Top pair w/ace kicker and nut flush draw (1 Viewer)

[MrCatPants]

Curious your general critiques about how I approached this hand. Anywhere you would have raised or folded instead?

1/3 NHLE table, villian in small blind with about $550, me in big blind without about $400. Only read on villian is about an orbit ago, took about $200 off him with AQ, hitting a pair of queens on an otherwise pretty dry board against his JJ - he continued betting into me, out of position, with the queen on the board off the flop, and me just calling. So have him pegged as aggressive.

One limper in middle position, but folds around to the blinds otherwise. Small blind opens to $22.

I look down at - I flat.

Flop is . $47 in the pot.

He leads with a $40 bet, I call.

Turn is . $127 in the pot.

He leads with a $75 bet, I call.

River is . $277 in the pot.

He bets $160. I call.

We'll save the reveal for a moment. Anywhere you would have raised or folded instead?

 

[kmccormick100]

I’m assuming you’re in the BB? His open seems really large over 1 limp at $1/3, is that pretty normal at the table? I’m 3betting AQss probbaly 75% of the time here, but to an open that large a flat isn’t terrible. On that flop he bets almost pot, which is very strong, I’m calling, you either have him crushed, or have a ton of equity if you’re behind. The 2/3 pot bet on turn is also very strong and a pretty big bet in $1/3, I can see either flatting or shoving over his bet at this point, very villain dependent, but probably leaning towards a flat, as much of his rep’d range here is AA/KK. That’s another very big bet at $1/3 on the river, I consider a very villain dependent exploitative fold here. If it’s a younger or more aggressive V. I’m probbaly calling, against an older or more standard player I lean towards a fold probably.

 

[Lemonzest]

TPTK and the nut flush draw on the flop I think a raise is in order. Even if he has a set you have tons of equity in the hand.

This is my favourite hand to raise the flop with - flush draw with a pair.

As played I think it is fine. You may want to think about a fold on the river but given your history with this fella I can understand why you called.

 

[Kain8]

Why do the pushing when the donkey will do the pulling?

I would have liked a 3-bet preflop.

If you raised on the flop, you're really taking advantage of your sweet, sweet equity. But after you flat the flop, flatting the rest of the way in position on relative bricks is a nice way to go. If he rolls over pocket kings, well, that's just the way it goes.

 

[DrStrange]

Raise the flop. Hero has the best hand vs anything but a set. This equity will be fleeting as the draws brick -or- the draws hit and villain gets off the hook vs the obvious flush risk.

There are some nights when I embrace an over-bet strategy. This would be exactly the sort of situation where an over-bet would be in play. Jam the flop. If not in over bet-mode then a stiff raise is in order - make it $150 all day $110 on top.

As played, I would be leaning fold on the river without a read on villain (just looking at villain might be enough to tell old man, coffee from three-barrel young stud.). He has taken a really strong line and at this point you might be willing to put him on an over pair. Given Hero's limited history, I guess a call is in order. But it is a puke/call.

DrStrange

 

[Jimulacrum]

Agree with raising the flop, if anywhere.

Overall, this is not a bad line to take against a villain whom you've seen fire three barrels with an underpair from the flop. Against players who will do this, often the best strategy is to let them hang themselves. If you raise at any point, he's liable to smarten up quickly with any JJ or less type of hand, never mind his stone bluffs. If you don't raise, you may convince him that he's ahead on each street, or at least that it's possible to push you off the hand.

Anyway, he'll turn up with AA, KK, a set, or some random two pair (if he's loose enough) sometimes, but you trap him for a lot of money this way on the hands when he doesn't.

Of course, to play devil's advocate, you did already call him down with top pair queens in one exact such situation, so if he has a clue, he may be wary of walking into the same trap again. I suppose we may see.

 

[Lemonzest]

Broadly speaking I think there needs to be a wide range of flop raises. I like to raise or c/r super dry boards like 295 rainbow or J52 rainbow. Very few draws so it is hard for villain to continue against a raise or check raise. These would be stone cold bluffs or with a hand like A7 where you might actually still be good.

But we need to balance our flop raising range. You don't want villain to know that every flop raise means the nuts. Even if you get caught once in a while it is fine.

Raising the flop also sets you up to bomb many turns as villain may be ready to give up. If villain is a decent player then there are very few holdings he can continue with once you c/r or raise flop and bomb the turn.

 

[MrCatPants]

So, reveal, he turned over so I got mostly wiped out. I was thinking if I had 3-bet the flop, a potential 4-bet in response may have given me the heads up to see the flop and be worried by the leadoff bet.

 

[Kain8]

Well, hindsight is 20/20. If you 3-bet preflop, he's probably going to smash you with a 4-bet which could let you off the hook for a lot less money.

 

[BGinGA]

I still think that raising the flop with TPTK and the nut flush draw is the correct play, regardless of results.

 

[Rhodeman77]

I like a raise on this flop. Too many scare cards that could shut him down, which are all the cards you need, A,Q, spade. Get the money in while you have the equity advantage.

 

[kmccormick100]

I still think that raising the flop with TPTK and the nut flush draw is the correct play, regardless of results.

I usually lean towards a raise here, but not against a villain who opened to 7x and then bet almost pot on a relatively disconnected flop. I'm calling because I've got a lot of equity against a perceived very strong range.

 

[v1pe]

I prefer a 3bet preflop (fold to 4bet) and I prefer a raise on the flop. Like others have said we have maximum equity on the flop (it's pretty much a coin flip against his exact hand). Not only that, if we just flat and we do hit our flush, we likely can't expect to get maximum value from his range. In this case, we might have since he has the but in most cases a flush card will scare villain and slow him down. It also helps balance our bluffs if we want to raise on a board like this later on and rep the flush, but I wouldn't be too concerned about that in this case.

 

[MrCatPants]

So, reveal, he turned over so I got mostly wiped out. I was thinking if I had 3-bet the flop, a potential 4-bet in response may have given me the heads up to see the flop and be worried by the leadoff bet.

I misspoke - I meant 3-bet pre-flop, not 3-bet the flop.

 

[trever]

Against a player who will three barrel second pair, call down and don't give him a chance to quit betting. Against a normal player, go ahead and raise the flop.

I really doubt that you ever get away from this hand once the flip hits. If you raise the flop, you are pretty much going to be pot committed. He could reraise all in, show you his cards and you'd still have to call.

 

[CollegeMac]

You should definitely 3bet preflop, then consider raising flop sometimes with your nut flush draw.

 

[bg26892]

I like a small raise on the flop, give him a chance to spazz out with JJ or a worse flush draw...and you can happily pile all the monies in the middle if he re-raises.

22 open smells a bit fishy in terms of sizing for a 1/3 game - seems like he has a legit hand that he was trying to protect something.