Help with hands for GTO optimisation (1 Viewer)

[BetABet]

I'm in panic so I have to ask!
I’m working on a thesis project regarding mathematical studies of NL hold em game theory as well as a comparison with real life actions and results.
As a part of this I need access to real hands for real players and now, when I’ve already done half of the work, I realise that such information is almost impossible to find.
All I can get is hand histories which do not show hands until showdown which is not good enough for my purposes.

Anyways, I’ve been googling for 15 hours and not been able to find the information I need so is a bit nervous I’ll have to redo everything now.
Does anyone know any place where this information would be possible to get?
Alternatively if someone can send a few of their own hands to me(Iam9873@hotmail.com) so I could do it in a small scale I would be beyond grateful!
They will not be shared or shown in any way.

 

[boltonguy]

If you have PokerTracker 4 I can export you some hands from my DB. You can then import them into your PT4 DB.
I play on Ignition and download hands with hole cards after 24 hours.
I have over 53k hands so let me know how many you need.

 

[BetABet]

@boltonguy
Wow thanks so much!
I have poker tracker 4 on my mac so should be able to import them.
If you could export 3-4 thousand hands that would be amazing!!

 

[Rakrul]

The only ones who has full HH on hands with no showdown are the poker-sites themselves. Even getting anonymized HHs from them to a research project sounds very hard, but you could try to contact them and see what they say.

 

[boltonguy]

@Rakrul Ignition makes all hole cards from all hands in a session 24 hours after playing, even those hands that do not get to showdown.
Here is an example:

Ignition Hand #4065164470 Zone Poker ID#1692 HOLDEMZonePoker No Limit - 2021-01-28 20:51:43
Table Info: Version: 1, Type: Ignition, Stakes: $0.10-$0.25
Seat 1: Small Blind [ME] ($26.59 in chips)
Seat 2: Big Blind ($25.12 in chips)
Seat 3: UTG ($87.40 in chips)
Seat 4: UTG+1 ($49.33 in chips)
Seat 5: UTG+2 ($18.83 in chips)
Seat 6: Dealer ($28.67 in chips)
Dealer : Set dealer [6]
Player Info: Seat2: P2-941bfc362472bcc3b30f4902d5867163, Seat3: P3-31509f8abcf3cd6f3ee73354df014beb, Seat4: P4-ce242f7092cc829110cf644f03b92c52, Seat5: P5-3ddffe93408ed870dce652837b615f17, Seat6: P6-4fd430fe6515eb75ae57c3de3e483ec9
Small Blind [ME] : Small Blind $0.10
Big Blind : Big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Small Blind [ME] : Card dealt to a spot [Ad 7h]
Big Blind : Card dealt to a spot [Tc Kd]
UTG : Card dealt to a spot [6s Js]
UTG+1 : Card dealt to a spot [7s 3s]
UTG+2 : Card dealt to a spot [5c Td]
Dealer : Card dealt to a spot [Ah Ts]
UTG : Folds
UTG : Leave(Auto)
UTG+2 : Leave(Auto)
UTG+1 : Folds
UTG+1 : Leave(Auto)
UTG+2 : Folds
Dealer : Raises $0.75 to $0.75
Small Blind [ME] : Folds
Small Blind [ME] : Leave(Auto)
Big Blind : Calls $0.50
*** FLOP *** [9c 4d 8c]
Big Blind : Checks
Dealer : Checks
*** TURN *** [9c 4d 8c] [6d]
Big Blind : Bets $1
Dealer : Folds
Dealer : Leave(Auto)
Big Blind : Return uncalled portion of bet $1
Big Blind : Does not show [Tc Kd] (High Card)
Big Blind : Hand result $1.52
Big Blind : Leave(Auto)
Enter(Auto)
Enter(Auto)
Enter(Auto)
Enter(Auto)
Enter(Auto)
Enter(Auto)
*** SUMMARY ***

 

[boltonguy]

@BetABet just emailed you an export with 3600 hands from this month.
I reserve all rights to commercial usage of these hands. You may use these hands for non-commercial purposes.
Good luck!

 

[Josh Kifer]

@BetABet just emailed you an export with 3600 hands from this month.
I reserve all rights to commercial usage of these hands. You may use these hands for non-commercial purposes.
Good luck!

@boltonguy watching tv

Mcdonald's commercial comes on....

.....With the new spicy Mcnuggs.... And a 4 of hearts hits the river.

@boltonguy - that sonofabitch.....

Bah dah da da daaaahhhh....

 

[BetABet]

The only ones who has full HH on hands with no showdown are the poker-sites themselves. Even getting anonymized HHs from them to a research project sounds very hard, but you could try to contact them and see what they say.

Good idea, I can try to contact them and see what they say at least.

@BetABet just emailed you an export with 3600 hands from this month.
I reserve all rights to commercial usage of these hands. You may use these hands for non-commercial purposes.
Good luck!

Thanks so much, you're a star! I've downloaded them and they seem to work. Will not commercialise the hands in any way!

 

[Rakrul]

@Rakrul Ignition makes all hole cards from all hands in a session 24 hours after playing, even those hands that do not get to showdown.[...]

Oh, didn't know that!

 

[Mojo1312]

"Every hand Revealed" by Gus Hansen is a fun read.

 

[BetABet]

"Every hand Revealed" by Gus Hansen is a fun read.

@Mojo1312 Thanks for the tip.!
Is there any sections about a percentual likelihood which people play different hands from different positiones etc. in there?

 

[boltonguy]

Check out Upswing Poker for range charts with hands to open by position. Most hands in the range chart are opened 100% from that position.

 

[Mojo1312]

@Mojo1312 Thanks for the tip.!
Is there any sections about a percentual likelihood which people play different hands from different positiones etc. in there?

People bring their own playing styles to the table, which is part of what makes the game interesting.

 

[BetABet]

Check out Upswing Poker for range charts with hands to open by position. Most hands in the range chart are opened 100% from that position.

Sorry missed the email-notification and did not check for a while.

I mapped the probability to win with the probability to play as a first step and sent it to your email along with stats on how often the different hands were played in general.
On the way of doing a larger work now to calculate the estimated value for each hand combo to the play prob. as well and then combine those two to see which one that influences people pre flop actions the most and also in which situations people most commonly play -ev hands pre-flop so those can be mitigated.
I think that's when this will be interesting for real and I'll send it once it's done but might be an additional 1.5-2 months

For calls/raises the data is somewhat reliable I think. For 3-bets it's way too little to draw any secure conclusions (people don't do it nearly as much as I thought when asking for hands).

If you want to send additional hands so I could analyse that as well I would be more then grateful as it would do the result of both my thesis and your end report better.
If not I'm super grateful for what I got already.

 

[boltonguy]

I'd be happy to send more hands - maybe we can help each other. I took a look at the XLS you sent - do you have a way of automatically extracting data form the DB? I would be very interesting in extracting Villain hole cards to correlate with actions (like what is Villain's UTG limping range) but in the PT4 tool itself it is challenging to write this type of report as everything is very Hero-centric if that makes sense. Would you be doing anything with the DB that would help me get this type of data? Thx!

 

[BetABet]

Perfect, yes I can do that.

You see it in the file I sent you.
uR-C is unraised pot: call (hence a limp) uR-R is unraised pot: raise, uR-F is unraised pot fold.
same with R-R: raised pot raise(hence a 3-bet), R-C raised pot call, R-F Raised pot fold.

Is that what you want but by position?

I have a script to generate it so can do it by position as well it's just that the amount of hands at the moment is a bit too small to get relialble data by position since we have fewer hands to analyse in that case compared to if we look at the total amount of hands.

 

[BetABet]

I'd be happy to send more hands - maybe we can help each other. I took a look at the XLS you sent - do you have a way of automatically extracting data form the DB? I would be very interesting in extracting Villain hole cards to correlate with actions (like what is Villain's UTG limping range) but in the PT4 tool itself it is challenging to write this type of report as everything is very Hero-centric if that makes sense. Would you be doing anything with the DB that would help me get this type of data? Thx!

Please tell me if this is what you want and also send more hands for a more accurate report if possible.
I'm starting to have all the scripts ready for analysing the data so would be great to have maximum number of hands before doing any conclusions, then I could also create stats for different actions and ranges based upon peoples playing positions.
Thanks!

 

[boltonguy]

Just emailed you 30,700 hands at 25NL Zone on Ignition. What i would be interested is the following:

• what hands are being limped in early position (LJ, HJ)
• what hands are being 3-bet in all positions, by position
• what hands are calling 3 bets in all positions, by position

would be good to remove Hero's actions from those stats

If that doesnt make sense, please LMK

 

[boltonguy]

In a perfect world output like this would be preferred. This is an example of my RFI (raise first in) range form the CO:

 

[BetABet]

Thanks!
I'll try to create something like that.
I'll get back to you