Cash Game My First Cash Games: Blinds and Stacks Help for Different Groups (1 Viewer)

Hairy_Crocodile

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Hello Everyone!

I am a pretty new to the world of poker, and since my friends have been trying to push me into it, I fell in love with the game; especially after I have begun researching how to play the game using pot odds, learning about equity, calculating the odds for outs, etc. Because I am new to this world, I have a lot of questions that probably are very ignorant, so I duly apologize. This will be a longer post, so I appreciate those of you willing to read through my wall of text to help me understand these basic things that you all know already

I decided that I wanted my own poker set and decided to buy chips, but not the horrid dice chips that most of my friends have. I bought 650 ceramics (I like nicer things, and I want the chips to last me a long time).

So far, my set looks like this (650 chips total):
100 x Black
200 x White
200 x Red
100 x Green
50 x Purple

I am considering going to 800 (possibly chucking in the extra 50 purples for the heck of it):
200 x Blue
200 x White
200 x Red
100 x Green
100 x Black

I got non-denominational chips for my first set so I can play with different groups of people with different denominations. I have 2 groups so far, and each like to play different stakes depending on who I'm with.

Group 1 wants to play with $10 buy-ins....maybe as "much" as 20-25 :(. Disappointing, but doable.

Group 2 is more established and not one I will run, unless I can help the host run it better and make his life easier, that is. Before I started to research the game and try and take it seriously, I played for the first time in ~8 years...with them 3 months ago? And their denominations were weird ($0.25s, $1s, $5s, $10s, $25s...idk why they use 10s), and the way they ran the event was strange. Min buy-in $25, max $100, 1-2 re-buys, you can cash out at any time (I dont think thats healthy for gameplay, but I could be wrong), no bounties at the moment.

They are not very organized and I want to change that so everyone knows whats going on before the thing even starts and we aren't hashing out details right before we play.

My biggest questions pertain to how to run the events to make them most enjoyable, and what blinds/chip stacks I should use for each buy-in.
I'd like help with $10 buy ins, $25, $50, and $100 buy ins. I have some written up for criticism for 25/50/100.

$10 Buy-ins (Blinds ????)

??????

$25 Buy-ins (Blinds $0.10/$0.25)
10 x $0.05
18 x $0.25
20 x $1

$50 Buy-ins (Blinds $0.25/$0.50)
20 x $0.25
20 x $1
5 x $5

$100 Buy-ins (Blinds $0.50/$1.00)
10 x $0.50
20 x $1
15 x $5


What other rules should we do for cash games?
-Winner takes all?
-1st/2nd place?
-1st/2nd/3rd place? Third gets buy-in back?
-Not allowing people to cash out until 3 hr mark (Saw this on another post and I like this. It forces people to play for a while and not just abruptly leave the game) ??
-Any other suggestions?
-Do you raise blinds in cash games? How often do you raise? By what amounts?
-Are bounties good for the game? Do you like them?

Thank you all for reading, I'll stop it here for now!
 
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Rhodeman77

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Definitely sounds like you need to read up more on the different kinds of poker, cash games vs tournaments.

Cash games, people buy in for an amount and receive that value in chips. It is real money that can be exchanged back for cash at any time. The blinds don’t increase


In a tournament players get an amount of chips not equal to the actual cash they paid to enter the tournament. The game is played with increasing blinds until there is only one person left.
 

msuroo

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So yeah, it's not that you can't mix cash game elements and tourney elements at times, but you need to understand the fundamentals first.

As others have alluded to, in a cash game, every bet is represented by cash. If you run out, buy some more chips. There are generally not things like bounties or increasing blinds. People buying in for different amounts is generally allowable. People can buy in or cash out as they please. A minimum play time is sometimes enforced as a social construct, but not integral to the mechanics of the game.

In a tournament, everyone starts with the same stack and you play until someone has all the chips. Payouts are based on finishing order, sometimes with the addition of bounties. Blinds are increased regularly to force action and ensure that someone actually does end up with all the chips. A minimum playtime would be nonsensical as the chips have no cash value, so there is nothing to cash out.

Like I said, there are ways to mix and match - I've seen tournaments played with cash denom chips that match the buyin so that if the tourney gets late and people want to quit, it can be called early with payouts equaling the cash chips remaining. I've seen people play with bounties in cash games (even though I think it's stupid). I've seen people increase their cash game blinds as the night goes on and stacks get deeper (after there have been several rebuys, for example). But for now just try and learn the basics ha. If you can narrow in more specifically on what kind of game you are trying to play, we can offer better advice on chip breakdowns etc.
 

grebe

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THIS IS JUST FOR CASH GAMES.

*note I changed your blind structure on the $25 buy in for simplicity. You can do that to all of the games without making them play much different. Having too many small chips on the table is a pain....having nickles or dimes PLUS quarters is a great example of MOAR chips being less playable....but game simplification by equal blinds can also go for other buyins as well.

$10 Buy-ins (Blinds ????)
.05/.10 blinds would be best...that gives you 100 bb starting stacks
10 X .05
10 X .25
7 X 1
Rebuys with 1's and/or 5's

$25 Buy-ins (Blinds $.25/$0.25) (no .10 blinds)
8 X .25
13X 1
2 X 5
Rebuys with 5's and 25's (or 20s)

$50 Buy-ins (Blinds $0.25/$0.50)
12 x $0.25
13 x $1
7 x $5
Rebuys with 25's and 5's
$100 Buy-ins (Blinds $0.50/$1.00)
10 x $0.50
20 x $1
10 x $5
1 X 25
rebuys with 25's and 5's. Maybe $100's late.
 

grebe

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GROUP 1:
I would personally make the blinds .1/.1 and allow people to buy in up to $20 if they like. This makes your smallest chip a dime instead of a nickle and reduces the number needed by half. your denoms would be dime, quarter, dollar, and five. Anything more than this is not needed.

These are truly friendly stakes, and I wouldnt worry too much about cashout rules to start with....just let people play and cash out whenever. If you start having issues, then you may want to address that....maybe just tell people if they need to leave early, announce it to the group.
 

grebe

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RULES FOR CASH GAMES:

there is no winner take all or places. When people leave or the game breaks, you count up your chips and you cash them in for value. If you are in for $20 and you cash out $40, then you win $20 on the night. If you have $5 in chips for same buy in, well you lost $15.

As host, make sure you have change.
 

msuroo

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GROUP 1:
I would personally make the blinds .1/.1 and allow people to buy in up to $20 if they like. This makes your smallest chip a dime instead of a nickle and reduces the number needed by half. your denoms would be dime, quarter, dollar, and five. Anything more than this is not needed.

These are truly friendly stakes, and I wouldnt worry too much about cashout rules to start with....just let people play and cash out whenever. If you start having issues, then you may want to address that....maybe just tell people if they need to leave early, announce it to the group.

I’m gonna disagree with a few things in here. First, don’t play with a dime and a quarter in the same game. Either nickel/quarter or dime/half. Not being able to break down your second denomination is a disaster in change making. Re: “friendly stakes”, I would never presume as to how much certain stakes matter to certain people. Our $25 game means a lot to my musician friends who aren’t working right now. Also, consistency of rules application should exist separately from the stakes. I’m not suggesting that cash out rules are or aren’t necessary, but being lax about any rule because the stakes are smaller isn’t healthy for the game.
 

Hairy_Crocodile

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You are mixing cashgame with tourney elements.
As soon as you have something like winner takes all, you are playing a tournament.
Group 2's games are what have confused me the most, and why I have been so lost in the sauce on how these things run normally.

They do this for "cash games" :
-cash out at any time, no play time limit before you can cash
-varied buy-ins, which is generally fine I guess, its just weird seeing a player buy-in for $25 vs 2-3 people with $200 stacks starting.
-raising blinds every 30 minutes (never understood this)
-there has been talk of payout in final standings....which confuses me even more

So basically, its been an mixture of two ideas that have skewed my thought process of how its actually supposed to work. I'll try and talk to the host of group 2 and hash out the details to make things run like they are supposed to then. It might help run things smoother, and I dont think he will mind at all if I have suggestions/recommendations, we've been very good friends for years.

I’m gonna disagree with a few things in here. First, don’t play with a dime and a quarter in the same game. Either nickel/quarter or dime/half. Not being able to break down your second denomination is a disaster in change making. Re: “friendly stakes”, I would never presume as to how much certain stakes matter to certain people. Our $25 game means a lot to my musician friends who aren’t working right now. Also, consistency of rules application should exist separately from the stakes. I’m not suggesting that cash out rules are or aren’t necessary, but being lax about any rule because the stakes are smaller isn’t healthy for the game.
I'll be sure to write that in my notes, it's definitely a detail that I glossed over, I didn't think about the difficulty of making change like that

And my disappointment for the small stakes with group one is more a personal gripe than anything else. I feel like my decisions matter more with higher stakes, and I get alot of enjoyment out of higher stake games than $10-$25, but it's not the end of the world by any means. I'll still have fun with my friends regardless.

All of your responses have been very helpful, I hope you all know that your feedback has been valuable and I appreciate it so much.

Group 1 most likely will have a max of 8 players
Group 2 generally has 10 people max, but the host is willing to accommodate 2 tables if he has enough players. Generally 15/16 is his minimum magic number for busting out the second table. (His max at a table is 10, but will let more come for a second table if there is enough to make it worth it. Meaning if a minimum of five or six more are willing to come, then he will bust out the table. So for example, if he has 10, and two more people are interested, he generally wont invite them and split the players into the two tables of 6 players each)

-Will my set of 650 suffice for a full table of 10? I think that it should IMO.
-Are my chip amounts proper? Or do I need to add more colors or more chips to a certain color for balance?
-Would I need to upgrade to 800-1000 to accommodate larger events of 16, for example?
-If I need to upgrade for 2 tables, would it be wiser to just bite the bullet and get 1000 instead of 800 now in case we ever get to 2 tables again?
 

allforcharity

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If possible, try not to use the same chips for tourney and cash games. This warning goes double for non-denominated chips.

The first game looks rather like a 0.05/0.10 game. It sounds like a bit of a limp-fest (not that there's anything *wrong* with that! ;) ) You probably want to use
200 nickels
200 quarters
100-200 ones (depending on if it's more $10 or $20 per player)

Your second game is a mess. If people want to play tourney, then define it. Fixed buy-in with time limit for rebuys. Solid blind structure. I think you've got the chips you need for a T5 base T2K tournament with some rebuys. People are in for the long haul or they forfeit their buy-in. Use a handful of white for bounties, if you want.
100 Red (T5)
100 Green (T25)
100 Black (T100)
50 Purple (T500)
10/10/7/2 stacks with enough Black to colour up all Red and Green. Purple for rebuys.

If you want second game to be cash, then use 0.25/0.50 blinds. People can cash out whenever they want, reload whenever they want.
100 quarters (black)
200 ones (white)
200 fives (red)
100 twenty-fives (green) - use for reloads

It looks like you have all of the chips you need for 1 table of either.
 
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