Cash Game Purchasing 1000pc clays for home cash games AND 1-2 table table tourney

VANTABLACK

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The community here seems very helpful and I must admit I'm a bit stumped what to do. Any help is very appreciated.

I bought a bunch of samples and decided I absolutely loved the Majestic clays.
They offer these denominations .05, .25, .50, 1, 5, 10, 25, 100, 500, 1,000, 5,000.
I have no intention of buying anything less than 1 dollar.

I want to:
Be able to play a cash game $1/$2 blinds with 6-8 players.
Be able to hold a two table tourney.
Only use the denominations on the chips. (ie: no $1=$100,000)
Typically offer more chips because it's easier to splash around a little.

I'm ready to buy up to 1000pc set in 25pc increments.
I'm figuring on a 500pc set for each gametype. 1, 5, 10, 25 for cash games. 25, 100, 500, 1,000, 5,000 for tourney stuff.
This is where I need help. If it were you and you wanted to do the same thing, what quantity/denominations would you buy?

I must admit I sort of fell in love with chips, not something I expected, but I am a very tactile person. It's quite an investment and I don't want to get it wrong. I've read many posts but there doesn't seem to be any general consensus. Any help for this noob is very appreciated and if you read all of this post THANKS!
 

sheikh617

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A lot of people will recommend not mixing cash and tourney chips as it is a game risk if someone pockets or introduces a big chip into your game, especially since Majestics are readily available. That being said if you wanted a break down that would let you play 1/2 cash and hold tournaments you can go with the breakdown below.

200x - $1
300x - $5
160x - $25
160x - $100
60x - $500
100x - $1000
20x - $5000

By my math (which isn't always perfect) you can run a T10000 20 man event (no rebuys) starting with T25 with a breakdown of 8/8/2/3/1. This allows sufficient T500 and T1000 to color up the smaller chips when the time comes. You could also run tournaments using a T1 or T5 base which will give you a lot more flexibility and allow you to do deeper stack or rebuy events. If you bump it to 1200 chips you can give yourself a better tournament breakdown. Anyways hopes this helps and I'm sure some more people will chime in. Welcome to PCF!
 

upNdown

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Yeah, as suggested above, you might not want to use the 25 in both cash and tournament. You could avoid this by moving to a T100 structure, which is what most casinos are doing these days anyway (largely due to the increase in popularity of the big blind ante.) There are plenty of posts on this site giving tournament structures and chip requirements - use the search function, read up and you'll learn a lot.
Also, Majestic chips are china clays, which are manufactured completely differently than compressed clay chips, and thus not appropriately called "clays." It might seem picky, but you're on a site dedicated to poker ships - its a significant distinction.
 

VANTABLACK

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A lot of people will recommend not mixing cash and tourney chips as it is a game risk if someone pockets or introduces a big chip into your game, especially since Majestics are readily available. That being said if you wanted a break down that would let you play 1/2 cash and hold tournaments you can go with the breakdown below.

200x - $1
300x - $5
160x - $25
160x - $100
60x - $500
100x - $1000
20x - $5000

By my math (which isn't always perfect) you can run a T10000 20 man event (no rebuys) starting with T25 with a breakdown of 8/8/2/3/1. This allows sufficient T500 and T1000 to color up the smaller chips when the time comes. You could also run tournaments using a T1 or T5 base which will give you a lot more flexibility and allow you to do deeper stack or rebuy events. If you bump it to 1200 chips you can give yourself a better tournament breakdown. Anyways hopes this helps and I'm sure some more people will chime in. Welcome to PCF!

Thanks for the reply! I'm not concerned with using the chips for cash and tourney. If I were to up it to 1200 what would that do to the quantities?

Yeah, as suggested above, you might not want to use the 25 in both cash and tournament. You could avoid this by moving to a T100 structure, which is what most casinos are doing these days anyway (largely due to the increase in popularity of the big blind ante.) There are plenty of posts on this site giving tournament structures and chip requirements - use the search function, read up and you'll learn a lot.
Also, Majestic chips are china clays, which are manufactured completely differently than compressed clay chips, and thus not appropriately called "clays." It might seem picky, but you're on a site dedicated to poker ships - its a significant distinction.

Thanks for your reply. If you're new to this, like I am, you approach it as a consumer. Many chips for sale use the word clay even when it doesn't apply. Figuring out materials isn't easy at first. I didn't realize the difference and I thank you for the correction. I'm pro significant distinctions. If I could change it I would,.
 

JustinInMN

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Thanks for the reply! I'm not concerned with using the chips for cash and tourney.

You might want to search around other threads on this topic before forming an opinion on this. But I think most threads that answer that question will assume separate sets.

But I would start with the tournament requirements.

T10K with base T25 is a common tournament setup as @sheikh617 explained.

My minimum suggested breakdown is 8/8/4/7 per player for starting stacks. Plus Add one additional T1000 per player to accommodate color ups of the T25 and T100 chips, which comes to 144/144/72/144 chips, which rounds up to 150/150/75/150 chips for 18 players. Add 75 T5000 chips to accomodate deeper stacks/re-entries/late color ups and you hit a round 600.

If "two-tables" means 20 players, then the quantity requirement kind of works against you a bit. You then need 160/160/80/160 (of T25/100/500/1000) for 20 players. You then have to round to 175/175/100/175 which is a total of 625 chips, plus 75 T5000 gets you to 700 chips.

Cash breakdowns are far less rigid. I just follow a couple rules.

1) Don't overbuy blind chips (in this case the single), 5-10 per player is plenty and they won't see use in later rounds.
2) Get 2-3 barrels per player in workhorse chips (in this case the five)

So I think doing 100*1 and 400*5 is good for single table 1-2.

I would be cautious about issuing higher level stock chips for cash games. (Even fives are dicey imo.)

So you can get under 1200 chips easily this way.

Good luck,
 

VANTABLACK

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Wow this is great stuff. Thanks so much for your help guys.

So I'm going to summarize what I think I've learned so far. If you could point out where you think I've gone wrong I'd appreciate it. These are the two solutions compared.

Denominationssheikh617JustinInMN
1200100
5300400
25160150
100160150
5006075
1,000100150
5,0002075
Total Cash Chips500500
Total Tourney Chips500600
Total Rounded1,0501,100
Tourney Options20 man, T25-T10k, 8/8/2/3/1, no rebuys18 man, T25-T10k, 8/8/4/7, rebuys

I like sheikh617's cash game $1/$5. I like JustInInMN's tourney suggestion. I want to keep it under 1,000 chips. I'd like to not have to buy rounded up stacks.
I'm going to mix the cash chips with tourney despite lots of advice not to. It has to do with who I play with. I'm not concerned, but I appreciate the warnings.
Will tweaking the $1 and $5 and using $25 to make up for it on the cash end break anything?

DenominationsVANTABLACK
1200
5200
25150
100150
50075
1,000150
5,00075
Total Cash Chips400-unlimited
Total Tourney Chips600
Total Chips1,000
Total Rounded1,000
Cash Options8 man, 20/20/unlimited, 2 reloads of $1/$5/unlimited
Tourney Options18 man, T25-T10k, 8/8/4/7, rebuys

Would these chips happen work for T1/T5 too?
 

JustinInMN

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I'm going to mix the cash chips with tourney despite lots of advice not to.

You probably don't need to change anything if you do this. 150 twenty-fives is 3750 in the bank.

Also you need to round sheiks counts up to the next 25 per your buying requirements, 160 is not a multiple of 25.

So that said, if you wanted to take 100 off of my suggestion, take it from the fives. You should still have a decent cash game with 300, comes to about 33 chips per player 9 handed. Still pretty good for the workhorse denomination, just not quite as good as 40 per player.
 

VANTABLACK

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You probably don't need to change anything if you do this. 150 twenty-fives is 3750 in the bank.

Also you need to round sheiks counts up to the next 25 per your buying requirements, 160 is not a multiple of 25.

So that said, if you wanted to take 100 off of my suggestion, take it from the fives. You should still have a decent cash game with 300, comes to about 33 chips per player 9 handed. Still pretty good for the workhorse denomination, just not quite as good as 40 per player.

Correction to Sheiks numbers, you're right, would be 550 Tchips. I can't edit here. That's frustrating. The total is still 1,050 rounded.

I think putting it into tables really helped me. The final decision is your suggestion minus a few $5 to get to 1,000pc. Took me a while to get it but here we are. I really appreciate all the help. PCF rocks!
 

BGinGA

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I'm going to mix the cash chips with tourney despite lots of advice not to. It has to do with who I play with. I'm not concerned, but I appreciate the warnings.
"I told you so."

Just throwing that out there now, for when your ill-advised decision inevitably bites you in the ass. And it will, eventually.

And it has absolutely nothing to do with whom you play. It has everything to do with protecting the integrity of the game you host, by implementing procedures and taking actions designed to protect it, and by doing so, protecting the interests of the players you invite to play. So long as you are prepared to take the financial bath yourself (likely due to no fault of your own, or anybody else, either), march right on down that rocky road. But do so with your eyes wide open to the risks.

Accidents happen, and Murphy's Law is reality-in-motion. People accidentally drop chips, often not realizing it. People see chips on the floor, and often assume they must have just dropped them. Bank is somehow mysteriously $25 to $100 short at the end of the night. "WTF, how did that happen? We're all honest friends around here." Immaterial, since it was totally unintentional. Worse, it was totally avoidable. You will get burned -- it's a matter of when (and how much), not if.

Carry on. /sermon
 

VANTABLACK

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"I told you so."

Just throwing that out there now, for when your ill-advised decision inevitably bites you in the ass. And it will, eventually.

And it has absolutely nothing to do with whom you play. It has everything to do with protecting the integrity of the game you host, by implementing procedures and taking actions designed to protect it, and by doing so, protecting the interests of the players you invite to play. So long as you are prepared to take the financial bath yourself (likely due to no fault of your own, or anybody else, either), march right on down that rocky road. But do so with your eyes wide open to the risks.

Accidents happen, and Murphy's Law is reality-in-motion. People accidentally drop chips, often not realizing it. People see chips on the floor, and often assume they must have just dropped them. Bank is somehow mysteriously $25 to $100 short at the end of the night. "WTF, how did that happen? We're all honest friends around here." Immaterial, since it was totally unintentional. Worse, it was totally avoidable. You will get burned -- it's a matter of when (and how much), not if.

Carry on. /sermon
Good advice, as I've already said. It doesn't apply here, as I've already said. But I appreciate the message and I like it's there for others who might find this thread. Hopefully they make the decision that's best for them. Peace
 

JustinInMN

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So I am just spitballing here.

Cash set (450)
100*1
300*5
50*25

Bank 2850

Tournament (550)
200*T100
100*T500
150*T1000
100*T5000

20 stacks of 10/4/7/2 for T20k stacks. Staring at 100-100 is 200Bb, starting at 100-200 is a 100 BB tournament.

Extra T1000/5000 for re entries and color ups.

You have the clean line between cash and tournament.

Yes, there is a chance this will never be an issue, but the there is a non-zero chance it could be (even absent any malicious intent) and when it is, you will pay more than a rack of chips for the issue. I know this something on which all newbies get harped, but if you can get an answer that protects yourself 100%, why not do it?
 

LotsOfChips

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...I'd like to not have to buy rounded up stacks.
Those chips only come in multiples of 25. So barrels (multiples of 20) aren't practical when calculating # of chips purchased.

...I'm going to mix the cash chips with tourney despite lots of advice not to. It has to do with who I play with. I'm not concerned, but I appreciate the warnings.
...Good advice, as I've already said. It doesn't apply here, as I've already said.
Wow. That is a pretty bold statement, and I wager that most people who have been burned have thought the same thing until it has happened. But you're presumably an adult, and are free to make your own decisions. When the wheels fall off, just remember the guy who told you to check the lug nuts...
 

Mr Winberg

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Have you decided to have a T25 base tourney set? As mentioned above by @upNdown, having a T100 base tourney set solves the problem of mixing denominations between cash and tournament. You could then use for e.g. the orange 0.50 and relabel it as a T25000. Or even better, use a 43mm Royal for an oversized T25000! (They can be relabelled as majestics)
 

Coyote

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I would only mix, in extremis, cash and tournament chips only if the tourney were single-table with family and childhood friends, and only if cash and tourney were NEVER played consecutively or simultaneously under the same roof.
With the tourney being a two-table one, it's beyond discussion. You 'll need a separate tourney set. Definitely.

Things might be different if your cash game was very low-stakes: 0.05/0.10.
Thus, even in a tourney, T2,000 starting stack (T5 based), worth $20, your chips' denominations would still represent dollar cents, in either cash or tourney.

Edit :): You could, of course, hold tournaments with you $1/2 cash chips, too.
T1 based, T400 starting stack, costing $400 to buy:)
 
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JustinInMN

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Actually you can. As long as you are logged in, each of your posts has a small Edit button on the bottom left (not the triangle).

Your post title can also be edited by editing your initial post.

May need to reach a certain post count to get edit privilege?
 

VANTABLACK

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here's some solid game security advice:

look at this timely group buy get blanks & contact gear for labels & you're semi-custom right off the bat

if you're in a bigger rush than that, take advantage of the blanks offered by apache

I've considered the blanks but it puts it out of my budget which I've already extended twice and I think it's a little too serious for me at this point at least.

But you're presumably an adult, and are free to make your own decisions. When the wheels fall off, just remember the guy who told you to check the lug nuts...

I am an adult. However, I'm married... so draw your own conclusions.
Also, this made me lol.

I would only mix, in extremis, cash and tournament chips only if the tourney were single-table with family and childhood friends, and only if cash and tourney were NEVER played consecutively or simultaneously under the same roof.
With the tourney being a two-table one, it's beyond discussion. You 'll need a separate tourney set. Definitely.

I didn't feel the need to defend my choice but since so many are passionate about doing the right thing and have helped me so much with this post I can at least do the same by explaining.

I find that being family and also treating others how you want to be treated leads to friends who are family. I have dozens of friends who would drop everything to help me in any way because I would, and do, the same for them. If I couldn't do it alone I bring my son. If we can't do it I bring my sons. If we can't do it I'm on the horn because it's a group of vetted individuals who care. If one of them betrayed my trust I have confidence that eventually their conscience would do its job and justice would prevail... because we are family of respectful people.

So, even if the worst happened I would take the hit and it wouldn't be out of ignorance. But if there was a snafu we'd likely divide the error between us.

I think there is a post requirement for editing. Once I hit it I'll fix the clay descriptions and table data. (edit: and I think I just hit it)
 

Beaniman

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If you get 3+ racks of fives, just pick up some royals 25s to go with your cash set. This would avoid any overlap in the sets if you use a T25 structure, and give you a groovy oversized 25 for your cash game large denom. I've heard hobbyphilic say that apache will do majestic lables on royals by special order too.

Also as someone else said, if you go T100 base you end up needing less chips and could keep the 1/5/25s all majestic cash with everything larger for tournament & pick up some sexy $100 majestic plaques if you must use 100s in the cash game.

Also this may be helpful:
 
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