How bad did I play this? (1 Viewer)

Daddy N

Daddy N

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Final 6 players in a 12 person tournament, Hero and Villain both biggest stacks about 50bb deep. Hero has been playing tight and won a few good pots lately but has not shown down many hands since moving to this table. Villain has been in many pots and is a solid player. Hero opens with :ad::td: 3x big blind, villain calls in position, everyone else folds.
Flop: :7s::qc::ah:
Hero bets 3/4 Pot, Villain calls
Turn: :qd:
What now?
 
I’m probably checking for pot control that short, and it’s not a great card if there’s a couple big aces and a lot of queens that call your cbet on the flop.

side note, I think a 3/4 pot bet on the flop is way too big, you have a good but not great ace on a dry no-draw board, I’m going with 1/3 to 1/2 pot max, especially given short effective stacks.
 
So far it seems fine. I'd open ace 10 suited 6 handed. I would also usually continuation bet when an ace hit the flop.

Check or bet seems fine on the turn. I would lean toward a check when out of position.
 
Hero opens with :ad::td: 3x big blind, villain calls in position, everyone else folds.
Flop: :7s::qc::ah:
Hero bets 3/4 Pot, Villain calls
Turn: :qd:
Hero Checks, Villain puts our a 1/3 pot bet, Hero Calls
River::kd:
What now?
 
Daddy N said:
Hero opens with :ad::td: 3x big blind, villain calls in position, everyone else folds.
Flop: :7s::qc::ah:
Hero bets 3/4 Pot, Villain calls
Turn: :qd:
Hero Checks, Villain puts our a 1/3 pot bet, Hero Calls
River::kd:
What now?
Click to expand...

Intersting! I would be scared of him having Jack Ten now, but I think you are committed. Go to show down baby!! Play some poker!
 
I assume there are no antes, and as such raising to 3bb preflop with only 50bb is more than necessary. 2.5bb is likely more than enough IMO.

So pot is 7.5bb going to flop. And you bet 5.5bb. More than necessary on such a dry board. The only hands that can really call that size are 77, Qs, and other As. A decent player isn't going to take a card with a gutter here for that size.

On turn we are now losing to a Q and we're already losing to 77. So we can only beat a lower A at this point. Most likely a lower A (and even AJ) will check back this turn if we check. If they bet, I'm not sure what we beat that is betting for value. And I'm not sure what bluffs they could even have.

Check this turn looking to fold to a reasonable sized bet. Possibly call a smallish bet. But if we do call a small bet, give up to another bet on river unless an A comes.

If goes check check, look to check call most rivers.
 
I would check and hope for a check back. I don't know what you beat if you bet and get called (a weaker ace? not likely in his calling range on the river), and the turn play does show weakness on your part. Check, and reevaluate if villain bets.
 
Honestly, this is why I didn't like the turn check. If I were Villain I may make that turn bet in that position regardless of my hand. You don't really have much more info now and you like your hand less now than before. You are going to check and he is going 1/3 bet again I assume.
 
Eloe2000 said:
Honestly, this is why I didn't like the check. If I were Villain I may make that turn bet in that position regardless of my hand. You don't really have much more info now and you like your hand less now than before. You are going to check and he is going 1/3 bet again I assume.
Click to expand...
But what hands as the player in position would you even have that you took to the turn as played?
 
Last edited:
Legend5555 said:
But what hands as the player in position would you even have that you took to the turn as played?
Click to expand...

77, KQs (hearts?), QJs, AXs, JTs come to mind as potentials...but calling the big flop raise with some of those drawing holdings may be a bit loose.
 
gkitt80 said:
77, KQs (hearts?), QJs, AXs, JTs come to mind as potentials...but calling the big flop raise with some of those drawing holdings may be a bit loose.
Click to expand...
So the villains range is likely weighted heavily toward value hands such that betting again on the turn doesn't really accomplish much. It's unlikely villain has a Broadway gutshot. And if they do, they have very few outs and will likely just fold to another bet. But villain can have most Broadway Qs, suited As (a lot of which we can beat but aren't likely to get 2 more streets of value from), and 77. So the continue range has us killed, and the range we beat either can't handle pressure, or can't be taken for 2 more streets of value. The only hands we are targeting for value are weaker As. Those have no outs to win against us. We can get that value on the river. So why bet turn?

Edited for bad swipe typing
 
Last edited:
Preflop good.

Flop, I think in this stack situation I check flop so that the hand doesn’t get out of control. I’m not pounding three streets to get it in against the other big stack. We can start betting on turn if it checks through or just call down comfortably if opponent starts firing

Turn, given flop play, easy check/call especially for that size.

River, is check and if villain jams we have a fairly tough decision...and we kind of need to know stack depths, who covers who, and positions preflop
 
Frogzilla said:
Preflop good.

Flop, I think in this stack situation I check flop so that the hand doesn’t get out of control. I’m not pounding three streets to get it in against the other big stack. We can start betting on turn if it checks through or just call down comfortably if opponent starts firing

Turn, given flop play, easy check/call especially for that size.

River, is check and if villain jams we have a fairly tough decision...and we kind of need to know stack depths, who covers who, and positions preflop
Click to expand...
You bring up a good point. While I didn't mention it, this is the type of flop I check a marginal A on from time to time. Though the floor should favor is us a good bit such that betting I think should be there majority play.

OP did mention 50bb stacks, 6 handed, villain in position. ATs is an open from any pos 6 handed IMO. So I think the actual positions don't affect the hand too much. But knowing the other player stacks would be nice so we know if we were ever in danger of getting jammed over.
 
Agree with too large of a bet after the flop. I'd bet 1/2 pot especially in a short stacked tournament.

Checking is fine after the turn, but with that king coming in off the river, I'd bet/fold. Try to represent the nut straight. I'd range villain on a straight draw. If he re-raises, I probably fold. Betting aggressively on the river may get him to back off of his hand for you to take it down.
 
As played I’m check folding river to almost any bet, nobody is going to be trying to bet a worse ace on the river, most players will just take their showdown unless this player is clueless
 
If villain has been flat calling your bets, that's my justification for going in hard after the river. How large did he bet on the river? If it was a smallish bet, I'd have re-raised him as a smallish bet would represent a two pair at best from his end. You're in the early position; a straight draw heavy card coming out on the river allows you to be aggrayssive (in Teddy KGB's voice) to try and back him off his hand.
 
It was a big bet. Something like 3/4 pot.

It sounds like the only better play would have been betting the turn, but I think it would have been called and then checking the river would have had the same outcome.
 
Daddy N said:
It was a big bet. Something like 3/4 pot.

It sounds like the only better play would have been betting the turn, but I think it would have been called and then checking the river would have had the same outcome.
Click to expand...
It stinks that you had early position, but I think checking the turn was the right move if you're trying to represent a straight draw. Villain would have snap called regardless of if you bet or not.

A 3/4 pot bet on the river was a good fold. It's a semi bluff that worked out for villain. It happens.
 
I like a flop check a lot here. You’re not going to be able to go three streets for value. Dry board, let him rep something. He will have a max of 6 outs against you if behind. He’ll likely value bet himself with a weaker ace and you can bet the turn if he checks back flop to target his 2nd pair type hands.

I’ll bet the flop some of time, especially if villain is on the passive side, but I think we need to go smaller, like 40-50% pot. You want to keep his calling range wide.

As played, I would check/call turn, certainly a 1/3 pot bet. Would expect him to bet bigger with a Q or 777 to set up for a river shove.

River is kind of tough. Our hand looks a lot like what it is and he still bets pretty big. His hand doesn’t make a lot of sense though so I might shrug and call but I think it’s very player dependent.
 
Pre-flop positions also matter. I’ll give him a tighter calling range if it’s utg vs utg+1 compared to co vs btn for instance.
 
Frogzilla said:
Not this villain
Click to expand...

Yeah, based on results that’s probably true. But op said that villain is solid and I’m trying to ignore that it turns out villain’s play in this hand suggests otherwise
 

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