Cash Game Do players take micro stakes games seriously? (1 Viewer)

[DanTheMan]

Just a question for people that run or play in micro stakes games regularly ($.10 blinds). Do the people you play with play so loose that it ruins the game, because it's so cheap to just play every hand/call any bet? I ask because I want to start a regular game and it would be easier to convince some of my cheaper friends to join in if it were smaller stakes.

 

[Marc Hedrick]

In my limited experience, players will take anything with any amount of money relatively seriously.

Now that doesn't mean your new to poker friends won't call every hand, they just don't know better. But if they like money and/or winning they'll figure it out.

Even a 10NL game can have a couple hundred on the table --thats not nothing.

 

[ekricket]

Just a question for people that run or play in micro stakes games regularly ($.10 blinds). Do the people you play with play so loose that it ruins the game, because it's so cheap to just play every hand/call any bet? I ask because I want to start a regular game and it would be easier to convince some of my cheaper friends to join in if it were smaller stakes.

If the people are so cheap they have to have low stakes then they won’t be splashing around. If they are then they have more money to burn than you think.

I just played in a .5/.10 game over the weekend with a $2 cap on betting. We rarely saw the cap and bets were reasonable for the pot all night.

Keep in mind that new or inexperienced players think every hand of poker ends in someone saying “all in”, like it’s a requirement.

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

Just a question for people that run or play in micro stakes games regularly ($.10 blinds). Do the people you play with play so loose that it ruins the game, because it's so cheap to just play every hand/call any bet? I ask because I want to start a regular game and it would be easier to convince some of my cheaper friends to join in if it were smaller stakes.

Do it. People are competitive and will want to win. You may have a few maniacs, but most of my players fall into cheap and new players and they loved the tiny blinds. Big loser walks away losing 30 or 40.

 

[JustinInMN]

Just a question for people that run or play in micro stakes games regularly ($.10 blinds). Do the people you play with play so loose that it ruins the game, because it's so cheap to just play every hand/call any bet? I ask because I want to start a regular game and it would be easier to convince some of my cheaper friends to join in if it were smaller stakes.

I've played in nitty 2/4 limit games, and crazy loose 20/40 games. This common theme that more money = tighter players is pretty much bulls***.

 

[chipsandcookies]

Keep in mind that new or inexperienced players think every hand of poker ends in someone saying “all in”, like it’s a requirement.

I can only agree to that.
When we play a 5c/10c game almost everyone want to at least see the flop....any someone will hit a pair or two pair with something stupid like 2 / 6 offsuit

 

[JustinInMN]

I can only agree to that.
When we play a 5c/10c game almost everyone want to at least see the flop....any someone will hit a pair or two pair with something stupid like 2 / 6 offsuit

I know people that only want to play $20 buy in for cash games, but still keep the blinds at 25¢-50¢. So yes, they are always playing all ins.

 

[Machine]

Just a question for people that run or play in micro stakes games regularly ($.10 blinds). Do the people you play with play so loose that it ruins the game, because it's so cheap to just play every hand/call any bet? I ask because I want to start a regular game and it would be easier to convince some of my cheaper friends to join in if it were smaller stakes.

I think it depends on the crowd, you can start with .05/.1 if its limps every hand, you can up the blinds .25/.5

I can only agree to that.
When we play a 5c/10c game almost everyone want to at least see the flop....any someone will hit a pair or two pair with something stupid like 2 / 6 offsuit

you need to change the game to omaha =)

 

[Rome]

Just a question for people that run or play in micro stakes games regularly ($.10 blinds). Do the people you play with play so loose that it ruins the game, because it's so cheap to just play every hand/call any bet? I ask because I want to start a regular game and it would be easier to convince some of my cheaper friends to join in if it were smaller stakes.

The group I found after recently moving just plays microstates (5c/10c).

Typically 7 or 8 handed. Seems 3 of us would prefer higher stakes, but those 3 also play the most "seriously". There often feels like there's no isolation raise potential when 4 people will call a 3x almost every time. So you have to be raising 5-6x to even have a chance at that. I think if we switched to .25/.25 blinds, and a typical preflop raise was to .75, it would force a more serious game for those players who only buy in for $20 and want to see most flops.

My goal with this group is to get to .25/.25 as a result.

 

[4SUMERZ]

I have a regular cash game, .25/.25 blinds $20.00 buy in. We play for 4.5 hours. Dealers choice between Hold'em, Pineapple and Omaha.
We are all competetive, but rarely does anyone go all in unless they have a low stack. We enjoy each others company. No one goes home broke, or goes home rich.
We have fun. Most games, we have 3-5 top ups/buy ins.
We also play online with the same group...pretty much the same results.

 

[Mojo1312]

The group I found after recently moving just plays microstates (5c/10c).

Typically 7 or 8 handed. Seems 3 of us would prefer higher stakes, but those 3 also play the most "seriously". There often feels like there's no isolation raise potential when 4 people will call a 3x almost every time. So you have to be raising 5-6x to even have a chance at that. I think if we switched to .25/.25 blinds, and a typical preflop raise was to .75, it would force a more serious game for those players who only buy in for $20 and want to see most flops.

My goal with this group is to get to .25/.25 as a result.

Based on my experience, 6x is standard. 3x is seen as a pot sweetener.

 

[detroitdad]

I occasionally will host a micro stakes cash game for family. I do not take it serious at all. Any nickel dime game I've dropped 60 to 100 bucks

 

[Rome]

Based on my experience, 6x is standard. 3x is seen as a pot sweetener.

That hasn't been my home game experience, but everything is group dependent. Most home games I've played have been .25/.50 and .50/1, where 3x is standard and 10x is a typical 3-bet. I think 200BB entry on microstakes combined with a general demeanor of always wanting to see the flop is simply too deep and loose for my taste in general. But I'm in a smaller town where there aren't a lot of games going on it seems.

If you raise to 6x preflop, there's typically comments of "geez, quite the big raise", and some seem slightly peeved they can't cheaply see the flop. So it requires a 5-6x to isolate with strong hands, but it also leads to being seen as way too aggressive and playing over the stakes in this group. So its an odd balance between wanting to play poker and just going with the group flow to have fun and be social.

With $20 buy-ins and microstakes, .10/.20 (or .25/.25 if your lowest chips are quarters) would be the right stakes for more "serious/proper" play, as least for my group. 100BB isn't just a round number, it seems a fairly magical starting stack size to regulate looseness of the game in my experience.

IMHO, if you already have a group you play with and want a more "serious" game, the game should be set based on a buy-in size that the average player in your game would be bummed to lose 2-3 of but it wouldn't hurt them, and tripling up would be fun but not change their week. Whatever that stake is for your group, make that the buy-in, and then set blinds to have 100BB based off that buyin.

 

[Mojo1312]

IMHO, if you already have a group you play with and want a more "serious" game, the game should be set based on a buy-in size that the average player in your game would be bummed to lose 2-3 of but it wouldn't hurt them, and tripling up would be fun but not change their week. Whatever that stake is for your group, make that the buy-in, and then set blinds to have 100BB based off that buyin.

Good advice @DanTheMan.

 

[SteveEH]

the game should be set based on a buy-in size that the average player in your game would be bummed to lose 2-3 of but it wouldn't hurt them, and tripling up would be fun but not change their week. Whatever that stake is for your group, make that the buy-in, and then set blinds to have 100BB based off that buyin.

This.

It is important to ensure your game is sustainable, long term. Ask your players how much they're comfortable losing in one night, set the stakes on the median, and ask players to bring 3 buy ins for the night.

There will be people at all stakes that won't take the game seriously, and you have to adjust your strategy appropriately.

 

[JMC9389]

I host a 0.05/0.10 dealers choice night about 3 or 4 times a year and never had an issue with donkeys shoving or folding because the stakes were too low. For a couple of my players they can only afford $40 in a given night because of other expenses. That, and we've all been playing against each other for years. The trash talking and bragging rights is enough for everyone to take it seriously.

 

[JMC9389]

I can only agree to that.
When we play a 5c/10c game almost everyone want to at least see the flop....any someone will hit a pair or two pair with something stupid like 2 / 6 offsuit

@horseshoez

 

[shorticus]

In my experience smaller stakes will tend to be a little more loose and talkative. People seeing lots of flops having a good time or whatever. However, if said game gets extremely deep and expensive, this game will get quiet, tense, and more serious.


Basically, in my opinion, stakes matter when the amount of money on the table becomes relevant to the people seated.

 

[JMC9389]

That hasn't been my home game experience, but everything is group dependent. Most home games I've played have been .25/.50 and .50/1, where 3x is standard and 10x is a typical 3-bet. I think 200BB entry on microstakes combined with a general demeanor of always wanting to see the flop is simply too deep and loose for my taste in general. But I'm in a smaller town where there aren't a lot of games going on it seems.

If you raise to 6x preflop, there's typically comments of "geez, quite the big raise", and some seem slightly peeved they can't cheaply see the flop. So it requires a 5-6x to isolate with strong hands, but it also leads to being seen as way too aggressive and playing over the stakes in this group. So its an odd balance between wanting to play poker and just going with the group flow to have fun and be social.

With $20 buy-ins and microstakes, .10/.20 (or .25/.25 if your lowest chips are quarters) would be the right stakes for more "serious/proper" play, as least for my group. 100BB isn't just a round number, it seems a fairly magical starting stack size to regulate looseness of the game in my experience.

IMHO, if you already have a group you play with and want a more "serious" game, the game should be set based on a buy-in size that the average player in your game would be bummed to lose 2-3 of but it wouldn't hurt them, and tripling up would be fun but not change their week. Whatever that stake is for your group, make that the buy-in, and then set blinds to have 100BB based off that buyin.

This.

100 BB starting stacks is the sweet spot. However, anything below that and it delves into a shove fest very quickly, especially with mixed games.

Playing games like Scarney, Omaha, Big O, Scrotum, etc are best played deep stacked and I would advise 200 BB starting stacks. I've played in 0.25/0.25 stakes with these games and have seen $500+ pots.

Even my 0.05/0.10 game once saw an $80ish pot.

 

[horseshoez]

@horseshoez

Hahahahahahhahahahahaha ok now that I’m done laughing, please don’t insult my hand like that. It’s done some nice favors for me. Matter of fact, the other night, my friend and I both thought we were gonna stack each other on the river. Little did we know…

 

[Kentucky]

I can’t stress this enough - some people just want to see flops and try to make a hand. Doesn’t really matter the stakes, it’s about the player. I’ve had more respect for opens at free-roll tournaments, than some home games because the players are more experienced.

The only thing I’d say about the stakes for less experienced players is they also tend to see the absolute value of a bet rather than the pot odds, so they might try and hit a draw “because it’s only a dollar”, or whatever. That said most can also see a dollar is a tenth of a buy-in.

 

[natumes]

The hard part with building a cash game I've found is that the stakes need to be relevant for everyone there. I had a few players that were ruining my game early on because the money didn't matter and they would play any 2 cards, despite being decent poker players when playing higher stakes games. If somebody gets bored and playing a hand is "chump change" they start playing loose and aggressive and it is honestly less fun for everyone.

So lowering the stakes to convince some people with tighter pockets to join is just going to be a bad time for them. A tournament with no rebuy does solve this problem though. The stakes are fixed and even if it's not significant money for a more serious player, they still have to play correctly or the night is over for them quickly as they can't just add on. You won't keep those more serious players for long though, or they will probably complain about the buy in etc. Gotta find a balance that works for your pool of players.

 

[Bacon Dad]

The hard part with building a cash game I've found is that the stakes need to be relevant for everyone there. I had a few players that were ruining my game early on because the money didn't matter and they would play any 2 cards, despite being decent poker players when playing higher stakes games. If somebody gets bored and playing a hand is "chump change" they start playing loose and aggressive and it is honestly less fun for everyone.

So lowering the stakes to convince some people with tighter pockets to join is just going to be a bad time for them. A tournament with no rebuy does solve this problem though. The stakes are fixed and even if it's not significant money for a more serious player, they still have to play correctly or the night is over for them quickly as they can't just add on. You won't keep those more serious players for long though, or they will probably complain about the buy in etc. Gotta find a balance that works for your pool of players.

Too true what you say. If you did limit games for microstakes for newbies, wouldn’t that help?

 

[Marc Hedrick]

I had a few players that were ruining my game early on because the money didn't matter and they would play any 2 cards, despite being decent poker players when playing higher stakes games. If somebody gets bored and playing a hand is "chump change" they start playing loose and aggressive and it is honestly less fun for everyone.

I think your definition of ruining the game is quite different from mine. I can understand why this would be frustrating for new players, but you can't really control how others play and neither can they. If they want to learn poker, teach them different strategies like how to play back at a maniac. They'll have loads of fun when they start winning, and end up winners at bigger games!

 

[natumes]

I think your definition of ruining the game is quite different from mine. I can understand why this would be frustrating for new players, but you can't really control how others play and neither can they. If they want to learn poker, teach them different strategies like how to play back at a maniac. They'll have loads of fun when they start winning, and end up winners at bigger games!

I mean ruining in the sense of half the players told me to stop messaging them about games unless we were playing 2/5, and another chunk saying they weren't interested in playing anymore. I had to rebuild almost from scratch. It's extremely difficult to blend players who should be playing drastically different stakes, in my experience.

Too true what you say. If you did limit games for microstakes for newbies, wouldn’t that help?

I have to host microstakes games with a completely different group of players. I can invite only a couple of my regs that can play down, and usually because a spouse/gf is also playing. From that group if someone shows more interest, I guide them on how to learn more and invite them to my regular game.

 

[DanTheMan]

I think I'm going to give a $.10/.10 game a try. If it gets too sloppy at least it'll teach some of my non poker buddies that it's unwise to play every hand. Hopefully I can switch it up to a $.25/.25 game eventually.

 

[louBdub]

Host multiple games.

I do a once a month tournament, it’s a season championship points game. $40 freeze out, earn points, make the final table in June.

I also have 10c/20c cash tables at random, funsies table, it can get weird

And every other month I have a big boy table, min buy is $100 / max $500 - this is the poker players table. Everyone turns into DNegs and Ivey, cute table checks, etc

This has netted me with a club that’s grown to 6 hosts (all with their own flavor/game) and currently 22 members, all very active roaming the many tables. It’s been a blast!

 

[MrCatPants]

I mean ruining in the sense of half the players told me to stop messaging them about games unless we were playing 2/5, and another chunk saying they weren't interested in playing anymore. I had to rebuild almost from scratch. It's extremely difficult to blend players who should be playing drastically different stakes, in my experience.


I have to host microstakes games with a completely different group of players. I can invite only a couple of my regs that can play down, and usually because a spouse/gf is also playing. From that group if someone shows more interest, I guide them on how to learn more and invite them to my regular game.

My original game "broke" for these same reasons. Had to morph it - pick a wheelhouse level of stakes and recruit players who fit.

 

[tabletalker7]

My 5¢/10¢ game is more about bragging rights than cash.

 

[allforcharity]

Those who really want to learn the game will take it seriously no matter what the stakes. If I played micro I'd probably get a lot more practice.