educate newer players on what the rules are, and, why they're in place. Doesn't have to be one or the other. I love a friendly home game that had a good set of rules, while also allowing for the occasional misclick.

 

[UncleMilty]

Good questions! Ive seen the pictures and stories, you run a great game.

The strict rules are in place to defend the newer players. It may not feel like that, but they are helpful. I'm not saying you have to be incredibly strict, but it helps to define what one chip means, or limiting string bets.

What are the rules you/your players are worried are too stringent?

If a player tosses a 1k chip in on a 200 call bet with the intent of raising without announcing that, I will remind them that what they did was call the 200 and explain why. I generally stick to that because it doesn’t take any chips from them and it’s easy to move on. However, if someone raises to 1k in front of them and they toss 200 in announcing call, i explain the rule AGAIN , clarify their intent, and let them pull it back. A couple of my peeps don’t like that.

I'm not sure how you can be hyper-competitive and not be interested in following the rules.
I understand the desire to have some leniency or casualness with friends - nobody wants to be the rules nazi, calling out every perceived string bet. But rules are important, as others have pointed out. It would be one thing if you had an impartial floor person deciding which rules to follow when (and who has the ability to know the intent behind every action.) But if the person making those calls is playing, and happens to be in the hand in question, its not a matter of IF the shit will hit the fan, it's when.

I am not the hyper competitive one. It’s a couple of my peeps who are also a very important part of our regular game. I often get called on to make a call. If I’m in the hand I won’t do it.

 

[allforcharity]

I do try to run things in a way that a casino will run them, because I don't want my friends and guests to develop bad habits that they might take to a casino that would get them reprimanded.

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

If a player tosses a 1k chip in on a 200 call bet with the intent of raising without announcing that, I will remind them that what they did was call the 200 and explain why. I generally stick to that because it doesn’t take any chips from them and it’s easy to move on. However, if someone raises to 1k in front of them and they toss 200 in announcing call, i explain the rule AGAIN , clarify their intent, and let them pull it back. A couple of my peeps don’t like that.

I am not the hyper competitive one. It’s a couple of my peeps who are also a very important part of our regular game. I often get called on to make a call. If I’m in the hand I won’t do it.

I don't see having a rule set and sticking to it as hyper-competitive. I think your game is naturally growing: its a fun relaxed social affair but it is also a steady and competitive game. Those are not mutually exclusive!

I think its fair to explain it once or twice but then expect people to pay attention. You can add as much or as little leeway as you would like, but I have found its much easier to run a game where rules are expected and followed versus having to make all kinds of judgement calls and explain it over and over again and ask intent. As a host I want to simplify things and make it so I don't have to make decisions on those actions. Easier to run it correctly and please the competitive peeps while teaching the new players how to play properly, versus running it with very relaxed rules that require more work on your part and annoys more reliable/competitive players.

This also avoids any claim of bias. What if you forget to ask intent when it behooves you? Or if someone else says "are you sure" before a big call/raise? Its not a big deal until it is.

 

[HiveKueen]

I am not the hyper competitive one. It’s a couple of my peeps who are also a very important part of our regular game. I often get called on to make a call. If I’m in the hand I won’t do it.

You need a second player who is assigned to make rules calls cause if you are in the hand you should not be making the call.

 

[Munchies11]

Hi friends- My home game is for friends and friends of friends only. Buy in is only $35 per week with 10 to 15 players per week. Am I wrong to insist that it’s a home game that consist of friends annd friends of friends, and that casino rules belong in the casino? I’m not a believer in taking someone’s money for making a simple mistake, or betting out of turn. I do believe that intent and common sense should come in to play, and that keeping it fun for inexperienced players that are intimidated by casino action will keep our weekly game alive. BTW- we’re talking about petty bullshit that I see happen in casinos all the time.

Yes I’m in agreement with you here. As long as nobody is out of line and keep blatantly making foolish mistakes at the table because they are too drunk or don’t care than there is some empathy tolerated! At my table though beware because of you make a mistake even if you are not punished you will be chirped for it ! lol I’m 36 now so everyone is pretty tamed and knows the rules for the most part have to just live with the odd mistake from your players .

 

[BPTDirector]

My guys have scolded me on minor infractions. I thanked them for doing it. They weren’t gentle either.

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

You guys have scolded me on minor infractions. I thanked them for doing it. They weren’t gentle either.

I had a friend who was learning the ropes and I needed a dealer the next day for a 3 table tournament. I have never been so tough on someone for a little 5c/10c beginner game! But he learned and thanked me afterwards, made quite a bit from pay and tips. "Cry in the dojo, laugh on the battlefield" lol.

 

[Lester86]

A lot of guys at my game like to hold the cars in their hand. I try to tell them leave them on the table.

 

[badbeat37]

like others said, use mistakes as learning moments for the inexperienced players. Enforcement by education rather than ripping them apart. However, if the same players keeps making the same mistake then a talking to may be necessary. I’ve got a player who, once he’s had a few drinks, acts out of turn. I know his intent is not to angle or cheat, he just gets loose and the blinders come on. Usually happens a few times each time we play. Last week he makes it heads up to the river on the button. He rips all in on a Q-Q-Q-5-3 board and gets snap called by the chip leader who has the last Q. Since he has been warned numerous times we honour the wagers and he learned an expensive lesson.

 

[Jimulacrum]

First infraction is a teaching/learning moment. Second - a little more of a stern reminder. Third - you’re getting a private talk from me. Rules. Without them we’d live with the animals…..

This is how I feel, in a broad stroke. No need to play "Gotcha!" when newbs mess up on rules they don't get, but the rules should still be enforced on some level. In a friendly game, there's nothing with confirming intent when it's unclear or letting people get away with innocent fumbles, but with the goal of eventually getting players to the point where they internalize standard casino-style rules.

I often get called on to make a call. If I’m in the hand I won’t do it.

Failing to make a call is in a sense making a call.

It's obviously not ideal to be in a hand when making a call that could affect you; it's one of the major downsides to hosting while playing. This is a great case for how clear, consistently enforced rules keep things fair and moving. It keeps you from having to truly make a decision in most situations. You instead fall back on the rule and implement it exactly as written. Routine rules like how to managed exposed cards during the deal are good examples of this.

Typically, if my own hand is affected by a potential judgment call I have to make, I lean toward ruling against myself, all else being equal. I also tend to fold marginal hands in situations where weirdness has happened so that I'm free to make whatever decisions are necessary without conflict.

If for whatever reason I were to have to recuse myself, I could see maybe putting it to a vote of the other players, but TBH I'm not a huge believer in democratic decision-making at the poker table, outside of preferential choices.

 

[Locria]

If you're the host, its ultimately up to you.( your house your rules, although any deviation from traditional poker rule/etiquette should be brought up before hand)
As someone who hosts games myself I do think it sometimes feels kind of bad/awkward to have to educate friends on etiquette or proper rules (string betting, acting out of turn, talking about their hand while people are still in the hand) but in the end I think its better for the game in the long run. Having people get burned due to actions[talking about hands during the hand, string betting, bet out of line] that you let go would be much much worse in my opinion

 

[Wils]

You need a second player who is assigned to make rules calls cause if you are in the hand you should not be making the call.

I know this is a late reply, but what I do is have a WhatsApp group to manage invites etc, and within that group I have a link to a Google Drive document which is basically the TDA Rules 2024.

If I change those rules to make them more applicable to my home game, I add comments into the document to say what I've done, and I notify everyone that there is a change.

They think I'm an autistic dick, of course, because "it's only a friendly home game" but one day I'll be in a hand that I'm also adjudicating, and so there MUST be some higher authority, higher even than the players and the host, that can't be denied.