Cash Game Help! Family game has grown too expensive. (1 Viewer)

[Jampiece]

So we have played weekly for a few years. Some if us are retired and some are still working paycheck to paycheck and some are working towards retirement. You get what im saying different financial situations.

We originally started at $20 buyins but a few guys have turned into real poker fans and enjoy casinos and card rooms.

Now its multiple $40 bullets and some nights several people have won or lost over $200. 10x what we agreed to when we started up.

I'm in a situation im ok to lose $100/week but much of my family is not.

Anyone dealt with this before?

We are going to try a tournament tomorrow but we all come to play so nobody has been a big fan of waiting for the tournament to finish when we've played before.

 

[tabletalker7]

Are you receiving complaints from other players about the jacked up stakes?

 

[Jampiece]

Are you receiving complaints from other players about the jacked up stakes?

Yes multiple people have made it very obvious. One (the oldest guy in the Family) even said he wont be coming tomorrow because it doesnt feel like a family thing anymore...

 

[upNdown]

Are you playing .25/.50 with $40 bullets? That sort of shallow game encourages lots of buy-ins. Maybe lower the stakes and get more chips on the table for the same money

 

[Rhodeman77]

Switch to limit or spread limit. Playing pot limit or no limit is always going to have bigger swings of money

 

[tabletalker7]

Yes multiple people have made it very obvious. One (the oldest guy in the Family) even said he wont be coming tomorrow because it doesnt feel like a family thing anymore...

Sounds to me like you need to replace the few players who are obviously playing above the group. Others will say switching to limit will change things but it really won't. Some of your players are more comfortable with putting more money on the table than others. They need to be separated. Before the virus I had a 5c/10c group and a .25/.50 group because of the exact problem you are dealing with now.

 

[Jampiece]

We play dealers choice 5c antes. When we are 8 or less handed we play lots of stud games pot limit with the button sitting out when needed. If it's a holdem game its .05/.05 but what used to be a quarter opening bet is now a .75 bet.

We are all related so it seams harder to uninvite the aggressive than it would be with friends or co-workers.

I thought maybe limiting the buyin and adding a 10 minute timeout or something if you bust. Adds some sort of penalty that the "lack of action" takes away. Idk though. It's frustrating to see the fun disappear in something we've done off and on since i was a kid.

 

[tabletalker7]

We play dealers choice 5c antes. When we are 8 or less handed we play lots of stud games pot limit with the button sitting out when needed. If it's a holdem game its .05/.05 but what used to be a quarter opening bet is now a .75 bet.

We are all related so it seams harder to uninvite the aggressive than it would be with friends or co-workers.

I thought maybe limiting the buyin and adding a 10 minute timeout or something if you bust. Adds some sort of penalty that the "lack of action" takes away. Idk though. It's frustrating to see the fun disappear in something we've done off and on since i was a kid.

I am not saying completely uninvite them - use this as an excuse to expand your player database. Run separate games. You have players who want small stakes, and players who want bigger stakes than the others. You are currently running one group - it may be time to run 2 groups!

 

[shorticus]

.05/.10 is worth it
Limit hold em might be worth a shot as well.

If the money is the issue and the time is most relevant a deep stack tourney is the way to go with longer blind levels. That will definitely limit the losses. You could even allow rebuys and lower the entry fee.

 

[Ethan]

Sounds to me like you need to replace the few players who are obviously playing above the group. Others will say switching to limit will change things but it really won't. Some of your players are more comfortable with putting more money on the table than others. They need to be separated. Before the virus I had a 5c/10c group and a .25/.50 group because of the exact problem you are dealing with now.

Yeppp.

I have a “2/5” guy in my .25/.25 group and every session he is either up or down $300 and doesn’t care. The players down $50 every session start to get agitated.

 

[Jampiece]

Switch to limit or spread limit. Playing pot limit or no limit is always going to have bigger swings of money

I've never played spread limit. How would you set that up with $20 buyins and chip denoms of 5c, 25c, $1, $5

 

[tabletalker7]

Yeppp.

I have a “2/5” guy in my .25/.25 group and every session he is either up or down $300 and doesn’t care. The players down $50 every session start to get agitated.

I completely understand the problem. A guy has a bad night on my 5c/10c game he loses $30. A bad night on my .25/.50 game can easily cost a guy $200+. Switching to a limit game alienates the "playing bigger" people, and letting things continue alienates the rest of the group. That's why I split them up.

 

[Jampiece]

Yeppp.

I have a “2/5” guy in my .25/.25 group and every session he is either up or down $300 and doesn’t care. The players down $50 every session start to get agitated.

Yes we have 2 of these. 1 is a decent player the other a puntaholic and while he usually loses others get caught in the crossfire.

There are some old heads in the group that will never relearn to play "new" poker.

 

[upNdown]

Yeppp.

I have a “2/5” guy in my .25/.25 group and every session he is either up or down $300 and doesn’t care. The players down $50 every session start to get agitated.

I hate that guy

 

[DrStrange]

@Rhodeman77 is right on target. Don't play big bet poker, play limit or {small} spread limit poker.

This fits in just fine with the feel of a family game. No one gets blown off a hand. No one goes bust early and sits out unhappy.

Also, limit poker rewards luck more than big bet poker does. This means everyone has a chance to be a winner any given week. And overall the loss rate will be more moderate for the weaker players.

This game sounds like it is losing its "fun". That is no good. Let go of the "no limit" mind set. Dealer's choice tends to be especially harsh played as big bet poker.

Play limit, have fun, no one gets slaughtered. The rich and the better players can't run over a "pocket change" limit game. -=- DrStrange

PS So for a $20 buy in game, I might play $0.05 to $0.25 spread limit. Or I might play $0.10 small bet, $0.25 big bet fixed limit. Three or four bets max.

Blinds of $0.05 / $0.10. Or maybe no blinds at all, but a dead quarter posted by the dealer to call his / her own game noting that some dealers choice games are not always played with blinds.

 

[horseshoez]

I’m facing a little bit of the same situation. You’re probably your own advocate and you’ll eventually know how to solve this mini jolt in your home game. Quite simply put, there’s really only two ways of going about it without changing denoms, blinds, etc

1) You bring it back down to what it was if the people attending along with the social atmosphere is very important to you.

or

2) You split the group into two mixed groups. The first being the original group minus those who aren’t comfortable with the stakes. The second group obviously being those who want to have a “quieter” game.

Personally I think the first one is the better one for the sake of keeping it social. The less solution disruptive is often better.

 

[Beakertwang]

I find limit double board and other circus games are a fun way to engage a group of players without anyone losing a ton of cash.

 

[JustinInMN]

We originally started at $20 buyins but a few guys have turned into real poker fans and enjoy casinos and card rooms.

Now its multiple $40 bullets and some nights several people have won or lost over $200. 10x what we agreed to when we started up.

I think the question has to be asked, how did this happen? Were there no rules on max buy ins?

 

[JustinInMN]

I thought maybe limiting the buyin and adding a 10 minute timeout or something if you bust.

Okay, just read this. This implies that you are considering a buy in cap, meaning you didn't have one.

Imo, that's a must if you are going to stick with no limit betting. Be firm, the table cap is 20, allow players to add on up to 20 between hands. I think that solves all your problems. This probably spiraled out of control because when the first players that wanted to do 40 did so, they weren't told "no" and that's how it escalated. You add this rule and stick to it, most of the problems go away.

My rule of thumb is the max buy in in no limit should be about where your average player is comfortable buying 3 times. If that number is 60, then make the max buy in 20. If it's 30, make the max 10. (Personally, I think a 10 max is plenty for .05-.05 blind games )

 

[Caveman]

Ok I prevented this problem by playing dealers choice. The blinds .10/.20 were only used for holdem and omaha. The raises were capped at .50 x 3 for the flop, the turn and the river. So it didn’t matter how much the buyin was all the games had the same betting limit. Multiple different poker games used so this allows players with different economic backgrounds to stay all night. Yes this is all family and friends and we have kept it this way for 5 years....no problems.

 

[Ethan]

My rule of thumb is the max buy in in no limit should be about where your average player is comfortable buying 3 times. If that number is 60, then make the max buy in 20. If it's 30, make the max 10. (Personally, I think a 10 max is plenty for .05-.05 blind games )

I don’t mean to thread jack but just want to say I’ll be trying this out for sure.

 

[tabletalker7]

My rule of thumb is the max buy in in no limit should be about where your average player is comfortable buying 3 times. If that number is 60, then make the max buy in 20. If it's 30, make the max 10. (Personally, I think a 10 max is plenty for .05-.05 blind games )

My house rules clearly states max buy in is 200 BB.

 

[Eloe2000]

We had a similar situation when some new guys came in playing hot. The thing is that our game is a social game. We play .25/.25 at home but are out at the casino the next night for 2/4. But there is a time and a place for everything.

Have a private conversation with each of the heavy hitters separately and explain that “this game” is social and there play is nudging out others.

Try playing tournaments

 

[JustinInMN]

My house rules clearly states max buy in is 200 BB.

Good. I like to think about the 3 buy in rule because I don't want to lose players if they get felted early in the night taking one shot. It helps keep games from breaking early.

Most of my players are fine with 150-200 being the worst case scenario, so I typically spread 0.50-0.50 with a 60 max.

I also have a family game that I had kept at 10 max until very recently we went to 20 max and blinds of 0.10-0.20. (plus some ante stud games.). Some players still buy for 10 which is fine too.

 

[Josh Kifer]

Tournaments are the way we stopped stake creep. You can allow rebuys or give out rebuy chips to even manage that. It took 13 years for us to finally play 1/2 seriously. Now we hit 2/5 OMG.....

 

[JustinInMN]

Good. I like to think about the 3 buy in rule because I don't want to lose players if they get felted early in the night taking one shot.

Not to be misunderstood, this isn't a limit, players can rebuy as many times as they want, I just want to estimate the point where all players are comfortable with at least 3 buy ins.

 

[tabletalker7]

Good. I like to think about the 3 buy in rule because I don't want to lose players if they get felted early in the night taking one shot. It helps keep games from breaking early.

Most of my players are fine with 150-200 being the worst case scenario, so I typically spread 0.50-0.50 with a 60 max.

I also have a family game that I had kept at 10 max until very recently we went to 20 max and blinds of 0.10-0.20. (plus some ante stud games.). Some players still buy for 10 which is fine too.

While my house rules states max buy in 200 BB, most of my players have asked me what buy in is appropriate. I tell them a number that equals 100 BB. I can't get a stud game going to save my life - all my games are either NLHE or PLO. We tried a PLO8 game once, but too much beer making figuring out who won what each hand a little too difficult. Not repeating that train wreck again.

 

[Schmendr1ck]

As others have already said, I like the fixed limit or spread limit options, and I also recommend to my players that they buy in for 1/3 of what they are comfortable losing in a session.

If your players really want big bet Hold'em, another option is to play pot limit pre-flop and no limit post-flop. That can help keep the deep pocketed players from blowing the rest of the table out of every pot.

 

[Darson]

As others have said, the simplest solution is to cap the buy-in at $20 and the rebuys either at $20 or half the big stack. Half the big stack may not work if the game goes on long so you could just have a flat cap.

But having heard that on a 5c/5c game the opening raise is 75c, perhaps you can take a cue from the Big Game and have pot limit pre-flop and no limit after.

With a $40 buy-in and 5c/5c blinds, people are sitting on a ton of blinds to it's no surprise that it's playing like a 25c/50c game. I have regularly played in a 25c/50c game where the initial max buy-in is $40. Yours should be $10 for the stakes you play.

 

[ReallyGoodUsername]

With a $40 buy-in and 5c/5c blinds, people are sitting on a ton of blinds to it's no surprise that it's playing like a 25c/50c game. I have regularly played in a 25c/50c game where the initial max buy-in is $40. Yours should be $10 for the stakes you play.

Great point @Darson. My home games a bit larger but before coming here we had the same problem of too high an initial buy-in for the stakes that we were willing to play. Lowering the buy-in lead to more action without people worrying about losing their whole bankroll for the night right away.