Would you give back extra chips? (1 Viewer)

[JustinInMN]

A couple stories come to mind.

A few years back I posted in a 3/6 game early on a Saturday morning (before 3rd shift ended) at my regular club. Chip runner was being a bit slow so dealer lent me 40 from the tray. Make quads won a big pot, chips I bought came as I was being pushed the pot and I completely forgot about the 40 I owed.

Dealer's shift ended about an hour later, floor person (who I know is honest) came to let me know what happened, offered to show me on surveillance if needed, but I didn't find that necessary. I let him rack up the 40 without thinking about it.

A few months ago new guy sits in my game buys in for 60, dealer lends him 20 to start while awaiting the runner. Guy wins a small pot on the flop. Doesn't think he owes the 20 because of how few chips he netted in the pot. Floor had to get involved and everyone else on the game knew the dealer was right. Floor compelled him to pay the dealer back and player got up. Not sure if he was asked to leave but that's my guess.

I don't remember the details in this last story, but I was deep in a tournament after the second color up (100s), I bought up the small chips and the td accidentally gave me two extra yellows (maybe she was thinking purple's or something). I corrected the mistake and she thanked me and called me a "very honest player" the complement alone, aside from doing the right thing meant more to me than winning the tournament. (If I remember right I think I got to 5th or 6th.)

Bottom line as honorable gamblers it's our obligation to point out mistakes, even if to our disadvantage. People already look down on gamblers fairly or not. We do not need to play into that by taking advantage of correctable mistakes. We need to always conduct ourselves with honor, it's better for the health of our games if we keep our word and play honestly at all times.

 

[JustinInMN]

And I’m not sure this is a totally black and white issue. What hasn’t been discussed is why I walked away from that window with too many chips. Shame on me for not counting those chips at the window, but I was a little bit buzzed and I just wanted to get to the table.

It's a black and white issue because you noticed the mistake you should fix instead of making other people fix it. It's far better for your image and rep that the few extra chips on your pocket.

Now if a player were too drunk to count, I might entertain the notion that the casino should not be letting such players sit in the first place and maybe that liability is on them. But that wasn't the case in the original post.

 

[Lemonzest]

Absolutely none. Totally businesslike. He asked a few questions to make sure he got it right, thanked me, and took the chips. (And though I got a thank you out of him, he didn't act greatful, or even friendly. But he's not the most personable of guys - I've seen him joke around a bit, but mostly he's all business all the time.

maybe he was embarressed about making such a simple mistake.

 

[Thomacetti]

Life is often easier, better when you take the honest route

DrStrange

So true !
What goes around comes around

 

[Poker Zombie]

There is only one instance where It's acceptable to keep the surprise money...

Your integrity is commendable. You have a standing open invitation at the Zombie Poker Club.

 

[Wils]

Give it back, but make a complaint to her boss that she's incompetent.

Kind of evens out the good karma/bad karma a bit.

 

[CraigT78]

Curious - what if you happen to notice a chip runner give $40 extra to the player adjacent to you? Do you say anything now?

 

[upNdown]

Give it back, but make a complaint to her boss that she's incompetent.

Kind of evens out the good karma/bad karma a bit.

Right? I guess I could have walked then back to the window. Didn’t really think of that.

 

[upNdown]

Curious - what if you happen to notice a chip runner give $40 extra to the player adjacent to you? Do you say anything now?

No. None of my business.
If an error is made at the table, we all ha e the responsibility to speak up. But I think that is something different.

 

[Nex]

Curious - what if you happen to notice a chip runner give $40 extra to the player adjacent to you? Do you say anything now?

I'd just sit and watch.
Not my business, and I know what will inevitably happen in any case.

 

[JustinInMN]

Curious - what if you happen to notice a chip runner give $40 extra to the player adjacent to you? Do you say anything now?

I 100% would, I care more about protecting the chip-runner than a fellow player.

I'm curious @Nex, what would you perceive is the downside of speaking up?

 

[Lemonzest]

lets say you are playing in a big boy game. 100/200. You buy in for 200k but realize you ended up with an extra 20k. You have 4 extra 5k chips the cage gave you but now you are sitting at the table...

What do we do?

 

[DJ Mack]

Curious - what if you happen to notice a chip runner give $40 extra to the player adjacent to you? Do you say anything now?

If I was 100% confident in what I'd seen then yes I would. Probably in an offhanded way "Whoa, didn't you only ask for $200?" Maybe even joke about getting in on the special bonus offer.

However I find it taxing enough to keep track of the actual card play than to completely focus on other player's transactions involving people not at the table. I might have misheard the order or didn't notice him request a different amount after the initial amount was stated. I probably also didn't watch his currency being counted out. On the other hand if I ask for $200 and get $240 I know there's a mistake.

 

[upNdown]

lets say you are playing in a big boy game. 100/200. You buy in for 200k but realize you ended up with an extra 20k. You have 4 extra 5k chips the cage gave you but now you are sitting at the table...

What do we do?

I’ll never know

 

[WedgeRock]

Curious - what if you happen to notice a chip runner give $40 extra to the player adjacent to you? Do you say anything now?

No. None of my business.
If an error is made at the table, we all ha e the responsibility to speak up. But I think that is something different.

What if you stack him on the first hand and now your stack is $20 heavy?

 

[Nex]

I'm curious @Nex, what would you perceive is the downside of speaking up?

I'm taking away his chance of making his own decision about how to handle the event, which would probably aggravate him, more or less. (Speaking up and making the matter table-public, I'd pretty much put him on the spot)
Last thing I want at the table is a guy that's pissed off specifically about me, who then lets no chance slip to give me a rough time.

I rather have him get pissed off by the casino guys.

 

[JustinInMN]

I guess I don't agree, you aren't harming him by trying to correct this. If you do it without sounding accusatory it shouldn't aggravate anyone.

 

[Poker Zombie]

Curious - what if you happen to notice a chip runner give $40 extra to the player adjacent to you? Do you say anything now?

If I am alert enough to notice how much someone else reloaded for, then I am exceeding my natural levels of observation. I would attempt to read his mind next, because that is just as likely a possibility.

I would however notice if he was delivered a double instead of a normal shot. My powers of observation are truly special, but limited.

I would not point out that he was poured too much. That one is between the bartender and his liver.

 

[Nex]

I guess I don't agree, you aren't harming him by trying to correct this. If you do it without sounding accusatory it shouldn't aggravate anyone.

Tact is a weakness of mine; but even if that wasn't the case, there will always be that guy that gets the wrong end of the stick.

 

[navels]

reminds me of

 

[rimmerryan]

Agree with OP... give it back.
I’ve done more times than I can think of in restaurants/fast food, where the cashiers can’t make change properly cause they are used to credit card payments! Give it back every time!

Also done it with chip sales too!
Accidentally overcharged @bluegill in a deal back on CT for some PNYers back in the day cause I added wrong. Caught it and immediately sent a refund for over charge back !!! Gotta do what’s right.

 

[justsomedude]

When I sat down at the table and took them out of the rack, I realized it. But I suppose if I was really drunk, I could have just started firing chips into the pot without ever realizing it. Would that make me a criminal?

There are some threads on 2+2 that address overpayments, with the general assessment being that - on a technical/legal level - casinos are private property and anything you take beyond the proper amount is considered theft. That said, most cages will work with you to get the overpaid funds returned. It's only if you refuse to repay that the authorities will get involved.

There are stories over there of casinos sending out demand letters after reviewing cashier balances (that ended up short) and cage security footage. I can't find the exact thread, but I remember reading some one getting a demand letter for as little as $40.

The correct move is to always return an overpayment, lest you want to end up on a casino ban list.

 

[WedgeRock]

I realized she’d given me an extra barrel of $2s.

OP leaves out important details that help arrive at the answer... THC? RHC?

On a seriois note, if you'd raise the issue of you were ahorted, then the proper thing to do would be to raise it when overpaid.

 

[upNdown]

There are some threads on 2+2 that address overpayments, with the general assessment being that - on a technical/legal level - casinos are private property and anything you take beyond the proper amount is considered theft. That said, most cages will work with you to get the overpaid funds returned. It's only if you refuse to repay that the authorities will get involved.

There are stories over there of casinos sending out demand letters after reviewing cashier balances (that ended up short) and cage security footage. I can't find the exact thread, but I remember reading some one getting a demand letter for as little as $40.

The correct move is to always return an overpayment, lest you want to end up on a casino ban list.

Seems about right. I can see a casino giving a guy too many chips, winning them back, then suing him for their value. Because as I alluded to above, they're c***s.

 

[Chris La Mantia]

Glad to see so many people like this here.

I just bought a camera flash trigger on eBay for $30 listed as working. The power switch was obviously, physically broken, so clearly that they didn't even try it. I was not a happy camper. But when I pointed it out, they instantly refunded my money without even asking for me to send it back.

Curious, I went on Amazon and was surprised that I managed to find the exact tiny switch I needed. Bought the switch and it was a 5 minute repair after it arrived. I now had a "free" trigger. Should have been elated, but I felt bad after they had quickly refunded my money.

I contacted them and arranged to re-pay for it less my repair costs. Keeping it costs you in something more important than money.

 

[PlaidDragon]

I'd give them back.

If I win a tourney or do well in cash games I want it to be due to my skill; not an unfair advantage in chips.

In addition, I like to think my sense of fairness and ethics is superior to a fault.... or at least on par with all PCF denizens.

 

[Chris La Mantia]

or at least on par with all PCF denizens.

We have a pretty awesome community here.

 

[Max D]

We have a pretty awesome community here.

Agree with everybody, if i didnt give it back I would feel horrible until I did give it back!!! So give it back as soon as you know and sleep better.

 

[Lovejoyz]

I'm late to the party. I've had a busy few days with some events that are taking place locally, so I'm late to chime in, but I'll give my thoughts anyways.

Give it back. The casino knows, or will know, and Asset Protection will watch and see where the shortage came from. When that happens, there are a few things that go on from here:

1. They don't say anything, you keep it. The dealer gets wrote up, dinged on their points system, or if they've already made their points, or had write ups, it could get them fired.

2. They ask for it back, and you give it to them. I'd give you a couple lunch/dinner/room tickets for your honesty, and the trouble of having to ask for the money back. This is because they dinners/rooms don't cost the casino anything. Zero. However, that is gaming money, and a gaming transaction, and once the Gaming Commission gets involved, then it's another story entirely. I'd much rather get our bank back the $20/$40 of gaming transactions to make it flush, and give you $50/$100 in dinner/rooms.

3. They ask for it back, and you refuse. Well, this would obvi be the dumbest thing ever for a few reasons. It isn't your money, and if the gaming commission gets involved it could go either a couple ways, neither is good for you.
The first, they rule in favor of you, and allow you to keep the money. In that case, the casino will look down on you, and I'd simply ban you, not welcome back. I hope you enjoy the $40.
The second, they rule in favor of the casino, and you either give the money back, or they arrest you. They you'll be banned from all of the casinos in that jurisdiction. Hope the $40 was worth it.


Now, the one thing that I've NEVER seen, and I'm 99.99999999997% certain it's ONLY a rumor... I've NEVER seen, or actually heard of a dealer giving out an incorrect stack of chips, and having to pay it back out of their own pocket. This absolutely does not happen in Atlantic City, Biloxi, Vegas, or Deadwood. The funds are regulated by the Gaming Commission, and the Commission on Gaming would never allow the casino to take these funds out of a dealers personal funds. It's FAR more likely the casino would just fire the dealer. But they'd never be allowed to make them pay it out of pocket.

 

[xnicholsonx]

Nicely done. I would have given them back as well. I call that a Karma deposit. It will come back to you at some point. Good for you!