Open Face Chinese Poker OFCP Thread (3 Viewers)

inca911

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This thread is for all things related to OFCP. Strategy, games, pictures of great hands, etc. I've been learning this game for the past couple of months. It's a super-active, high-decision-factor game that is a ton of fun with just a few players. It's now my go-to game early or late on a poker night.

For those who aren't familiar, the goal is to create poker hands of decreasing value from bottom (best) to top (worst). The top does not include straights/flushes. For each hand you win, you get a point from each player that you beat. If you win all three hands against a player, you get an extra one point per hand from that player (i.e., 6 total points). For high value hands, you then get "royalty" bonus points. Bonuses start at 66 on Top, Trips in Middle, and Straight on Bottom. Just Google the bonus tables. The dollar value per point can be changed to whatever you want it to be (e.g., $0.05 per point for learning, $0.25 for low stakes games). The game is played with 2-4 total players. With four players, there is no Pineapple element (i.e., as you need all 13 cards).
  • X X X <--Top/Front (3 cards, trips is best hand)
  • X X X X X <--Middle (5 cards)
  • X X X X X <--Bottom/Back (5 cards)
OFCP.jpg


In the first round, each player gets 5 cards and places cards face up, positioned wherever they want. Once placed, cards do not move. Each player does this in order for all 5 cards. In the next rounds, each player gets 3 cards and taking turns in order by position relative to the dealer they then select two to play face up. The third card is discarded face down into the muck. Later players have positional advantage of knowing what's been played so far. This process goes on until the hands are fully set, after which they are scored and points awarded. If you "foul" by setting an illegal hand of not decreasing values, your entire hand is mucked and you lose all three hands against any other player who has not fouled.

There is also an extra advantage that you can qualify for if you have a legal hand with QQ or higher in the top. In this "Fantasyland" bonus, you get 14 cards at one time and can set all 13 at once face down (discarding one). With four players, you don't get an extra 14th card in Fantasyland. It's a bonus worth on average ~10 points. Getting to Fantasyland adds a great strategic element to the game. You need a very strong hand to remain in Fantasyland: Trips on Top, Boat in Middle, Quads on Bottom.

My initial thoughts on this game is that new players greatly underestimate the value of Fantasyland. Many focus mostly on the bottom. Flushes appear to be strongly preferred for the bottom, but full houses aren't that hard to secure there for good advantage. Straights in the middle are also very strong. Getting a hand like QQ on top is very strong plus is qualifies for Fantasyland. An AQ draw may find Q top and A middle, hoping to pair each for a valid hand. A single pair up high often wins the top. Trips on top are incredibly strong, but difficult to do. So who else is playing this, and what do you think?
 
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Wish we had played a version more like what you describe here than the way we played at S@P (one card at a time and no fantasyland). Was fun but this way sounds much better.
 
Such a great game. Got really into it a year or 2 ago and was playing a ton on TonyBet. But eventually started to miss the betting/folding aspects of "real" poker and the psychology that go along with that. Still like to get it into the mix occasionally at home games though. For heads-up or shorthanded it's one of the best games out there, and if you're on a plane or somewhere else where chips aren't handy or are simply impractical, it might be the best game.
 
Wish we had played a version more like what you describe here than the way we played at S@P (one card at a time and no fantasyland). Was fun but this way sounds much better.
It is sooo much better this way! I sense you will become quickly hooked....
 
Decreasing, thanks Larry. Best hand is in back, second in middle, weakest in top.
 
OP has described pineapple OFC (three cards at a time, discarding one), which is a three handed game 4 handed you must use all cards and they are placed one at a time in order around the table.

Pineapple OFC, plays much bigger because it is easier to make royalties.

When we play we don't award points for trips in the middle because it basically means you would almost always place a pair in the middle if you were dealt one in your starting five and it removes a lot of the decision making of where you place your starting five.
 
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Forrest get the ABC Poker app and we'll play for quarters sometime :)
 
When we play we don't award points for trips in the middle because it basically means you would almost always place a pair in the middle if you were dealt one in your starting five and it removes a lot of the decision making of where you place your starting five.
In general, putting a pair in the middle is a play I very rarely make. The trip royalties at +2 are very weak compared to building a strong bottom to build upon and full house royalties at +6 (not to mention winning the bottom for 1 and a potential scoop or scoop block). Removing trip royalties for middle doesn't make much sense to me. I'll wager if you ran 100 hands setting pair in back vs. middle, it's a far better outcome.

Fink,
I'll definitely get that app so we can play some! Maybe we can get a few more OFCP players to run an occasional game....
 
In our game, trip queens on top is all it takes to stay in fantasy land, but we rarely play pineapple.

Also when playing heads up, we each play 2 hands simultaneously. The cards are dealt to a specific hand, can't put a card dealt for hand 1 on hand 2.
 
It is easier to bail if the hand isn't setting up well if you put a low pair in the middle and have say three high cards on the bottom but you aren't going to be able to make a flush. Whereas if you put a pair on the bottom you are committed to making a boat. You instantly cancel any chance of a flush or straight on the bottom. If you miss your boat, you are the one more than likely getting scooped. At best you likely have two pair or worse in the middle or are fouling.

In pineapple, I would almost always put a starting pair of AA, KK or QQ on the top, since the benefits of making fantasyland are so huge, JJ, 1010 probably on the bottom and all other pairs in the middle. If there are royalties for trips in the middle, then 2 for trips and 4 for a flush is exactly the same as making a boat on the bottom, plus you have a higher likelihood of at getting a shot at QQ, KK or AA on top and making fantasyland. I would easily sacrifice a few points per hand for a higher chance at fantasyland. Giving up extra shots at fantasyland does not seem +ev. I think it is easier to make fantasyland with trips in the middle because you can make a lower hand on the bottom and not foul, take the pair that would have made your boat, and put it on the top and earn more royalties, if not fantasyland AND more than likely block being scooped. Whereas to put a boat on the bottom, to make fantasyland you need to have been dealt, at least three pair AND trips, and in the correct order and if you miss the bottom boat you are more than likely scooped.

This is why I do not like the 2 points for trips in the middle. If you make trips in the middle and a flush on the bottom there is no point penalty for taking extra shots at fantasyland versus going for the boat on the bottom. If there are no points for trips then you are sacrificing more points to shoot for fantasyland and therefore have tougher decisions to make re putting pairs in the middle.

I think my strategy is a lower risk/lower reward strategy with a higher chance at fantasyland, whereas yours is higher risk/higher reward with a lower chance at fantasyland.
 
In our game, trip queens on top is all it takes to stay in fantasy land, but we rarely play pineapple.

Also when playing heads up, we each play 2 hands simultaneously. The cards are dealt to a specific hand, can't put a card dealt for hand 1 on hand 2.


Orly? That would be higher than most.

Any trips on top usually qualifies to stay in fantasyland. It is actually easier to say, 'any royalty on any line, 10 points or higher qualifies to remain in fantasyland'. That would be any trips on top, full house or better in the middle, quads or better on the bottom.
 
Orly? That would be higher than most.

Any trips on top usually qualifies to stay in fantasyland. It is actually easier to say, 'any royalty on any line, 10 points or higher qualifies to remain in fantasyland'. That would be any trips on top, full house or better in the middle, quads or better on the bottom.

Yup you're right, any trips on top. Mind fart.

But other rows do not qualify for continued fantasy land.
 
Played more OFCP tonight, and got some run good. Going for fantasyland more without too much gamble helped the outcome. Two guys were snakebite plus playing big gambles, and they busted a lot. I'd have just as much fun playing a nickel a point as for higher stakes. Six hours flew by. We ran through all the mixed casino chips that @Mr. Cheese brought and had to start subbing in some plastics. Shame....

image.jpeg
 
Played more OFCP tonight, and got some run good. Going for fantasyland more without too much gamble helped the outcome. Two guys were snakebite plus playing big gambles, and they busted a lot. I'd have just as much fun playing a nickel a point as for higher stakes. Six hours flew by. We ran through all the mixed casino chips that @Mr. Cheese brought and had to start subbing in some plastics. Shame....

View attachment 42187

Time to invest in secondaries!
 
We almost always play this game with four players, each getting 13 cards all at once, face-down. Each player takes turn being the dealer for three games. The three players play against the dealer, but sometimes they have "side bets" against each other. An advantage of being a dealer is that the dealer wins a draw. The players set their hands in private, and show them when all players complete setting the hands. In a simple game, a player wins a game if he wins two out of the three hands. For a high stake game, a player wins bonuses if he wins all three hands.

We don't call it open face poker because it was never dealt face up. Maybe the face up variation was invented for casino play.
 
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13 cards all together face down is regular Chinese Poker. Can't see why you only play against the dealer. Regular Chinese Poker is very dull compared to Pineapple Open Face Chinese Poker.
 
Didn't know that POFCP was more exciting; I haven't played the game. From the descriptions, it sounds like the chance of getting illegal hands are high. Going to try it out sometime.
 
Played more OFCP tonight, and got some run good. Going for fantasyland more without too much gamble helped the outcome. Two guys were snakebite plus playing big gambles, and they busted a lot. I'd have just as much fun playing a nickel a point as for higher stakes. Six hours flew by. We ran through all the mixed casino chips that @Mr. Cheese brought and had to start subbing in some plastics. Shame....

View attachment 42187

Like Forrest was saying the other two players besides us were big on taking huge gambles that typically didn't pay off. I think my 10 dollar buy in turned into a 27 dollar cash out and Forrest's 20 dollar buy in turned in 83ish dollars if I remember correctly?
 
@Ronoh : I downloaded that app, so maybe later this week we can find a time to play.

@thyechal : I use to play the old closed, 13-card version. 3-handed OFCP is 100x better. Many more decisions, and adaptations to opponents' styles/boards. It's also a much more social game, which is good. With four players, the dealer sits out, or break into two tables x 2 players.

@Mr. Cheese : That sounds about right. Like I said, playing for a quarter a point while learning seems aggressive for newer players. It's not a game where over-aggression is frequently rewarded. Busting vs. decent hands gets expensive. At least they got dinner and a couple new decks of Gemaco Superflexes out of the session!

Interesting notes:
  • The Remain-in-Fantasyland requirements are easily remembered as "need to score 10 or more points" in one row.
  • Also, the points for the middle hand can be remembered as "double the points for the back hand" (with the exception of +2 for trips in middle). A straight scores 2 in back, and 4 in middle. A boat scores 6 in back, and 12 in middle. Quads score 10 in back and 20 in middle. etc.
 
I'm using the OFC corvid app. If anyone wants to play shoot me a PM and I'll give you my user name.
 
@Ronoh : I downloaded that app, so maybe later this week we can find a time to play.
I find the app a bit "off", you don't remein in FL with a middle boat, only 2 handed, etc. Payback just mentioned a different app, maybe try that one out and see how you like it? I don't have a ton of time to test it out right now but will certainly be in for a game sometime.
 
I'm using one called Oye on iPad. It let's you pick 2 or 3 person games. And Pineapple or 14 card aka fantasy land all the time.
 
I find the app a bit "off", you don't remein in FL with a middle boat, only 2 handed, etc. Payback just mentioned a different app, maybe try that one out and see how you like it? I don't have a ton of time to test it out right now but will certainly be in for a game sometime.
I've been using that one for a few years and have worked with the developer on adding new improvements or changes. She's alway been great to work with. It's only Hu, but you can customize any of the fantasyland setting you want along with point values, etc.
 
Shortly after being re-introduced to OFCP at S@P, I've been playing continually on my iPhone on the "Pineapple!" app. I played ~1000 hands vs. the bot, just to get practice in not fouling, and now have about 5 or 6 ongoing games with friends.

I like the "low in the middle" variant -- the middle row has to be a low hand, 10-low or better, no pairs, straights, or flushes. 2-3-4-5-7 is the best possible.

Here's the app I'm referring to: https://itunes.apple.com/ca/app/pineapple!/id906193660?mt=8

@inca911 -- send me a PM if you want to play! :)
 
I've been playing continually on my iPhone on the "Pineapple!" app
This version seems far better than the one I've been using... seems to be much more random (based on how often players get to FL) and when in FL they actually sort the cards like a person may do instead of just giving you a jumbled, random mess. Plus it's much faster, on the ABC version I've sometimes waited a full minute or more for the AI to decide how to play their FL hand.
 
Just got hooked on the Pineapple! iPhone game. Wasn't a fan of giving up my phone number for validation - I get plenty of spam calls already. Still a fun game, but it clearly lacks the interaction of live OFCP.
 

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