Do you have sons? Show them this..... (2 Viewers)

If marketing focus groups showed Gillette that running the same commercial, but with fart noises for every word, would give them an extra 1% market share, they would do it in a heartbeat.

I don't put a lot of stock in what companies are trying to market to me. There's always an angle and you have to take everything with a giant grain of salt.
 
I have to wonder if I posted differently in this thread instead, what the comments would have been.

So I got a call from my daughter's principle today to inform me that my 14 year old was sexually harassed at school today by a boy in one of her classes. My kid is a no nonsense, don't give me any drama type of kid, so she's blown it off, but admitted to being kinda creeped out, as it was a graphic sexual advance and she has to go to school with this knucklehead. Ironically I discussed with my three sons (15,13,9) earlier this week how to handle themselves when it comes to how they interact with girls. So please, if you have boys at home, have the discussion, as hard as it might be, and possibly save yourself, and the parents of a teen girl a phone call home from school, the police, and the humiliation and embarrassment that undoubtedly comes with that call.

Thank you to all who posted in this thread, who COMPLETELY missed the point of the OP - and instead decided to share your outrage/sensitivity/true colors over what was a genuine post that included a video with a sound message to fathers with sons. I truly hope that you don't have to deal with bullying, harassment, or worse.
 
I don't know how old your children are, or if they have their own phones, but I can tell you that unless you keep your kids in a cave - they are on or viewing all things social media.

10 and 8. No they don't have phones and won't be getting them.

My kids aren't on social media at all. As their Father, I don't allow it.

Sure, it would be much easier to simply throw my hands up and be lenient about it but I won't do that.
 
My question about this is this: what does being toxic (aka, being a terrible human) have to do with masculinity? The specificity of homing in on men is the part that bothers me. Imagine doing the same thing right now to a specific ethnicity, the female sex, or cats? Being an asshole has nothing to do with any of those categories, so tying masculinity and toxic together will give people the impression that one begets the other, and that is dead wrong.

So while I applaud the message of “stop being an asshole,” I can’t say I enjoyed the the focus on men. Yes, I understand it’s a razor company, but that doesn’t change the end result. Most masculine men are not assholes!
 
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My question about this is this: what does being toxic (aka, being a terrible human) have to do with masculinity? The specificity in homing in on men is the part that bothers me. Imagine doing the same thing right now to a specific ethnicity, the female sex, or cats? Being an asshole has nothing to do with any of those categories, so tying masculinity and toxic together will give people the impression that one begets the other, and that is dead wrong.

So while I applaud the message of “stop being an asshole,” I can’t say I enjoyed the the focus on men. Yes, I understand it’s a razor company, but that doesn’t change the end result. Most masculine men are not assholes!

This is how I feel about it.

You can look at studies on bullying and it becomes clear that the bullying girls engage in is much more "toxic" than that of what boys do.

And the main tool girls use to bully? Social media.
 
It's possible to think what happened to OP's daughter is terrible and that the boy/man should face harsh punishment, while at the same time not liking that commercial and or the social movement it's capitalizing on.

It's possible to raise a boy to become a good man without giving him guilt.

It's possible to not like rape and sexual assault and to not like #MeToo

It's possible to like black people and not like "Black Lives Matter"

It's possible that holding boys to girls standards in class rooms will have negative consequences on boys development.

It's possible to be a good man/father/husband and not give up your hobbies and passions.

It's possible men are scared of, and repressing their own masculinity because its been conflated with only negative traits in recent times.

This commercial/topic brings up a lot of stuff and to have that automatically connected to another man's assaulted daughter, is a bit :nailbite: :(

I don't think it's that appropriate to attach such a personal story to a current, hot, polarizing, politically dividing commercial. It was absolutely inevitable that this was going to lead to a political discussion.
 
It's possible to think what happened to OP's daughter is terrible and that the boy/man should face harsh punishment, while at the same time not liking that commercial and or the social movement it's capitalizing on.

Absolutely this.

Craig, I'm truly sorry for what happened to your daughter.

No one deserves to be harassed. People definitely need to look out for each other. If you see something, say something. Be respectful of others, and be a good and decent human being.

That's what I teach my boys, but I do not need a corporation with a shady past to give me a hollow lecture about masculinity just so it can increase it's market share.

To me their message comes off more like this:
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However, this new wave of advertising is actually misrepresenting the companies values.
A lot of comments in the realm of "companies are money-grubbing punks that only do things to make an extra buck." While I understand this is the unfortunate reality of many corporations (and capitalism as a whole), I also question whether anyone knows the CEO or leadership team at Gillette. Per the quoted text, do you actually know what the company's values are? Has anyone even considered that perhaps this commercial IS representing the company's values? I think it's a bit presumptuous to claim the ad doesn't represent the company's values without actually knowing the company's values.
 
A lot of comments in the realm of "companies are money-grubbing punks that only do things to make an extra buck." While I understand this is the unfortunate reality of many corporations (and capitalism as a whole), I also question whether anyone knows the CEO or leadership team at Gillette. Per the quoted text, do you actually know what the company's values are? Has anyone even considered that perhaps this commercial IS representing the company's values? I think it's a bit presumptuous to claim the ad doesn't represent the company's values without actually knowing the company's values.

If you want to see what a companies values are you dont ask them you watch what they do. Words are cheap.
I dont know if you read the thread but putting a bunch of girls in lycra body suits while in their other ad decrying catcalling tells me what I need to know.
You can go back and watch their ads from the 90s too same shit.
 
10 and 8. No they don't have phones and won't be getting them.

My kids aren't on social media at all. As their Father, I don't allow it.

Sure, it would be much easier to simply throw my hands up and be lenient about it but I won't do that.
I applaud your passion and wish you luck. I don't know how you'll do it, maybe you're in a small town and your boys can walk everywhere, but I couldn't imagine my older kids not having a phone. Between the odd school hours (tutoring, sports, clubs) for three different schools, 4 different practices a week, and them going out with friends - it would be very difficult to manage without the ability to instantly connect. Are there risks with this? Yup. Kids are brutal and it allows 24/7 "cyber bullying", allows them to post dumb shit they could later regret, and also distracts them from the world around them. You have two, so that's easier, and they are younger - so I'm curious to hear if your opinion and stance change as they get older. We made them wait until 7th grade, and even that was very unpopular - made for some very emotional exchanges. At the end of the day, I'm glad my kids have a phone for MY own peace of mind and the convenience it brings to managing having 4 active (and social) kids.
 
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I applaud your passion and wish you luck. I don't know how you'll do it, maybe you're in a small town and your boys can walk everywhere, but I couldn't imagine my older kids not having a phone. Between the odd school hours (tutoring, sports, clubs) for three different schools, 4 different practices a week, and them going out with friends - it would be very difficult to manage without the ability to instantly connect. Are there risks with this? Yup. Kids are brutal and it allows 24/7 "cyber bullying", allows them to post dumb shit they could later regret, and also distracts them from the world around them. You have two, so that's easier, and they are younger - so I'm curious to hear if your opinion and stance change as they get older. We made them wait until 7th grade, and even that was very unpopular - made for some very emotional exchanges. At the end of the day, I'm glad my kids have a phone for MY own peace of mind and the convenience it brings to managing having 4 active (and social) kids.

They both know it isnt an option until 9th grade.

Social media is the most harmful for kids prior to that time . Especially during middle school and especially for girls.

Again, I have no illusions it will be easy.
 
Cell phones have only been out for about 10, maybe 15 years now. We did just fine in school and with after school activities without instantly connecting to our friends and family. Just sayin.... I’m not totally against kids having phones at a certain age but I wouldn’t say they need them either. Just my two cents.
 
Cell phones have only been out for about 10, maybe 15 years now. We did just fine in school and with after school activities without instantly connecting to our friends and family. Just sayin.... I’m not totally against kids having phones at a certain age but I wouldn’t say they need them either. Just my two cents.
I completely agree, to a point. I can remember plenty of times sitting at the school because practice was over early and no one was available to pick me up. 25 years ago my coach would just give me a ride - they can't do that anymore. When it comes to kids and cell phones - to each their own. I believe that they are beneficial to the operation of our family unit, and that benefit outweighs any reason to restrict them.
 
If you truly believe that, that's fine.

Many parents allow their kids to have phones because it makes THEIR lives easier, not the kids.
 
Phones/media and kids is a hard one. We have 2 toddlers so I cant say I have all the answers. I def. want to limit exposure as much as is reasonable.
 
The gillette add is absolute cancer and used to divide genders.

If you want your boys to be raised to be uneducated total cucks, show them the gillette add.
 
So I got a call from my daughter's principle today to inform me that my 14 year old was sexually harassed at school today by a boy in one of her classes. My kid is a no nonsense, don't give me any drama type of kid, so she's blown it off, but admitted to being kinda creeped out, as it was a graphic sexual advance and she has to go to school with this knucklehead. Anyway it made me instantly think of the recent "The Best Men Can Be" ad that Gillette released. Ironically I showed this to my three sons (15,13,9) earlier this week and used it as an opportunity to discuss how to handle themselves when it comes to how they interact with girls. So please, if you have boys at home, show them this video, have the discussion, and possibly save yourself, and the parents of a teen girl a phone call home from school, the police, and the humiliation and embarrassment that undoubtedly comes with that call.


The Best Men Can Be

One of the problems with society (at least in the USA) is that we do not properly teach our boys how to be men. They grow believing the 3 lies of false masculinity. They base their worth on athletic ability, sexual prowess, financial success none of which are requirements to be men. These are not my ideas but I fully agree with them. They are the standards authored by Joe Ehrmann. He wrote Season of Life and is a valued public speaker. Oh yeah he was an all pro for the Baltimore Colts back in the day. He autographed my book when I went to see him many years ago. This is what every young boy could benefit from.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Ehrmann


A measure of a man is the relationships he builds in a lifetime.

Pick this one up at about 5:25 for a quick summary
 
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;After reading the comments about this ad, I decided to really watch it and break it down to see if I could understand why some people might think this is an "attack on men/masculinity/etc" vs a general "do better" public service announcement. Instead of breaking it down second-by-second, I looked at the overall themes:

  1. Bullying (illustrated by the boy being chased by the large group of teens, the social media attacks, the BBQ)
  2. Sexual harassment / treatment of women (illustrated by the board room scene, the pool party, street scene, b&w cartoon)

The "bullying" one is interesting, and the scene that seems to be causing the biggest issue is the BBQ scene ("Boys will be boys.") I don't think anyone would argue that the scenes of the young boy being chased by the "mob" would be behavior that should be considered acceptable; and I don't think most people would have issues with 2 kids playing roughly with each other. However, there's a key point (0:33 of the commercial) where one of the kids cries in pain and, when we see them again, he's on the ground with the other kid standing over him still pushing him. The kid's cry is quick, subtle, and easily overlooked -- and when the commercial returns to them, he's not crying or showing he's in pain or distress. I think that's the disconnect: I think most men would step in if one kid was obviously getting injured, hurt, or showing he didn't want to rough-house anymore; the commercial never showed this with any certainty.

I don't think the ad does a great job of properly addressing the sexual harassment argument -- showing a couple stereotypical behaviors doesn't really get to the core of the issue; however, I think adding it lent to the message of "what was thought to be ok in the past may not actually have been acceptable" and "do we want our kids to think that is acceptable behavior". I've got a daughter heading off to university in about 1.5 years, and I'm thankful this discussion is occurring now rather than later.

Does the ad say "all boys / men are bad"? Hell no.
Does it say certain behavior is "bad / toxic"? I think it tries to show, within the limits of a 90-second commercial, that we should all try to eliminate those behaviors (how you do it is up to you).
 
As for the argument that the message means less because it is told in an ad by Gillette...

  • Most companies are in business for profits. There's always a bottom line impact to anything a corporation does although, in some cases, it's a brand-building "qualitative" return. Delta Airlines paid to open the MLK Museum in Atlanta this weekend, because it's been closed due to the shutdown. They'll see no direct profits from this, but their reputation will be positively impacted... however, I'd rather corporations still do these type of things rather than focus 100% on the financial bottom line. Gillette could have just created another product ad hawking the latest 11-blade razor... however, they've spent money on an ad discussing a societal topic and, for what it's worth, has sparked a conversation. Frankly, if this ad causes one person to change how they act, or what they teach their children, then it's worth it -- because you never know if that kid now treats my daughter with respect, or doesn't bully my son, or what have you.

  • Gillette has had "race girls" with their brand on their asses... however, one of the key messages of the ad is that people change and that behavior that was acceptable in the past may not be acceptable now. That picture appears to be from 2011 (deducing from the sign in the background)... if Gillette does that now, 8 years later and after posting this ad, then I'll be all for calling them out... however, just like you don't necessarily want to be judged for things you did 8-10-20 years ago, it's not necessarily fair to judge corporations that can also change vision and values.
 
I follow the UFC pretty close and bet on the fights. Whoever made this....

 

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