PAHWM 60PLO online (1 Viewer)

[grebe]

OK, I have not been doing well on the mean mean virtual streets of PLO lately, but I didnt want to jump in any of the nit fest holdem games running....so here we go! Hero started with ALL his roll in this game ($65) and is OK to go broke and have to reload. Currently down a little to some fold on the flop type hands.

*all the stacks are within +/- $10 of mine except for shortie in HJ with less than $10
*game is playing pretty crazy....almost always a raise and calls...sometimes a 3 bet that may or may not be a quality hand.
* I have only played a few hands so far, so no reads....but have seen some questionable hands show up at showdown.....the game is looking good.

UTG raises pot to $2.1
HJ call
HERO (in CO) elects to call
BTN call
SB call
BB call

**my thoughts are wow, great hand! If flushes come, it will be suspect, but I could make nut straight all kinds of ways. I want to see a flop cheap.

Any comments on this thinking here? I'll pause for dramatic effect, but not too long until flop action.

tagging @Anthony Martino @Rhodeman77 @upNdown @MatB for their outspoken views on PLO!

 

[Rhodeman77]

This is a 3 betting hand 100%. It is great to disguise your AAxx hands when you 3 bet with run downs as well. By 3 betting you also clean up some of you flush outs as you may get a Kxxxdd hand to fold preflop.

 

[upNdown]

you might have the wrong guy here. Im outspoken on a lot of things, but I don’t have a ton of useful PLO experience.
That said, something tells me that as much as I love this wrappy, suited goodness, I think we’re asking for trouble by flatting here and letting everybody come along.
I would have re-potted.

 

[grebe]

you might have the wrong guy here. Im outspoken on a lot of things, but I don’t have a ton of useful PLO experience.
That said, something tells me that as much as I love this wrappy, suited goodness, I think we’re asking for trouble by flatting here and letting everybody come along.
I would have re-potted.

I went thru the last couple pages of Anthony's thread and looked for names, tbh. Feel free to comment though.

 

[grebe]

This is a 3 betting hand 100%. It is great to disguise your AAxx hands when you 3 bet with run downs as well. By 3 betting you also clean up some of you flush outs as you may get a Kxxxdd hand to fold preflop.

Are you cool with getting it in preflop here?

 

[Rhodeman77]

Are you cool with getting it in preflop here?

Yes. If I get 4 bet when I 3 bet I am calling.

Unless you run into the very best hands like AAKQ or AAJ10 you have good equity vs random AAxx hands.

 

[MatB]

Pot pre. .

If it flops 6792 , A467. Check fold
If it flops AT98 or anything in the upper range. POT

 

[DrStrange]

I think this is a three bet preflop.

Hero is a modest dog if all the money goes in preflop. Most of the jamming ranges are AAxx Maybe some villains do get crazy. Let's call hero a 45/55 dog if the money goes in preflop. Hero is risking $65 to win $133 ---> ~$60 ev or a $5 loss, Not a disaster, but not desirable. Even so, hero should be three betting here unless villing only raises AAxx type hands.

Let's remember hero describes this game as "crazy". Not a nit festival

 

[grebe]

OK, so I definitely missed a 3 bet opportunity here. Good to know.

Flop:

checks to HERO with the third nut flush.

Action?

 

[DrStrange]

Must bet. Not happy, but Hero has a legitimate hand and almost the entire table checked to him. No free cards for people drawing to full houses.

Would consider a bet/fold line vs the right group of villains. Not so sure these villains are like that.

Oh, and hero does have a one out redraw to a straight flush. That alone might be worth a percent or two of extra equity.

 

[MatB]

Now the real poker begins

Because you didn’t raise pre. Now have 6 players to the flop.
Was Much more chance of k2dd sticking around.

Your diamonds not as attractive now. Heads up or 3 way I’d raise. But 6 handed. It’s check call for me

Paired board or massive all in. Fold

Pray for the 9d

 

[Rhodeman77]

I check for pot control. There is a good chance you have the best hand, but if you are behind you need runner runner to make a boat. When you are ahead you aren’t getting 3 streets of value from worse hands. I play this as a check call in the flop.

 

[MatB]

a bet may get out the 2 pair guys fishing for boats

But I’d always float the turn fold the river if I have 2pr on flop so I’m not going anywhere

 

[MatB]

This and so many hands are in a very short book called

‘Why you raise pre flop’

Short read.

 

[upNdown]

Now the real poker begins

Because you didn’t raise pre. Now have 6 players to the flop.
Was Much more chance of k2dd sticking around.

Your diamonds not as attractive now. Heads up or 3 way I’d raise. But 6 handed. It’s check call for me

Paired board or massive all in. Fold

Pray for the 9d

Right. I wouldn’t mind hanging around to see if I can make my straight flush. And I suppose I might even take my 3rd nut flush to showdown, if it happens cheaply enough.
But realistically, we’re 6-handed with almost no chances to improve, which would make me a bet-fold if I’m betting. So I’m not betting.

 

[grebe]

PLO is hard, lol. So, sounds like consensus is to check....

HERO bets POT.

(I do so fully aware that I could be doing so drawing to 1 out, however I am last to act....everybody checked, and there is a REALLY good chance I am up against a set, two pair, a worse flush, or a drooler with 9T). I am EXTREMELY wary of what comes.

we get one caller from the BB.....everybody else folds. We are happy with this result.
Pot: $25
(Villain covers us btw, and we have $35 behind)
TURN:
BB checks to us
HERO?

 

[upNdown]

Nvm, confused
I guess I’m checking here

 

[MatB]

I don’t hate the turn bet.

Few possibilities here for villain.

Made hand ( better than yours)

Made hand (worse than yours)

On a draw. To a better hand.


Math guys might say POT. But I’m scared.

Check crying call.

 

[Rhodeman77]

Great card. If BB had the nut flush he would have check raised or lead the turn. The problem is he could have the King high flush and playing pot control as well. He could find a fold to another pot sized bet if he has the King high flush. If he has a set he may call hoping to boat up which means your need to get you value now before he misses the draw.

I go ahead and bet pot again planning to shove the river if the board doesn’t pair.

 

[Burke]

by shoving the river with a non-paired board you are trying to cause a K-high flush to fold?

 

[Rhodeman77]

by shoving the river with a non-paired board you are trying to cause a K-high flush to fold?

If the player understands PLO at all, yes, but Hero needs a full pot sized bet left to make the play work. Anything less and the price is too enticing for the King high flush to make the call.

 

[grebe]

HERO:. Bets 1/2 pot (12.50)
BB: calls
Pot is now $50, hero has $35.
River is


Final board:.
BB checks

Hero?

 

[MatB]

Hate to say it. CHECK.

you’ll either hate yourself for leaving money on the table because they have a set.
Or
You’ll breathe sigh of relief because they had K2 dd

 

[Burke]

Just a set wouldn’t call here though?

I think I just check

 

[Rhodeman77]

Just a set wouldn’t call here though?

I think I just check

When there is 4 to a suite people start thinking that there aren’t many left and are more likely to call now. A straight may even call if it got to this point. Any worse flush is thinking that there are not many diamonds left, my flush must be good.

In my local online game we recently had 3 flush hands on a 4 suite board. Of course it was A high vs K high vs the player that rivered the SF.

 

[warma]

Ask aloud if they made their straight, tank for 5 minutes, count your chips, set up a pot sizes bet, then half pot, then pot, stand up, and then flip a coin. Announce, “Heads I pot, tails I check.” Then do the opposite.

 

[Anthony Martino]

I play full ring live, 6 max online is a different beast altogether.

I agree with others we are raising in the CO preflop here. You want to isolate the raiser pre with a positional advantage, and promote your flush draws as well. As others said, you might push out the k-high diamond draw by doing this. Hell, ace high clubs might fold if the rest of their hand is trash

As played, this is a must bet on the flop. Being in the CO and everyone checked to you, don't want to let free cards roll off to pair the board. I like your flop bet

On the turn it's opponent dependent, but you don't really know these players yet. I like the turn check with the intention of calling the river, this allows you to get value from a weaker flush that feels emboldened by your turn check, or to lose less when you are beat and have to crying call the river

As played I likely check back river. We aren't going to fold out the king high flush after we checked turn. And we may not get paid by weaker hands

 

[200 Motels]

On monotone flops (all one suit) you can get away with betting 1/3 pot online because they're such action killing flops. You'd also cbet this amount with the nut blocker (but less often with like 4+ players to the flop)

I like either, Flop bet 1/3, turn check to pot control and induce a river bluff, and river call if they lead or bet half pot or possibly more if it's checked to you.
or
Check flop, bet half pot on turn, bet half pot on river. *assuming river doesn't pair the board.

 

[grebe]

Thanks for all your comments, I feel like this might be the best value I have gotten out of one of these yet. I definitely picked up some things to think about and hopefully turn my PLO play to the positive.

HERO: Checks river....did not have the stones to go for more value. My thinking is along Burke's line...sets are going to have to fold to any sizable bet, and only the K flush is calling me down.

Villain had

So, in his head, he has middle set but blocks the nut flush.

Any thoughts on how the V played here?

 

[Burke]

what are you doing if villain pots river? Discounting nut flush?

If I were villain, I probably would have tried to check-raise flop leaving an all-in bet to lead with on the turn with any card