Mixed Games - Converting Stakes (1 Viewer)

CrazyEddie

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Suppose your players are comfortable playing NLHE 2/4 with deep stacks (200+ bb). What sort of stakes would you use for the following games, in order to have the same comfort level with the stakes and about the same amount of money being won and lost over the course of an evening:

Pot Limit Omaha
No Limit Single Draw
No Limit Triple Draw
Fixed Limit Hold'em
Fixed Limit Omaha
Fixed Limit Single Draw
Fixed Limit Triple Draw
Fixed Limit Stud

?

I'm curious about how to scale the stakes between big bet and fixed limit, between conservative games like Hold'em and gamboly games like Omaha, and between four-round games vs two-round games like single-draw, so that they all roughly "play the same".

How about split-pot games? Do you think that warrants an adjustment in stakes vs. single-winner games?
 
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grebe

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So your players are used to buying in for 600-1k, correct?

For limit games, I would say your minimum would be $10/20 with $5 chips...maybe do a 3/6 chip game for $15/30. The games don't matter as much in limit....that's the stakes I would play with your group. I would make the 7 stud game Mississippi stud though to make it play a little faster.

Something else you can do with limit to bump up the stakes is run a kill or half kill....maybe do a 10/20 with a half kill to 15/30. This would be a good game.
 

CrazyEddie

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Thanks! That squares with what I had been thinking; I handwaved based on some numbers I've seen elsewhere and thought that 15/30 for fixed limit would be about right.

Any thoughts about single draw vs. triple draw? It seems like having only two streets to bet on instead of four would make a huge difference in how big the pots get. I'm not sure what the right way to compensate for that would be.
 

DrStrange

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2/4 NL is roughly comparable to 8/16 - 10/20 limit.

Noting that NL hold'em is a lot more comfortable game than NL 2-7 single draw or Limit triple draw. The game being played could make a difference in the stakes that work best.

No limit triple draw is going to leave a mark . . . . . the players will the biggest belly for variance will do better. The suckers will be slaughtered.

DrStrange
 

BEANO52

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As the big bet games are obviously a red chip game, my opinion on limit games:
5/10 would play to small.
20/40 is to large for $800-$1000 starting stacks.
15/30 is a possibility as the pots might be closer to the big bet games.
This has 10/20 limit written all over it IMHO.
Either way sounds fun!
 

grebe

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I have only played triple draw games as limit (I LOVE them, btw). Never played single draw at all. So many cool variations of badugi plus a 2-7 or A-5 low. Lots of action and decisions to be made....it's just a hoot. Of course, I am very inclined to play limit with mixed games over pot/nl.

I would think if you are playing 10/20 limit, enough money would be moving around to make it interesting.
 

CrazyEddie

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I just realized that @CrazyEddie listed NL TD. Yikes, uh, no.
I see that single-draw is usually played NL and triple-draw is usually played FL (although Abby's List has triple-draw under both big bet and fixed limit). Out of curiosity, what makes triple-draw unsuited for NL?
 

Legend5555

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I see that single-draw is usually played NL and triple-draw is usually played FL (although Abby's List has triple-draw under both big bet and fixed limit). Out of curiosity, what makes triple-draw unsuited for NL?
It's best suited to limit, fairly well suited to PL, and not great at NL. The thing with Triple Draw is that hand values tend to run really close. From what I've noticed watching mixed game tournies and such is that limit triple draw tends to play the biggest out of the limit games. The variance is just really big. And that tends to make it a bad big bet game.

The people that know the math and can tolerate the swings can REALLY punish people in big bet triple draw. It already plays big in limit form. Imagine holding 2347x. If you get it all in before even the first draw, you are about 44% to make a 7 in 3 draws, and 56% to make an 8. Meaning heads up even with just a bad 9, you can put any 1 card draw in a crazy spot when it might be justifiable to get it all in on a flip. And if you are both drawing the odds can be even closer.

One of two things can end up happening. Either people will play correctly and play much tighter when the nets are big. Or people won't realize this and people will just be flipping a ton.

The reason the game works so well NL as single draw is because of the extremely limited info and because the pots can only get "so" big. And the math is a bit clearer.
 

CrazyEddie

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For single draw NL, how would you set the stakes to correspond to 2/4 NLHE, given that there's only two streets of betting?
 

Payback

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8x the big blind had always been a very solid comparable in any mix game I've played therefore 15/30 would be ideal here. In addition to keep things a bit more level in the NL round is to play with a 100bb cap.
 

Legend5555

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For single draw NL, how would you set the stakes to correspond to 2/4 NLHE, given that there's only two streets of betting?
A few ways.

1. Blinds set to double the stakes.
2. A per player ante of half the SB, or a BB ante of BB+SB.
3. You can't limp first in, you must raise.
 

BGinGA

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My experience is that 25c/50c Pot-Limit, 1/2 No-Limit, and 5/10 Fixed-Limit all play about the same in terms of average pot size and bankroll exposure. Varies by game and player styles, however.
 

Legend5555

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My experience is that 25c/50c Pot-Limit, 1/2 No-Limit, and 5/10 Fixed-Limit all play about the same in terms of average pot size and bankroll exposure. Varies by game and player styles, however.
I assume you mean 25c/50c PL circus compared to 1/2 NLH?
 

BPB

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I was going to run a dealer’s choice game like this but all the no limit and pot limit games were going to be .25/.50 and the limit games would be 2/4 with 1/2 blinds and a .25 ante in the stud and draw games
 
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