I just had a baby ( and ramblings about health care) (1 Viewer)

[Marius L]

Times have changed over here as well obviously, but I think since the 1990s it's been more than 20 weeks of paid leave. Previously it was mainly the mother who took the leave, but it had been more and more popular for the father to partake as well. This was put into policy in the 90s as well I think. Starting with 2-4 weeks for dad, and it has changed a few times over the years. As I mentioned now 15 weeks of the total 49 weeks had to be for the father. (He can choose not to take it, but he can't pass it along to the mother)

 

[Frogzilla]

Do you get paid maternity/paternity leave in the US?

Unpaid is guaranteed (they have to let you off work and can’t eliminate your position in the meantime or take action against you for using it).

Paid is employer dependent. My wife got 5 months which is generous by US standards. I got 0, but 2-6 weeks paternity is fairly common

 

[Marius L]

Unpaid is guaranteed (they have to let you off work and can’t eliminate your position in the meantime or take action against you for using it).

Paid is employer dependent. My wife got 5 months which is generous by US standards. I got 0, but 2-6 weeks paternity is fairly common

5 months seems not too bad. I gotta say I don't like it being employer dependent though, as it seems unfair to the poorer portion of the population with shitty jobs. I can imagine a lot of people that would love to take unpaid leave just don't do it because they can't afford to.

 

[Marhault]

I work for the US government and the father gets 6 weeks leave, if you want it paid you have to use your sick or annual leave to cover it. For the most part you can use either of those leave categories as you see fit.

Mother's can essentially take whatever they want as long as their leave covers it as far as getting paid, unpaid I believe theirs is 9 or 12 weeks.

Something I've thought was weird for the full 15 years I've worked for the federal government is that they don't give you bereavement leave. When I worked for the state of Missouri you had to take a week, no it's, ands or buts. It was for your own mental security. But we get zero at the federal level. Of course we can just use our sick or annual leave if we want.

 

[Frogzilla]

5 months seems not too bad. I gotta say I don't like it being employer dependent though, as it seems unfair to the poorer portion of the population with shitty jobs. I can imagine a lot of people that would love to take unpaid leave just don't do it because they can't afford to.

The system absolutely favors skilled labor in fields that are in demand, and those folks have plenty of negotiating power and options for employment. Employers in tech fields for example have been getting more and more aggressive (year off, “pet”ernity leave for getting a dog, etc) as they are starving for talent. Capitalism, ya know

 

[Mojo1312]

This healthcare system you speak of couldn't possibly work.

Agree. More fake news. Fact. Norway has -government run- death panels.

Also a fact. Norwegians would love to move to a great country where people are far more likely to battle drug addiction, live in poverty and lose their lives to gun violence, where they pay for their healthcare and get no paid parental leave or subsidized daycare, where there is light of the right tiki torch marches and fewer radical socialists -- which obviously leads to suffering, misery and decay.

Marius, we welcome you!

(Non-Norwegians need not apply.)

 

[Frogzilla]

where they pay for their healthcare

Every countries’ citizens pay for their healthcare...

 

[Mojo1312]

Every countries’ citizens pay for their healthcare...

Citizens also pay for libraries, fireman, law enforcement, roads, bridges and a space force.

 

[David O]

I have been blessed with pretty good insurance. Some of my co-workers think it sucks but it is for protecting us from the large hospital bills. People often look at insurance covering the small things such as going in for a fever. That is not when you see the actual value of good insurance. In my case my bills for six months, which happened only 16 months ago, were ~$500,000.00 (F#$K cancer). With insurance my total out of pocket was only $7,000.00.

 

[gopherblue]

@Marius L: Mazel tov. Boy or girl? Name?

Glad all are healthy and happy.

 

[CraigT78]

16 months ago, were ~$500,000.00 (F#$K cancer). With insurance my total out of pocket was only $7,000.00

Let it sink in for a minute that in the richest nation on the planet - that this statement brings a round of head nods. I agree that $7,000 for a $500k+ hospital bill out of pocket is considered 'good' in the US. But a bill of this size in so many other countries would cause a heat attack. I, for one, would rather pay double a year in additional taxes (above my insurance preimums) to ensure ALL American's had healthcare coverage - than to pay it to BCBS so they could put their name on another shiny skyscraper. Prove me wrong (but please do so in the politics thread ) Carry on.

 

[abby99]

Congrats @Marius L. This is such great news.

 

[CdnBeerLover]

Congrats @Marius L !

 

[David O]

Let it sink in for a minute that in the richest nation on the planet - that this statement brings a round of head nods. I agree that $7,000 for a $500k+ hospital bill out of pocket is considered 'good' in the US. But a bill of this size in so many other countries would cause a heat attack. I, for one, would rather pay double a year in additional taxes (above my insurance preimums) to ensure ALL American's had healthcare coverage - than to pay it to BCBS so they could put their name on another shiny skyscraper. Prove me wrong (but please do so in the politics thread ) Carry on.

I was just making a statement. I am not into debating in a forum. I was happy with my outcome but other may not. I just wish the money spent would have cured my wife! Love you brother!

 

[moose]

Also in Ontario there is a direct $800 medical surtax.

I will add that my wife got 8 months paid maternity leave at 86% of full salary. If I had taken paternity instead I would have got 10 months at 90%. For some unknown reason I couldn't convince my wife....

 

[Payback]

Congrats on the little one! My youngest just started college, so I'm feeling old.

Just don't tell @Payback about your healthcare system, or he might be moving to Norway! I need my dealer buddy to stay in the US....

I wish. I hear good teachers are actually respected in Europe, which alone makes me think about moving. Don't worry though I think Mrs. Payback would never go for anything in EU even if I think it would be pretty cool. Culture, whatever.


I'd love to had not worried about the 5 figure medical expenses I've paid (will be paying) out of pocket the last two years in addition to my premiums. I had a buy a washer/dryer today, and need to buy a new car for the wife as well. That $ would go a long way towards that!

I'm taking 6 weeks off with the baby in October/November under FMLA. I'm fortunate enough to have enough sick time to cover 4 weeks of that, but will be taking 2 weeks unpaid. Then any additional day I take between December and June will be unpaid as well. In a way I feel lucky that I can do that, but either way it doesn't feel like enough. Raising a baby the first time was hard enough (and he was a good one). I can't even imagine how draining it will be working full time, away from all family if needed.

 

[saleen121212]

I feel like this should be in the politics thread. Grats on the baby!

 

[FordPickup92]

Congrats on your new baby!!!!
The US system is garbage.... nothing new unfortunately. At least Obamacare is gone...no more required health insurance and fines when you dont have it! Happy to hear some places take care of their tax paying citizens!!

 

[ChipEnvy]

Agree. More fake news. Fact. Norway has death panels.

Also a fact. Norwegians would love to move to a great country where people are far more likely to battle drug addiction, live in poverty and lose their lives to gun violence, where they pay for their healthcare and get no paid parental leave or subsidized daycare, where there is light of the right tiki torch marches and fewer radical socialists -- which obviously leads to suffering, misery and decay.

Marius, we welcome you!

(Non-Norwegians need not apply.)

I am glad my joke did not go unrecognized.

 

[APatHand]

Congrats.
I guess that is why Norwegian beer is 40kr/glass

 

[1A25R]

Congratulation for the Baby @Marius L !

Fear sells.

So true




Swiss Healthcare system;

By law, you must have a health insurance. If you can't pay it the government pay it for you.
Mandatory health insurance provides cover for illness, maternity and accidents and offers all insureds the same range of benefits. Insurance providers must treat insureds equally, making no distinction according to their state of health or indicators of their health. This applies particularly to acceptance, the choice of insurance type and reimbursement of benefits.
Mandatory health insurance is funded by insureds’ contributions (premiums), insureds’ contributions to costs (deductible, retention fee, contribution to the costs of a hospital stay) and subsidies from the federal government and the Cantons (premium reduction).
The premiums charged by an insurer must cover its costs (income from capital may be included when calculating the cost of premiums).
Premiums do not depend on revenue and vary according to insurer, the insured’s place of residence and the type of insurance (level of deductible, restrictions on choice of healthcare providers).
Insureds on a low income, children and young adults in full-time education or training often pay reduced premiums. The Cantons decide who is entitled to a reduction.adults in full-time education or training. The resources provided by mandatory health insurance may only be only be used for purposes associated with that insurance.

For the services provided by doctors or physicians as well as chiropractors, there is no exclusive list of all compulsory services . The basic principle is that the compulsory health care insurance reimburses all examinations and treatments carried out

Medicinal products, laboratory analyses, aids and equipment, prescribed by medical doctors and provided by other health professionals, dental treatment, as well as medical care related to maternity or preventive health are set down in exhaustive positive lists. Services not included on these lists are not covered and need not to be reimbursed by the compulsory health insurance (a so-called closed catalog of services).

If you want, you can add a top-up insurance ( the price is about 5% to 10% of the mandatory) and then some additional features are covered like private room in hospitals and the list of doctors is extended to cover acupuncture, anthroposophical medicine, traditional Chinese Medicine (TCM), homoeopathy and phytotherapy

 

[Marius L]

Thanks everybody! I appreciate it It's a girl. We call her Marit, named after my gf's grandmother.

And yes, the Norwegian healthcare is obviously not "free". We do pay taxes. There's income tax. There is a also a wealth tax (0.85% on your net wealth) this tax only applies to people worth over USD 200 000. Theres also pretty steep taxes on alcohol and tobacco, everything with sugar in it and gas.

My point is though that I am very satisfied with how the system here works. Every citizen pay a fixed amount of money to the government every year. This gives all residents some basic rights such as:
Healthcare
Education (from first degree to uni)
Sick leave
49 weeks paid parental leave
A safety net if you get laid off
Subsidized kindergarten
Probably a lot more

Maybe (probably) some years you will end up paying more in taxes than you "get back from the system". Some will even do this all of their life. People here are mostly content about it though, and think it's a fair system. most people will have experienced stages in life when they needed help and got it, without having to go begging to their friends and family on top of their original problem.

There is much less economic stress and pressure than in the US. Some examples:
-Never will you be in a position where you can't afford to send your kid to college. (It's like 50$ a semester)
-Never will you skip doctors appointments because your are scared of the cost
-Never will your family be economically struggling because you get laid off
-Never will you be economically in trouble because you or a family member gets cancer or other Illnesses.

These things make life feel a lot safer.

When discussing this preciously with an American friend of mine, we came to the conclusion that you can get richer in the US than in Norway. (the American dream, right) however you can also be a lot poorer. In Norway everyone is a bit more equal. There's almost no extremes. Most people here have a very pleasant life. Most everyone own their own house, have a decent paying job, 5 weeks holiday yearly and the money to travel. Many have a cabin by the sea or in the mountains, most families have a car or two, our young adults have the opportunity to pursue whatever education they want. There's very little poverty, and there are fewer ultra rich.

I do realize that this thread might be heading for the politics forum. My intention was just to give you an inside view from a "communist" country. (Lol, that is what (some of) the US media calls us, right?)

I'm just very surprised that these basic things aren't something the American population would want.

 

[Mojo1312]

Wait a minute Marius. You don't want to escape your communist system and move to our country? But our President said socialism leads to suffering, misery and decay. I don't understand. Why aren't you seeking asylum?

Oh, wait... https://happyplanetindex.org/countries/norway. Never mind. I guess you won't realize how miserable and unhappy you really are until you have Fox News, so keep on drinking that socialist kool-aid.

 

[1A25R]

Haa.... yes ....... FOX

 

[APatHand]

Haa.... yes ....... FOX

They forgot New Mexico!

 

[Jeevansluck]

@Marius L

Wow! Congratulations!

It's a life changing event. It was for me anyways.

Changed my life's direction and gave me a new sense of purpose as the little one came into the world.

Enjoy these wonderful beginnings. Get away from work if you can.

I was able to take 6 Months off and both my partner and I were able to thoroughly enjoy and share the work. It was the best 6 months man!

They start to grow and before you know it, precious time starts to slip by. Make sure to seize these precious times.

All the best to you and the mother!

 

[slisk250]

Me and my girlfriend of eight years just had our first baby, and it really got me thinking about the Norwegian health care system. Considering health care has been a hot topic in the US for a long time I figured I wanted to share it with you guys.

After reading about several others here on PCF with news like this in the last couple of years I suddenly started thinking about how this experience differs from country to country, and I just couldn't help but be amazed at how awesome our Norwegian social democractic welfare state is.

Before I start with the pregnancy stuff, here's a little introduction to our health care system:
In Norway we have (basically) free universal health care for all our residents. Doesn't matter if you're rich or poor, live in the North or South, everyone gets the care and help they need. There are some very minor fees for regular doctors appointments (like 20-30$ for a regular check up), but for the people that for some reason needs to have more than just regular check ups/ gets hospitalized/ need more expensive meds/ are in an accident or whatever else health related - the government will pay everything that's above 2390 Norwegian kroner (about 300$). That number is for the whole of 2019, so when you reach that limit, you still get exactly the same care as everybody else, but you don't need to pay anything for the rest of the year.

This goes for:

Prescription drugs,
Hospital bills,
Doctors appointments,
You name it

An example from my life:
When I was in sixth grade my mom got cancer for the first time, and over the years she has battled the illness several times since it keeps coming back. She is still doing good, but she has been taking meds daily for at least the last ten years, and over the years she has had several different periods of chemotherapy, surgery and longer hospitalizations. I can only imagine the price tag of all this, but luckily it was never a topic of discussion. She always got to focus on what was important, namely getting better! Financial stuff was never an issue. I know that in the US most people (?) have some sort of health insurance, but from what I have heard the hospital bills still tend to be crazily high.


Now for pregnancy and child birth there are some special rules here. It's completely free of charge and thus not a part of the yearly medical spending limit I mentioned earlier.

What this includes is different from case to case, depending on whether or not there are complications with the pregnancy or after birth. Regardless it is free. The standard is:
- Monthly checkup from doctor or midwife throughout the pregnancy.
- ultrasound in week 18.
- extra checkups late in the pregnancy
- breastfeeding class
- "preparing to be parents"-class
- 2 nights in the hospital after giving birth
- regular vaginal birth or C-section based on need (we can't choose c-section unless there is a medical need for it)
- different sorts of painkillers, like epidural based on need/wants
+ Whatever is needed if there's complications

All this for the solid price of 0.00 USD.
I read somewhere online that someone got really crazy hospital bills after giving birth in the US, but not sure what a standard price is if you have insurance. Anyone care to share their experience with this?

Spending a few years on this forum it seems its pretty regular that someone on here has either family with medical issues or have medical issues themselves that they have trouble paying for. It must be really hard to have to rely on help from friends or even strangers in an already extremely though situation to make ends meet. It really sadens me to see, as I don't think the US system is very fair. It's perplexing to be honest, with all the kind souls here constantly voluntaring and organizing sales and events to help out people in need, but it still seems many people don't want a health care system that just helps people by default.

Now of course the money for all this comes from somewhere, and yes we pay taxes, and you bet I'll happily keep paying them knowing I'm taken care of if something happens to me or my family.

Thanks for reading. And by the way, if you made it this far, everything is good with the baby and I'm super stoked for this new chapter in my life!

And one of 3 very real reasons my wife and I fled the USA. Low wages, high insurance, high daycare. We would have been bankrupt.

 

[Coyote]

And one of 3 very real reasons my wife and I fled the USA. Low wages, high insurance, high daycare. We would have been bankrupt.

Solution: Norwegian aid to the lower 48 American Countries (ac. to Fox Channel)

 

[Marius L]

@Marius L

Wow! Congratulations!

It's a life changing event. It was for me anyways.

Changed my life's direction and gave me a new sense of purpose as the little one came into the world.

Enjoy these wonderful beginnings. Get away from work if you can.

I was able to take 6 Months off and both my partner and I were able to thoroughly enjoy and share the work. It was the best 6 months man!

They start to grow and before you know it, precious time starts to slip by. Make sure to seize these precious times.

All the best to you and the mother!

Thanks a lot! I am currently home and will have at least 15 weeks, but probably a bit more. I really do look forward to it, and we have of course already started figuring out how the little one works she's 11 days now, and doing awesome. I can imagine time flies. I feels she's substantially bigger already, lol. Everyone I talk to try to remind me about this: "enjoy every moment of it, before you know it she's of to college." Guess I'll try my best!

 

[Saoliver]

Thanks a lot! I am currently home and will have at least 15 weeks, but probably a bit more. I really do look forward to it, and we have of course already started figuring out how the little one works she's 11 days now, and doing awesome. I can imagine time flies. I feels she's substantially bigger already, lol. Everyone I talk to try to remind me about this: "enjoy every moment of it, before you know it she's of to college." Guess I'll try my best!

Congratulations! Time will go by so fast. Take a ton of photos. My little one is turning 4. It feels like he just got here yesterday. We also haven't slept much in 4 years, so I am looking forward to that changing.